Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Covid

Mumsnet doesn't verify the qualifications of users. If you have medical concerns, please consult a healthcare professional.

Original poster

Not allowed to do my sales job until fully vaccinated

388 replies

VioletUltraViolet · 14/12/2021 10:57

I delayed getting my vaccination due to a genuine fear of vaccines and having already gotten Covid antibodies from having the virus. I have decided to get the vaccine now because I just want this crap over and done with and I accept my role in getting society back to a level of normality.

I am booked for my first dose today at 14:30 and second dose is booked for 9th feb 2022.

I am an estate agent. My work sent a group message to say that any unvaccinated staff can not conduct any face to face appointments until they are fully vaccinated. This means no opportunity to earn commission by listing properties or selling houses, so my salary will essentially drop from roughly 43k to 24k. This is because I earn so much from doing the appointments and 24k is my basic. I have a daughter to support and I know everyone is going to say it’s my fault for delaying my vaccination but I just can’t believe this forced vaccination is spilling out in to non medical non clinical work.

For context, I booked my vaccine last week before I knew about the work changes.

What’re people’s thoughts on this kind of approach? My vaccinated colleagues are shocked by this too.

OP posts:
Kshhuxnxk · 14/12/2021 12:48

I'm not interested in meeting andEA who is or isn't fully vaccinated. I am however interested in meeting an EA who has had a lft before my appointment.

Lovelydovey · 14/12/2021 12:49

We need to separate out what people might think is morally right - which might depend on which side of the vaccine debate you are on - and whether new requirements which take time to achieve imposes with no notice are acceptable under employment law. They are not the same thing.

Though it sounds like the fact that you have worked for them for 2 years and this is only affecting commission (which is never guaranteed) are complicating factors in the employment law consideration. You need legal advice not a mumsnet pile on based on what people think is morally right.

Sonex · 14/12/2021 12:50

er hang on so you will miss a little over a month of omission, over what must surely be a quiet time for estate agent sales anyway? That's one and a bit months without much commission isnt' it which id expect anyone in a sales based role to be able to absorb (I am too and always earn zero commission over Xmas/NY and in August). How will that bring your annual income down from 43K to 24K?

I am with your employers also, they are running a business and most people don't want to come into contact with unvaccinated people if they can help it. If I was selling my house I would ask that the estate agents showing people round and in my house all the time were vaccinated and I would choose a different estate agent if they didn't seem to be taking that seriously.

You could have had the vaccine earlier before this policy change and addressed the irrational fear of vaccines - you're an estate agent, not a doctor or scientist, why didnt you discuss with your GP before now?

I suspect you could probably get out of this due to some sort of breach of contract, but I don't think you should as that would surely be career (and commission) limiting.

luinagreine · 14/12/2021 12:52

@VioletUltraViolet

Also, I have been in many houses where I have turned up to meet with people who have been vaccinated and they then proceed to call me the next day and inform me they are positive for Covid. They didn’t think to tell me they were symptomatic until they had it confirmed by a PCR test and I had already been in their house! This has happened 3 times, each time I have isolated and got a PCR test and every time it’s been negative, which would prove I do have immunity. Either way I will be getting vaccinated but I find it interesting how long my natural immunity has lasted. I got Covid in February this year and my last contact (close contact) with someone with Covid was a month ago so it does seem to hold up.
It doesn't prove anything except that you are in regular contact with covid positive people. In light of this I would say it is even less surprising that your employers are looking for their staff to be vaccinated.

Where I live you get both vaccines within 3 weeks. I would look and find if there is a way you can do this.

friendlycat · 14/12/2021 12:52

I think there really are quite a lot of companies instigating this from what I am hearing from various people. Other countries are also doing the same as well.

I really don't know the legal side though regarding the amount of notice you have been given and taking you down to the basic pay level with no chance of earning commission. That does seem tough but as you say you have spoken to ACAS and under the two year period your rights as an employee are limited.

I have sympathy I really do and am glad that you have booked vaccines etc. But this has been in the news a lot, as said other companies in other countries are/have already implementing this, and it would have been prudent to think of these factors earlier. I don't think it's a complete "bolt out of the blue".

HeyDugeesCakeBadge · 14/12/2021 12:53

This is absolutely not legal as far as employment law goes and although we are in unchartered waters I would definitely challenge this OP. this hasn't been tested in court yet so could go either way but we need people to stand up and challenge this clearly discriminatory practice - they absolutely cannot change terms and conditions without consultation.

Comefromaway · 14/12/2021 12:53

*But it's not spreading amongst fully vaccinated staff who have had a booster jab.

That's the whole point of Boris telling everyone to get their boosters.*

No, it's to stop people getting seriously ill/Boris being totally unscientific/panic inducing. Boosters are not in question here.

Cherrytart23 · 14/12/2021 12:54

You can get 2nd on after 4 weeks at a walk in vacs centre.

Leftbutcameback · 14/12/2021 12:55

I feel this is unfair, without giving you time to remedy the situation. In the meantime LFTs everyday are a good mitigation. You should be given 3 months to get yours done.

User983756 · 14/12/2021 12:55

Even the care home staff got some notice

NowEvenBetter · 14/12/2021 13:01

Choices have consequences. It’s a good thing than the unvaxxed are excluded, don’t want to participate in doing the bare minimum for society? Cool. Off you fuck! (Not you, since you’re choosing to get the vaccine)
Can’t have been that much of a huge shock, do you follow current events?

marti76 · 14/12/2021 13:04

So are they checking customers vaccine status if it's really all about safety? What about the safety of staff if they have to deal with unvaccinated customers?

JanisMoplin · 14/12/2021 13:04

You need a lawyer, as pp said.

I am struggling to feel sympathetic given all of us don't particularly like get repeated vaccines either, but we do. Are you afraid of all vaccines or just this one? Because I had to provide proof of my TB vaccine and several other vaccines to enter the UK. I don't think there would have been much sympathy if I said I was scared of them.

luckylavender · 14/12/2021 13:06

No surprise really

Scandisaurus · 14/12/2021 13:07

The lack of notice is a shock.

So was Omicron, it’s spreading fast and quick action is needed. I’m with your employer on this, you are putting your clients at high risk by not being fully vaccinated. I think it is something you should have thought was possible though reading the news, especially if your income is so important to you and your child.

caz198917 · 14/12/2021 13:08

It's ridiculous that they are saying people need to be vaccinated. I am however every one I know who caught Covid has been double jabbed. It's absurd the restrictions they are putting on you!

Scandisaurus · 14/12/2021 13:09

Your colleagues obviously were ahead of you, good for them in this case!

JanisMoplin · 14/12/2021 13:11

@caz198917

It's ridiculous that they are saying people need to be vaccinated. I am however every one I know who caught Covid has been double jabbed. It's absurd the restrictions they are putting on you!
Anedotes aren't useful for public health decisions. The TB vaccine is not a guarantee against being infected either. I didn't drag out the data to show immigration though.
Coffeepot72 · 14/12/2021 13:11

I wish my employer would take this view - we have one anti vaxxer in our team, luckily our paths don’t cross very often but she’s allowed to waft around the building like everyone else, I think it’s appalling.

Scandisaurus · 14/12/2021 13:11

@Leftbutcameback

I feel this is unfair, without giving you time to remedy the situation. In the meantime LFTs everyday are a good mitigation. You should be given 3 months to get yours done.
3 months?! 😂 By then Omicron will have spread all over the world. We are talking days or a week.
ElftonWednesday · 14/12/2021 13:12

When did they change your terms and conditions of employment to require vaccination? Were employees consulted on the change to their terms and conditions? How much notice were you given that vaccination would be required? How long have you worked there?

They can't just change employee's terms and conditions of employment to their detriment at a whim.

It will be well worth you seeing a solicitor, getting them to write a letter to your employer to immediately reinstate your full duties.

I am pro vaccination but this is utter bollocks from a major chain of estate agents who clearly haven't taken proper legal advice themselves.

Flowerlane · 14/12/2021 13:12

So are all your customers asked about their vaccination status?? I bet not.

I would be looking for a new job while getting legal advice.

Frogsonglue · 14/12/2021 13:13

I think this is appalling, and am struggling to believe it's legal. Please seek advice from your union or ACAS.

tapeandglue · 14/12/2021 13:13

If given the choice of viewing properties with one agency that had a policy of mandatory vaccinations, and an agency that didn't, I know which one I'd go with, anytime. Even ignoring the risk assessment POV for staff, there's a clear commercial benefit in this to the company.

As you have pointed out, the number of people you come into close contact with has made you higher-risk of getting pinged. In fact, I know someone who was pinged after viewing a property...

I think you should be able to do viewings after being double jabbed, but have that revoked if you then take more than 6 months to get your booster, until you actually get the booster. That means potentially being out of work for three weeks, which over Christmas, in property? Nothing.

Go for Pfizer, and get your second after 21 days. A walk in centre that is GP-led will let you get this. You won't have to wait 8 weeks.

Comefromaway · 14/12/2021 13:13

@Coffeepot72

I wish my employer would take this view - we have one anti vaxxer in our team, luckily our paths don’t cross very often but she’s allowed to waft around the building like everyone else, I think it’s appalling.
The only way the anti vaxxers in my office might possible impact me is if they are required to self isolate or cath covid and become seriously ill. Other than that, it's up to them.