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Original poster

Increasing number of cases

379 replies

AutumnAlmanack · 18/10/2021 09:49

Could anyone please explain to me why it is that the UK is recording such a high number of daily cases, and rising, whereas the rest of Europe and elsewhere seem to be showing a steady decline in numbers? It really baffles me!

OP posts:
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20
Iggly · 19/10/2021 09:16

How much have low vaccination rates actually got to do with those who don’t want a jab and how much to do with how difficult it is to get a jab?

For example, my local town has no local centres and hasn’t had one since I was eligible for my vaccine. I have to travel 6 miles away - luckily I have a car - but there are only intermittent buses (it’s not like London) and no trains. A taxi would cost £40 - which is a lot for people who struggle financially.

I turned 40 last month. So they only locally prioritised the older population but after that, there’s nothing unless you travel out of town.

The assumption is that it’s vaccine hesitancy but I’m willing to bet it is only part of the story. Better that the government peddles that, than admits its infrastructure is poor after decades of cuts going back to beeching.

Florianus · 19/10/2021 09:33

There are stories in the press most days of people in hospital suffering badly from Covid-19, and saying that they wished they'd had the vaccine but that they "never got round to it". I don't know if that reflects on a lack of centres. Where I live, most of the GP hubs closed in July, so it is mainly the big NHS centres that are left.

MarshaBradyo · 19/10/2021 09:38

@Iggly

How much have low vaccination rates actually got to do with those who don’t want a jab and how much to do with how difficult it is to get a jab?

For example, my local town has no local centres and hasn’t had one since I was eligible for my vaccine. I have to travel 6 miles away - luckily I have a car - but there are only intermittent buses (it’s not like London) and no trains. A taxi would cost £40 - which is a lot for people who struggle financially.

I turned 40 last month. So they only locally prioritised the older population but after that, there’s nothing unless you travel out of town.

The assumption is that it’s vaccine hesitancy but I’m willing to bet it is only part of the story. Better that the government peddles that, than admits its infrastructure is poor after decades of cuts going back to beeching.

This was a question I had around schools v walk in centres.

And whether it would be a further barrier to shift it.

Iggly · 19/10/2021 09:42

Absolutely @MarshaBradyo

My dd has missed her flu jab because she was ill (waiting for a PCR ironically) and mop up clinics are again miles away. Luckily I can easily get the time off so we can get her there. But there’s no other option.

Ds doesn’t have his covid jab until mid November. His year group are currently dropping like flies with covid. We’ve gone from single digits to double digit cases in the space of a week. At this rate he may get covid and therefore unable to have the jab!

It’s really a huge huge issue. Vaccines have been made available in all sorts of places in other countries and that has helped massively.

MarshaBradyo · 19/10/2021 09:46

Yep I’ve been trying to do chicken pox vaccine (as dc quite old not to have it) and travelling to a place quite far is a big barrier. We’ll finally do it, this weekend, but not everyone can - for Covid vaccine I mean but similar thinking.

Any barrier reduces numbers, even if they are small. It’s one thing we got right for booking adult vaccines - so easy

Florianus · 19/10/2021 09:54

My dd has missed her flu jab because she was ill (waiting for a PCR ironically) and mop up clinics are again miles away.

Do you not have a pharmacy that does flu jabs? Boots, Superdrug and many of the independents offer them.

eeyore228 · 19/10/2021 09:57

People are living life again as if Covid doesn't exist, I've also met a number of people who actually believe that if they have covid there's no need to isolate! They think that if people are double jabbed then it's ok. No mask, no distancing and general acting like theres nothing wrong anymore.

Iggly · 19/10/2021 09:58

@Florianus

My dd has missed her flu jab because she was ill (waiting for a PCR ironically) and mop up clinics are again miles away.

Do you not have a pharmacy that does flu jabs? Boots, Superdrug and many of the independents offer them.

Not for children who are eligible through the school immunisation programme.
Florianus · 19/10/2021 10:22

@eeyore228

People are living life again as if Covid doesn't exist, I've also met a number of people who actually believe that if they have covid there's no need to isolate! They think that if people are double jabbed then it's ok. No mask, no distancing and general acting like theres nothing wrong anymore.
You might think that such people would have noticed that Colin Powell, former US secretary of state, died yesterday from Covid complications despite being double vaccinated.
Florianus · 19/10/2021 10:28

Not for children who are eligible through the school immunisation programme.

Oh, I didn't know that. Boots simply say that they won't vaccinate children under 12, implying that they will vaccinate those over that age.

Iggly · 19/10/2021 10:28

@Florianus

Not for children who are eligible through the school immunisation programme.

Oh, I didn't know that. Boots simply say that they won't vaccinate children under 12, implying that they will vaccinate those over that age.

My dd is 9!
Rabblesthecat · 19/10/2021 10:34

Colin Powell had lymphoma I believe so would have made him CEV in this country. He was not otherwise healthy and young

Florianus · 19/10/2021 11:40

My dd is 9!

Ah, nasal apray candidate in that case. Can your GP not supply the missing dose? It seems bizarre that you have to travel miles simply for a missed vaccination.

Florianus · 19/10/2021 11:41

@Rabblesthecat

Colin Powell had lymphoma I believe so would have made him CEV in this country. He was not otherwise healthy and young
True, but the point is that no vaccine is 100% effective, especially for those at risk.
Rabblesthecat · 19/10/2021 13:38

I know but my point is that the death of an 85 year old man with with a severe underlying condition is not something to be changing our way of life
For

Florianus · 19/10/2021 13:56

@Rabblesthecat

I know but my point is that the death of an 85 year old man with with a severe underlying condition is not something to be changing our way of life For
I'm not sure that the 3,200,000 of us in the UK who are in our eighties or older would necessarily agree - many of us have diabetes, osteoarthritis, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, dementia and so forth.

Worldwide, death from Covid-19 has, on average, removed 10 years from people's lives.

Geamhradh · 19/10/2021 14:02

@Rabblesthecat

I know but my point is that the death of an 85 year old man with with a severe underlying condition is not something to be changing our way of life For
Ah, the tired old "let them die so I don't have to wear a mask" trope. Where's your line? Because if you don't think there should be restrictions to protect an 85 year old man with underlying conditions, then either you ALSO think the same about the 14 year old cancer patient, or it's just the elderly you don't think are worth saving. Either way, your moral compass needs a good, long reset. If you can find it.
freckles20 · 19/10/2021 15:20

@Florianus out of interest, what measures would you like the non vulnerable younger and working population to take to protect the vulnerable?

Should schools remain closed? Should young people be unable to socialise, gain life experience and study? Should single people not be allowed to meet new people? Should we all stay at home, unable to earn (said as someone ineligible for government help during lockdown despite 20 years of paying higher tax rate)?

If workers are restricted how would you suggest taxes are collected to pay for healthcare, education, pensions etc.?

I do understand your point- but it is just not possible to keep the wheels of society turning with major long term restrictions.

cherin · 19/10/2021 16:22

No, but wearing masks is NOT a big deal. Come on. Get in the tube any give day, or at the pub. Crowds of people without any precaution. In my office we have entire groups of 15-20 people all gathered in small meeting rooms. It’d take a bit of common sense to say “split this group, half of it connects from their workstation” and halve the risk. But if you get in the room with a mask they look at you as if you were stuck in 2020 and living in a parallel universe.
In the rest of Europe which I’ve visited lately, everybody remembers to put the masks on. People wear them in the office when they’re not at their desk. Not a major deal. Cancelling ALL precautions without having school kids vaccinated, and with waning protection seems masochistic.

cherin · 19/10/2021 16:24

(The result? We have people getting sick - not just Covid but also the regular cold and flu- and the week after a big meeting half of the office is home again. Only they’re not working from home, they’re OFF sick. Not the most efficient use of people, IMO)

Florianus · 19/10/2021 16:27

@Florianus out of interest, what measures would you like the non vulnerable younger and working population to take to protect the vulnerable?

The sort of measure taken by Israel and other countries that have managed to keep infection rates far below that of the UK: a covid pass recording vaccination level. without which the person concerned could not enter a restaurant, theatre, cinema, football stadium, night club etc.

Iggly · 19/10/2021 16:31

@cherin

No, but wearing masks is NOT a big deal. Come on. Get in the tube any give day, or at the pub. Crowds of people without any precaution. In my office we have entire groups of 15-20 people all gathered in small meeting rooms. It’d take a bit of common sense to say “split this group, half of it connects from their workstation” and halve the risk. But if you get in the room with a mask they look at you as if you were stuck in 2020 and living in a parallel universe. In the rest of Europe which I’ve visited lately, everybody remembers to put the masks on. People wear them in the office when they’re not at their desk. Not a major deal. Cancelling ALL precautions without having school kids vaccinated, and with waning protection seems masochistic.
^this

I’m not sure why people are so up in arms about masks and why they’re denying that they have an positive effect. When they do.

I’m sure I read somewhere about people who wore masks had less chance of catching covid - or there was a correlation at least.

Tigerblue · 19/10/2021 16:31

@Rabblesthecat

I know but my point is that the death of an 85 year old man with with a severe underlying condition is not something to be changing our way of life For
My Mum spent many weeks on her own isolating away from people during lockdown, with me dropping off food once a week on her doorstep to avoid the risk of being a burden on the NHS. She chose not to be part of our bubble to limit the risk. We got our heads around her coming Xmas Day for a couple of hours (to sit in extension) and then DH had to isolate so she spent xmas on her own. In all fairness, she doesn't have an underlying condition, but she's done her bit and wants to be around for as long as possible.
Puppylucky · 19/10/2021 16:35

I really don't understand this People are getting (non Covid) sick argument as support for mask wearing /restrictions generally. Do people think they can evade sickness for ever? The longer we hide from germs /viruses etc the weaker our immune systems get and the worse the consequences.

freckles20 · 19/10/2021 16:39

[quote Florianus]**@Florianus out of interest, what measures would you like the non vulnerable younger and working population to take to protect the vulnerable?

The sort of measure taken by Israel and other countries that have managed to keep infection rates far below that of the UK: a covid pass recording vaccination level. without which the person concerned could not enter a restaurant, theatre, cinema, football stadium, night club etc.[/quote]
Fair enough. That seems fair, however being vaccinated doesn't seem to stop people getting or spreading Covid, but it does stop most people getting very unwell. So I'm not sure it would really help- but it is certainly doable.