Childminder not following covid guidelines

[Rainydaize]

I have 2 daughters who both go to the same childminder. Dd2 had a positive test but the childminder refused to take dd1 stating that there were vulnerable children in the setting and they could be investigated if more children caught covid.
They are both therefore isolating. Dd1 had a negative result at the same time dd2 had a positive so I thought she would be fine to go in.
I was then asked to do another PCR on dd1 so she could go back in, but this has come back positive. I spoke to test and trace and they have said that she should isolate from the start of symptoms (when she got her negative test) and to assume the negative was a false negative. This would mean she could go back to the childminder on the same day as originally planned.
The childminder has called a helpline apparently and has now asked for ten more days isolation from the date of a positive test.

I'm self employed and will really struggle to work if I have to do another ten days isolation with dd. (They are both pre schoolers).

My dp isn't around, we separated over lockdown due to dv, so it's taken a long time for me to finally try and get my life back and this has just really stressed me out. I've had to cancel so much work already without the girls being allowed in, and I'm already trying to save every penny I can for a decent Xmas for them.

All of this doesn't sit right with me because it's going against the guidelines but I know I've got a lot of personal stuff going on too so aibu to wonder why they can't be going in?
What should I do?

See OP, just because ‘the government’ say something is OK, doesn’t mean they’re right. I got pinged by the app a couple of weeks ago on a Sunday, it told me contact was on the previous Thursday. The app also told me that I didn’t need to isolate unless I had symptoms as I’m double jabbed.

I booked the test for the same day, I was meant to be attending a meeting on the Monday but I emailed the chair and said, unless I got a negative result by the time of the meeting, I’d isolate as I think that is the right thing to do. Rather than travel both ways by train and be in a room full of people, one who I know was CEV.

Mmm tricky on the staying home with a negative, my ds had a sore throat and cold and as he had been a close contact of someone we tested with a pcr ( advised to anyway with or without symptoms) not the classic 3 the goverment say but symptoms his friend had but friend also had fever , ds got a negative pcr so college etc want him in
I can't keeo him hime 10 days just incase like some are saying in here, we rely on the pcr being right ( he has also done daily lvt ) his symptoms lsted 2 days

I probably wouldn't risk your relationship with your childminder over a couple of days. But I wouldn't be offering to test again. Like others say she can be positive for 90 days.

Honestly, just go with 19 days from positive test, your child,index isn’t going to move on this and if you push it you will find yourself with a childminder.
Especially since your 2nd DD who was first negative was actually symptomatic when you tried to send her in with a positive sister.

Even if the child minder decided it was 14 days for everyone, which is her right as her business, you can’t thrust your daughter on her, you choose to accept that or find another childminder or the childminder hands you in your notice.

If it helps my friend actually took 14 days to get a positive/symptoms after isolating with her husband. She was “lucky” that her days 10-14 occurred over a bank holiday weekend otherwise she would have been back in work with vulnerable people. 10 days was picked to be most acceptable to what they could make the public stick to, not what is scientifically sound. So the majority of people sticking to 10days, a few will still spread it was seen as better than only 50% sticking to 2 weeks and spreading it more.

It’s not about trying to swindle her at all, but if your dd symptoms were not the main three then she’s right to ask you to start isolation from the point of being positive. Dd may not have had covid at that point.

Meant 10 days from positive test, 19 is just a random number!

@Rainydaize

And would I expect her to close if someone in her family comes down with covid because it's her guidelines for whole families to isolate meaning she wouldn't be able to work?

Your lack of knowledge on the actual guidelines displayed in this ⬆️ post shows that even you are not fully aware of the guidelines. Someone has mentioned this above about OFSTED, but I will speak as a childminder in Wales regulated by the CIW. If we have a member of our household who tests positive, our whole business has to close for 10 days until the last person with covid has completed their isolation. Which means that we have to close and shut down our business for a minimum of 10 days. The fact that you are questioning a couple of extra days of isolation while your CM is trying to safeguard, not only a vulnerable child in her setting but her own family and business is staggering.

I have informed parents that any child who is identified as a close contact of a positive case needs to stay away from my setting for 10 days. Not only to protect other families and children, but to protect my own family and my business. Not a single family I childmind for has complained.

Isolation rules are 10 days from a positive test not onset of symptoms so test and trace were wrong to tell you that. She shouldn't have to retest though as it will likely be positive.
Your childminder was absolutely right in telling you to keep her home after the negative test when she had symptoms. You, like many tested too soon. False negatives are more likely immediately after close contact, 100% will come back negative if you test on the same day for example, reducing to 30% if you test at the optimum time of around 5 days post exposure.

Actually, it's 10 days from symptoms or from a positive test if you don't have symptoms

Although the advice does say even if you have a negative test you should still stay home if you have symptoms and that would be doubly true if your sibling tested positive

Only 10 days from test date if you have no symptoms

I'm sorry I'm a cm and the guidelines are to isolate from the POSITIVE test for ten days so I would be following those guidelines. Sometimes the guidelines are different but in this case the person you've spoken to on the phone was giving out the wrong advice. Quite common unfortunately on the covid helplines

@Toty except thats not true it can be from symptoms, but in this case a negative test ruled the first lot of symptoms out
You have to wait for a pcr test in some areas or may have a postal one

@Looneytune253 read the guidelines again

Also you mentioned whether cm would be able to work if one of her family members caught it. The answer is actually NO as you can't invite anyone into the house where there is a positive case. If cm or her family catch the covid off your little one (which would have been likely had she allowed you to bring second child) then there would be further isolation for everyone and whatever may have happened with the vulnerable child. Isolation should be from 10 days after the pos test. Day one being the day after the test was done.

[quote worriedatthemoment]@Looneytune253 read the guidelines again[/quote]
I don't need to, I've read them so many times thank you. The neg test ruled out the symptoms so the pos test would be the date you go from.

For example, how could my CM face any backlash if she is following govt guidelines?

From the parents of vulnerable children who use her service. Following guidelines is inconvenient for you, but it risks making her other clients dangerously ill. I know what I’d be doing as a business owner if I had that decision to make. She risks losing her business for good if she has an outbreak of Covid. If any government guidelines put your business in that position, would you just stick to them to avoid a vague “backlash”?

I'm really reassured by the amount of confusion on here about the isolation restrictions. This is what I wasn't sure about either so it's evident there's no clarity on it in the case of a negative test that was false.

As a childminder I too am adding my own common sense to the covid guidance. Any case within a household the child is to stay away and isolate for 10 however if they then develop symptoms the isolation period starts again. I will also close if there is case in my household.
Any children displaying symptoms they are to be collected immediately and can only return if they have a negative test or they isolate.
Covid is ripping through our schools right now with limited mitigation's being SE I can apply my own mitigation's which I have done. I am testing daily as is my DD, in fact we went for PCR tests yesterday as she has been a close contact of a positive in school. Whilst waiting for our results we are both symptom free and testing until the results come through, should either of us develop symptoms that will be my setting closed.
In the last week I've had to have 3 children collected due to displaying symptoms thankfully all parents are onboard and are testing / isolating as requested.

The thing I have learnt from all of this is that you provide as little as possible information for people to speculate on. You forward the test and trace email to your employer/childminder so that it is hard for them to add their own take on it all.

@Tresal

The thing I have learnt from all of this is that you provide as little as possible information for people to speculate on. You forward the test and trace email to your employer/childminder so that it is hard for them to add their own take on it all.

That's so deceptive. A childminder doesn't just have a business to worry about, but they have their own family and other children to protect.
I completely agree with the childminder erring on the side of caution and accepting the child back 10 days after the positive test. She's trying to safeguard her livelihood and the health of everyone she lives with and looks after.

The thing I have learnt from all of this is that people can be so incredibly selfish.

I agree @Boofay, sadly not surprised that a lot of people just think of themselves, but to criticise a childminder for following guidance and thinking of herself, her business and other minders is harsh.

I also have to work and I don’t get paid if my children have to stay at home. I would be furious if someone made up the rules for themselves based on their own theories about Covid! This thread shows how muddled people get.

I would adopt the same policy as your childminder.

@Tresal

I also have to work and I don’t get paid if my children have to stay at home. I would be furious if someone made up the rules for themselves based on their own theories about Covid! This thread shows how muddled people get.

But 10 days from a positive test is the rules? The childminder reasonably requested another PCR as the other DD was symptomatic and her sibling had covid- which turned out to be the right thing to do as she too had covid. Then it's 10 days from a positive test, if someone from track and trace said on the phone said to assume the first test was wrong, they could try and commit it to writing, but I doubt they would as its not policy and is guesswork. Having a covid positive child in the setting would probably leave to closure anyway as others likely to catch it, and it could be really bad for the vulnerable child. The real issue is that the government and some employers don't give more support to those who have to stay home with isolating family members.

@Tresal your deceptive behaviour could have serious implications for others and is utterly selfish. Actions like that could have a devastating impact on any childcare setting having to close and for much longer. We've always had parents who chance the odd sickness or bug knowing full well their child is sick, covid is very different especially for those who are CEV.