Is it ok we are just letting our kids get Covid?

[Moonopoly]

DD5 has just tested positive for Covid. There have been several cases in her Year 1 class but school remains the same. Under the old rules the ‘bubble’ would have closed and she would perhaps have stood some chance of not getting it.
Is it ok that we are letting the government pursue a herd immunity policy with a novel virus amongst our kids?
We seem to be the only country doing this?

@MarshaBradyo

The mitigations we had brought more harm - it’s probably why many parents weigh risk v harm.

Ventilation, masks, sensible and appropriate social distancing, vaccinations and boosters - what harms come from those compared to unrestricted spread of the virus, larger numbers of students and staff falling ill, and the consequent school closures?

@Moonopoly

They think it will be endemic by next spring so why tear it all up at this point? We’ve come this far.

How do you think it becomes endemic?

@borntobequiet those things work better with secondary age children but not so well with primary. To expect young children to keep social distancing from their peers is damaging quite frankly. Also we are about to start vaccinating over 12s. I don't think enough people would want to vaccinate their primary age children for it to have an affect.

That’s no reason not to do what one can where possible, and no reason not to implement all those measures in secondary.
Vaccines are being trialled for the under 12s at present. Their teachers should get boosters ASAP.

@borntobequiet

That’s no reason not to do what one can where possible, and no reason not to implement all those measures in secondary. Vaccines are being trialled for the under 12s at present. Their teachers should get boosters ASAP.

Being trialled doesn't mean they will become available. Highly unlikely that we will vaccinate under 12s in this country and even if we do, the take up probably won't be high.

no reason not to implement all those measures in secondary

Really? can think of a multitude of reasons why attempting to implement such measures in secondary schools could be costly, impractical and harmful. These measures have to be balanced again risk (to what extent are they proportionate?) and considered in terms of their likely effectiveness: to what extent are they realistically going to prevent the spread of covid? What evidence do we have for this really?

@theemperorhasnoclothes

No, it's not ok. As you correctly point out no other country is doing this.

There is evidence there may be long term neurological damage from covid, even mild cases. We don't know what the impact is on developing children's brains yet. We just don't have the data. Maybe it'll be fine, maybe not.

No other country is doing this. Many private schools are implementing ventilation, small class sizes and masks. That should be a clue.

We're so close to having a vaccine for all kids over 5, it's madness to let it rip now with unknown long term impacts.

I hope their gamble with our kids health pays off. That's all we have to cling to - that it MIGHT be ok.

Sending hope your DD is better soon OP and is only mildly affected.

Personally I'm writing to my MP letting him know that I don't consent to this massive experiment with our kids and will hold him and the government responsible if my kid catches it and gets long covid, PIMs etc.

Making children terrified of a virus, interrupting their schooling constantly and making them wear masks also causes damage.

Are children in constant fear of flu even though they’re probably more likely to die from that than from Covid?

for example "CDC researchers concluded that schools without mask requirements saw nearly four times as many COVID-19 outbreaks as schools with such mandates."

www.usnews.com/news/education-news/articles/2021-09-24/schools-without-mask-requirements-more-likely-to-see-covid-19-outbreaks

Would masks be useful in the UK? Probably. We seem to have a crisis here at the moment, even without children isolating if they have been close contacts of/ live in the same house as people testing positive.

Masks were I think quite useful in the March 8 return to schools.

Being is school and wearing a mask is, I would say, better for kids than being at home.

to implement such measures in secondary schools could be costly, impractical and harmful.

What extortionate cost, how impractical and what harm, when compared to extensive illness and lost learning, which is happening now. One in ten are out of school as a result of Covid, and we’re not at the end of September yet. I can see serious problems with exams again down the line, and as yet there seems no plan for that…

It would be really good if organisations such as Us4Them, who have campaigned so disastrously for all children to be exposed to covid, and denied vaccination in a timely way, could be legally held accountable for the effects of their campaigning. Fond hope, I imagine.

@borntobequiet

to implement such measures in secondary schools could be costly, impractical and harmful.

What extortionate cost, how impractical and what harm, when compared to extensive illness and lost learning, which is happening now. One in ten are out of school as a result of Covid, and we’re not at the end of September yet. I can see serious problems with exams again down the line, and as yet there seems no plan for that…

yeah, almost all of us have masks now, and getting a reusable FFP2 equivalent for each teenager would be very inexpensive.

How did they delay vaccination - The decision was solely JCVI wasn’t it?

I also don’t see why we won’t follow Scotland for case numbers up then down

Dc are wearing masks in communal areas here I’m fine with that. In classroom they can have more normal experience. Plus vaccination soon

Mitigations were there for adults as a group mainly not dc.

I assume a child can wear one still if wanted though

@MarshaBradyo

How did they delay vaccination - The decision was solely JCVI wasn’t it?

I also don’t see why we won’t follow Scotland for case numbers up then down

No

The vaccine was approved by MHRA (on June 4th)

and in the end the ultimate decision appears to have been handed to the CMOs

so not just JCVI

shame they couldn't collectively have shifted gear

You said Us4Them campaigned and delayed it

How?

Us 4 Them have fought tooth and nail against every single covid mitigation for children.

They have also organised petitions and open letters within the Tory party itself.

on masks www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/03/04/show-evidence-masks-class-drop-measure-gavin-williamson-told/

and on vaccines www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/09/10/ignoring-expert-advice-child-vaccines-will-dissolve-public-trust/

They are arsewipes

Yes they may have been active but unless you can state with confidence the JCVI were influenced then no they didn’t delay vaccines

@Silverswirl 🙌🏻🙌🏻🙌🏻 this. 100%. I don't understand them either. I think some people just like being in lockdown and isolation and the drama.

Yes

erm

I didn't say they influenced the JCVI directly

but U4T put all the political pressure they could on the government not to allow vaccination of children

presumably people lobby in this way in the hope of having an effect

and to some extent it is a political decision

@herecomesthsun

erm

I didn't say they influenced the JCVI directly

but U4T put all the political pressure they could on the government not to allow vaccination of children

presumably people lobby in this way in the hope of having an effect

and to some extent it is a political decision

Yet it didn’t

The CMO and government were keen

The JCVI were the longer delay so there’s no point i trying to add delay as you did.

I also (on checking ) did not actually say that U4T delayed vaccinations.

Though I am sure they would like to have done

Us4Them, who have campaigned so disastrously for all children to be exposed to covid, and denied vaccination in a timely way

Who did you mean?

Yes it is, we need to move to what Denmark are doing and stop testing.

Masks in the classroom ARE an invasive measure over the medium to long term so you need to ask what you want to achieve by bringing them back. By asking children to wear masks you are reducing or postponing but not removing their chance of getting covid. And no I am not Us4Them but I am a teacher. Masks reduce classroom interactions of all kinds because they make communication and understanding so much harder. Overall they have a substantial negative impact on our typical approach to teaching and learning which is typically not just teacher instruction but pair work, group work, whole class discussion etc. They lead to much less engagement, in my experience. For how long do you wish your child to have a subpar school experience in order to protect them from covid? I was happy for students to return in masks last year to get them back to school but that time has now gone. Remote learning is also a disaster not only for primary kids but also with most teenagers who are too self conscious to engage via a screen. It is obviously not ideal to allow covid to spread so quickly in schools which have not had much previous exposure, but I can't see any good alternative.