DS refusing to take PCR - negative LFT’s

[Squealy]

DS 21 went to our local city on a night out last Saturday.

Monday, common cold symptoms started, he took an LFT which was negative. He continued to get worse, really runny nose, hoarse voice, sore throat at times, disturbed sleep due to coughing etc.

Work require him to have a weekly LFT, it was carried out at his workplace Wednesday morning when he was very symptomatic, again it was negative.

All week long I’ve asked him to get a PCR as LFTs aren’t that reliable and he’s refusing, says that LFTs aren’t that unreliable and spouting a load of maths stuff about the chances of 2 LFTs being wrong.

I’ve tried to explain that maybe they were done too early in the course of the illness to pick up anything - he’s still coughing now, very disturbed sleep, streaming nose etc.

He’s such a stubborn bugger, he says there’s no point in testing now anyway as he’d be almost out of his isolation at this point anyway.

How accurate are LFTs and could he actually be positive? DH and I are both double jabbed and DD only had her 2nd jab a few days ago. I guess the rest of us would be showing symptoms by now though?

Maybe it’s worth the rest of us doing LFTs in case we are asymptomatic?

There is no justification for him to get a PCR. He’d have to lie on the form. Yes it might be Covid but with two negative LFTs and no distinctive symptoms, that’s probably not the most likely scenario.

The reason for not using LFTs if you have key symptoms isn’t because they won’t work if you’re at that stage, it’s because of the screening strategy we’re using.

@NeverTalkToStrangers

There is no justification for him to get a PCR. He’d have to lie on the form. Yes it might be Covid but with two negative LFTs and no distinctive symptoms, that’s probably not the most likely scenario.

The reason for not using LFTs if you have key symptoms isn’t because they won’t work if you’re at that stage, it’s because of the screening strategy we’re using.

Loads and loads of people have cold symptoms with Delta variant. I had 3 negative LFTs and cold symptoms but I did indeed have Covid. Is it worse to lie to get a PCR or to potentially spread Covid around?

@NeverTalkToStrangers

There is no justification for him to get a PCR. He’d have to lie on the form. Yes it might be Covid but with two negative LFTs and no distinctive symptoms, that’s probably not the most likely scenario.

The reason for not using LFTs if you have key symptoms isn’t because they won’t work if you’re at that stage, it’s because of the screening strategy we’re using.

Wow. I got sooo confused when I saw your messages.

That’s spooky NeverTalksToStrangers

@NeverTalkToStrangers

That’s spooky NeverTalksToStrangers

Omg I thought you were having a conversation with yourself for a moment 😂😂

Colds haven’t gone away you know. Covid isn’t the only virus around. He’s got a neg result and is an adult. Back off.

Every single person I know who has had Delta variant has had "heavy cold" symptoms at the start NOT the old style 3 symptoms listed. It's utterly ridiculous that the govt refuses to update the list of symptoms for PCR tests.

Cold symptoms and sore throats are absolutely symptoms of Delta in some people. Just because the government haven’t changed the criteria it doesn’t mean they aren’t. Even the original people were observing different symptoms to those 3 original. Several of my colleagues who have had Covid recently said it started with a headache/cold type symptoms.

Of course it could be a cold too those viruses are spreading around but it would be sensible if you are coughing/sneezing all over the place and feeling ill to get a PCR. Although in your case op it’s probably a tad late! Reliance on LFT isn’t great for symptomatic people we know that.

Same symptoms as my DD had last week.... 3 negative lateral flows and PCR was negative but had to do it before school would let her back. However his train of thought is logical re isolation times etc.

The issue is that no one will ever be at work or school this winter if we insist on isolating and testing everyone who has cold symptoms.

The three symptoms that necessitate a PCR test are very clear- if you don’t have them, you go about your business as normal.

People need to stop making up the rules

Whether anaecdotally or joe blogs who works for boots says that cold symptoms are symptoms of delta, that is not the rule

We know how much Mumsnet loves covid rules so maybe try following them

He’s just done another LFT as I was keeping on at him. Negative again thankfully. It is very likely he does have a heavy common cold. It’s crazy how common colds didn’t almost die out too, how did they survive through the lockdowns. Same as covid I guess, the lockdowns didn’t eradicate those (sorry, just think out loud)!

@GreenLakes

The issue is that no one will ever be at work or school this winter if we insist on isolating and testing everyone who has cold symptoms.

The three symptoms that necessitate a PCR test are very clear- if you don’t have them, you go about your business as normal.

If I'd done that I would have given everyone Covid, then my workplace would have suffered more with everyone off.

PCRs come back really quickly, usually within 24 hours.

@Watapalava

People need to stop making up the rules

Whether anaecdotally or joe blogs who works for boots says that cold symptoms are symptoms of delta, that is not the rule

We know how much Mumsnet loves covid rules so maybe try following them

But many people are testing positive with cold symptoms. Is it really such an inconvenience just to go and get a PCR test?

I agree, it's definitely not true. DH's symptomatic covid came up as a strong positive on a LFT and was later confirmed by PCR.

@Watapalava

People need to stop making up the rules

Whether anaecdotally or joe blogs who works for boots says that cold symptoms are symptoms of delta, that is not the rule

We know how much Mumsnet loves covid rules so maybe try following them

Our local authority (big city council) clearly asks people to get a PCR test with cold symptoms as per the advice of their director of public health.

@bonniewitch

If he has symptoms then LFT's don't work. LFT's are for picking up asymptomatic or presymptomatic cases.

Once you have symptoms, the viral load is too high for LFT's to work properly, and will likely give a false negative.

This is complete rubbish. LFTs are more accurate if you have a higher viral load, - which is more likely if you have symptoms.

The reason the NHS recommends LFTs only for asymptomatic covid is that they are a rapid, cheap, at home test , so can be used for mass/ more basic screening.
PCR tests are more expensive and resource intensive and are therefore rationed for those who have symptoms. Additionally , PCR tests are more accurate and therefore recommended for those who have symptoms , as it’s more important to accurately identify symptomatic cases.

He has a symptom which requires him to test. If he lived in my house he would be told to take a PCR test or arrange alternative accommodation for the future.

Lft tests are very inaccurate. Many people never tested positive on them despite having a positive pcr of it's taken a few days to show up on a lft. It's happening so much to people I know. If they relied on lft tests they'd be walking around spreading covid. It could well be a bad cold but he won't know until he's dont a pcr, saying that if his symptoms started last Monday it might be too late for a pcr anyway (not sure what the reckons Ed time frame is now) and his isolation would be nearly over... 😒

Well I tested positive with a pcr with just cold symptoms and yeah I did have to lie to book a test. My office insisted on it but at least I wasn't roaming around infecting people.

Your son has been taking cocaine - runny nose and smoking cigarettes - cough

Sorry 😂

@Pissinthepottyplease

He has a symptom which requires him to test. If he lived in my house he would be told to take a PCR test or arrange alternative accommodation for the future.

Find alternative accommodation? What for? By this point if he did actually have covid it's already in the household, if you are double vaccinated or u18 household contacts dont need to isolate irrelevant of what the results are, and if you suspect covid anyway surely you'd monitor and maybe restrict your movements to stop the spread of whatever virus covid or not they had

@Pissinthepottyplease

He has a symptom which requires him to test. If he lived in my house he would be told to take a PCR test or arrange alternative accommodation for the future.

Requires? It’s the law?

he’s refusing, says that LFTs aren’t that unreliable and spouting a load of maths stuff about the chances of 2 LFTs being wrong. Remind him that the maths he's spouting depends on the two "events' being independent, and that whatever is causing the LFT to be negative the first time (low viral load?) is likely to be the same the second time, so the events aren't independent.

If he has symptoms then LFT's don't work. LFT's are for picking up asymptomatic or presymptomatic cases. They work, but they have a lower sensitivity that PCR, ie if given to 100 people with Covid, they'll only pick up about 57 of them, whereas PCR will pick up a lot more. So if you have Covid symptoms, the sensible thing is to go straight for PCR, which is what the Government recommends.

The reason for lateral flow test, and the suggestion that everyone do one twice a week, is that if you have a whole lot of symptomless people, some of whom have Covid, the lateral flow test will pick up half the cases, at much less cost than trying to do PCRs on everyone. And picking up half the cases is worth doing.

@GreenLakes

The thing is a ‘runny nose’, ‘sore throat’ and ‘hoarse voice’ are not symptoms that justify a PCR test.

They are though extremely common signs of COVID. My dn tested positive a couple of weeks ago with precisely these symptoms.

OP your ds is an arse but it's too late to worry about it now.