Requiring the exempt to identify themselves?

[MolyHolyGuacamole]

Attached is a photo from the Science Museum on their mask policy. If you are exempt from wearing, you can 'if you would like', be given a wristband. It's worded as a choice, but I looked into this after my friend who is exempt went with her kids, was asked if she was wearing a mask and when she told them she was exempt she was told to go to x desk over there and get a wristband. It wasn't presented as a choice.

Am I the only one who thinks that it's wrong to make exempt people identify themselves as 'other'? Is this legally enforceable?'

I was on the DLR the other day and heard an announcement that stated 'everyone is required to wear a mask, unless you can show that you are exempt'. Again, have I missed something? You do not have to prove your exemption, what are these companies playing at?

I’m not sure how I feel about it - there are positives and negatives. Wrist bands being given do give legitimacy and so may reduce the frustration or judgement, also they are able to be counted out and provides data as to the number of people wearing/not wearing them. This data could be used for several purposes including tracking rates of transmission, monitoring public attitude etc. The “shaming” aspect shouldn’t be ignored however it should be noted many will not view it as such - some will be relieved they have been considered if they have felt shamed before while others who choose not to wear it may not be too bothered about shaming. I don’t think there is a perfect way of doing things and so think companies that are trying shouldn’t be judged too harshly. It may not be a requirement in law but companies should be able to put their own systems in place to monitor and protect staff and the public..

@EmmyLake

I find it weird that people are still wanting to visit places like the science museum if you have to wear a mask still. I absolutely love museums/galleries etc but would struggle to gain any enjoyment from the day if I was masked up for that long.

Whereas many wouldn’t feel comfortable without masks during a pandemic and plenty wear them all day for work so are used to them.

I personally like that places want to keep them given the case numbers and mixing that is going on.

Why don't they just daub UNCLEAN in big red paint instead?

Chillingly horrifying. There are no legal restrictions on masks and the likes of the Science Museum and others should respect this. They should worry more about their Shell sponsorship than people going about their lawful business.

“ I find your attitude even weirder - it's really not that big a deal!”

I find it a big deal to wear a mask - not to the extent that I am exempt - but I do still go to museums and galleries because my children get a lot out of it. If they didn't, I would probably wait until after masks were required. Though on the other hand, part of the difficulty with masks for me is the challenge of looking after my small children whilst wearing it (which I expect you will consider feeble, but there it is) so I probably wouldn’t find it a big deal if I only had myself to look after.

How do wrist bands give any sort of legitimacy when absolutely no proof of exemption is required. It's bonkers. IMHO.

There is no such thing as exemption now. There was a legal exemption when masks were required by law but that law no longer exists. So I presume that leaves it to the discretion of the establishment?

It's up to the science museum to set whatever policy they like to enter their property. As long as it's not discriminatory, it's up to them.

@ninamacctellsithowitis

Why don't they just daub UNCLEAN in big red paint instead?

Chillingly horrifying. There are no legal restrictions on masks and the likes of the Science Museum and others should respect this. They should worry more about their Shell sponsorship than people going about their lawful business.

you can either not wear a mask (already "othering" yourself as people have said or which you think it is the equivalent of daubing yourself with "UNCLEAN" which makes literally no sense), or you can not wear a mask and also have a wristband.

I literally do not understand how you can be offended by this

@BareGrylls

There is no such thing as exemption now. There was a legal exemption when masks were required by law but that law no longer exists. So I presume that leaves it to the discretion of the establishment?

But discrimination on the basis of a disability is against the law. And the rules have been updated to express that despite masks no longer being a legal requirement, in places where they are still expected, you STILL do not need to show that you are exempt. So I don't think an institution can require you to show it to everyone by wearing something like a wristband.

Discrimination would be saying "if you can't wear a mask you can't come in". They aren't doing that and they aren't stopping anyone coming in. If they are doing checks of everyone who says they can't wear a mask, wristband or not, the fact that you aren't wearing a mask marks you out as someone who has a reason not to. The wristband just shows it's already been checked.

That's not a current policy. I've been to Science Museum last week and I'm not wearing a mask. No one approached me or asked me to wear a wristband and majority of people wasn't wearing masks either. This is Science Museum covid policy from their website: We welcome everyone and recognise there are circumstances where, for health, age or accessibility reasons, some visitors aren’t able to wear face masks or coverings. We hope that all visitors are respectful towards each other but please speak to a member of staff if you feel we could help.

Say a surgeon couldnt wear a mask or an assistant to surgery. So they were told they couldn't do operations. Is that discrimination.

Christ on a bike!

Never before have I come across such whinging and whining! All this "shaming" and "othering" crap. How the hell would any of you cope with a real disability?

I have the right to park in this disabled spot but if I have to show a big blue badge that's marking me out as "other" and "shaming me" so I shouldn't have to.

If you were visiually impaired how would you cope with a bloody great big Labrador wearing a blue jacket & hi-vis? Would you refuse to have one because it draws attention to you and marks you out as different?

Do you tell work that you need "reasonable adjustments" and then refuse to tell them why because "it's private medical information"?

Has it not occurred to you that if you wore a little wristband 99.9999999999999% of people will simply consider it in the same way as every other visual marker - which is nothing more than a tiny internalised 'oh' immediately forgotten. With the exception of wheelchairs. If you really want to know what genuine othering feels like I suggest you give it a go for a week.

Aren't you pleasant?
I have a real disability, it just happens to be a hidden disability. I've worn my lanyard for a year, I wore before covid in situations where I needed people to be supportive, where I might have a meltdown or behave in a way that might not be considered "normal".
Trouble is for the last year the lanyard hasn't meant the same thing as it used to. It used to be a visual aide to train station/supermarket/job centre/etc staff that I need a little more patience and understanding. Now I'm not sure what it means to most people as it has been hijacked as a visual sign to say mask exempt (which I am).
And yes I do object to having to wear a band round my wrist, that doesn't signify that I may need the help, but instead just marks me as mask exempt, I would imagine that a large number of people that are mask exempt wouldn't need the extra help that a lanyard was actually originally designed for.

So what is an unreal disability. This is geting more than a little ridiculous.

@Viviennemary

Say a surgeon couldnt wear a mask or an assistant to surgery. So they were told they couldn't do operations. Is that discrimination.

Oh, this old chestnut. Anyone struggling to wear a mask would not be attempting to go into a career where a mask is needed.

I used to assist in surgery. I can no longer wear a mask. I wont be attempting to go into my previous career.

@Viviennemary

Say a surgeon couldnt wear a mask or an assistant to surgery. So they were told they couldn't do operations. Is that discrimination.

If a surgeon cannot wear a mask due to a disability, his/her workplace needs to first make reasonable adjustments. If they still cannot do their job with those reasonable adjustments in place then they can be dismissed, HTH.

'sorry I don't wish to wear a wrist band thank you'
Im exempt. I mostly wore my lanyard. Thankfully I only ever had one person 'try' to have a pop at me.
Now we don't have tk wear masks by law I don't wear my lanyard.

What's happening is that a lot of people are appropriating the problems faced by the disabled as a get out clause.
Unless the UK (specifically England) has a level of disability exponentially higher than almost every country in the western world, (which has not hitherto been studied) many many of those "exempt" just CBA

The new "its not the Govts fault you cant get PIP Its all the scroungers" re imagined for the Covid era.

And damn the pesky NHS for saving more disabled babies at birth. Damn those advances in medical science (the same fucking advances that gets us vaccines) for saving so many people. And damn society for moving forwards so much that people who have to cope with certain conditions arent locked up in institutions anymore.

the next time you wonder why there are more disabled ppl around................try to think critically

"How the hell would any of you cope with a real disability?"

Ds has a severe very real and very obvious learning disability. Nothing hidden about it. He has a blue badge and uses a wheelchair much of the time. I still wouldn't want him to be forced to have a label or wristband on him to say that he has a learning disability or autism or any of the other conditions he has just so the general public can feel happy that he has been properly labelled.

@CataclysmicVariable

“ I find your attitude even weirder - it's really not that big a deal!”

I find it a big deal to wear a mask - not to the extent that I am exempt - but I do still go to museums and galleries because my children get a lot out of it. If they didn't, I would probably wait until after masks were required. Though on the other hand, part of the difficulty with masks for me is the challenge of looking after my small children whilst wearing it (which I expect you will consider feeble, but there it is) so I probably wouldn’t find it a big deal if I only had myself to look after.

But... why are you different to the rest of us looking after small children? I'm absolutely not saying it doesn't have any challenges - it's warm, and my spatial awareness is affected by wearing a mask, stairs are tricky - but it's not a big deal. I'd much rather be out and having fun than staying home because a mask might be a bit tricky.

@MilkTwoSugarsThanks

Christ on a bike!

Never before have I come across such whinging and whining! All this "shaming" and "othering" crap. How the hell would any of you cope with a real disability?

I have the right to park in this disabled spot but if I have to show a big blue badge that's marking me out as "other" and "shaming me" so I shouldn't have to.

If you were visiually impaired how would you cope with a bloody great big Labrador wearing a blue jacket & hi-vis? Would you refuse to have one because it draws attention to you and marks you out as different?

Do you tell work that you need "reasonable adjustments" and then refuse to tell them why because "it's private medical information"?

Has it not occurred to you that if you wore a little wristband 99.9999999999999% of people will simply consider it in the same way as every other visual marker - which is nothing more than a tiny internalised 'oh' immediately forgotten. With the exception of wheelchairs. If you really want to know what genuine othering feels like I suggest you give it a go for a week.

What a disgusting post.

I've spent a week in a wheelchair, thanks. Many weeks, in fact, off and on, thanks to my RA. My mask exemption is trigeminal neuralgia and although I don't need a wheelchair because of it, or to wear high vis, it's in many ways more debilitating than my RA. It can come on at any time, including while I'm on a bus or in a supermarket. That's quite inconvenient, given the pain is so sudden and so severe that I can lose consciousness and have wet myself in the past when that happens.

What gives you the right to judge whose disabilities are 'real'? Also, many people who are exempt aren't disabled - would you tell a rape survivor that het trauma isn't 'real'?

People with assistance dogs or in wheelchairs don't routinely get threatened, abused, spat at, shouted at and told they're selfish, superspreading disease breathed tramps. People who are mask exempt have had to put up with all of this and more for over a year - and the visual signifier of a lanyard hasn't prevented that one bit. I've always worn one and all of the above have been things I've experienced. Anyone can obtain a lanyard, for free - they prove nothing. As exempt people are often reminded when going about their business, in less than friendly terms.

The lack of empathy and compassion shown to people living with disabilities or health conditions over the past year has been shameful. The deeply ingrained ableism had been allowed - encouraged, even - to flourish. In the years to come I hope that people look back on some of the things they've said and feel deeply ashamed - sadly though it's more likely that now these attitudes have been validated, they're here to stay.

@Viviennemary

Say a surgeon couldnt wear a mask or an assistant to surgery. So they were told they couldn't do operations. Is that discrimination.

This again.

There was a poster last year who very eloquently spoke about how her inability to wear a mask meant that she had been unable to pursue her ambition to become a surgeon, and she had become a GP instead. Unfortunately there will always be some occupations closed to people who live with disabilities or health conditions - for example, if your movement is severely compromised you're probably never going to be a fireman. My RA makes doing the sort of work I used to do very difficult, to the point where I can't do it any more. It's shit, but there it is.

'Am I the only one who thinks that it's wrong to make exempt people identify themselves as 'other'? Is this legally enforceable'

I don't understand what is the problem since everyone can see already person is not wearing mask? How is wristband adding to the sense of "otherness" in this case? The exempt status will be more closely monitored over time but I can see why many will take it as infringement of their rights.

Whether this is regarding wearing masks or vaccinations, I'll expect more places to follow suit and at some point also will require a proof of exemption, perhaps recorded in the same way as vacc status.

What @Geamhradh said. I was in U.K. a few weeks ago, and on a fairly full London bus, only two were wearing masks. You can’t tell me that an entire bus load of people are medically exempt.

Like another poster, I live in an EU country where masks are required on public transport and in shops/malls. If you’re not wearing a mask, you’re not allowed in. There’s been no big outcry about it. I flew back from U.K. on the national airline and everyone on the flight was required to wear a mask and keep it on.