So are they preparing schools for LFTs for close contacts?

[Regulus]

It's been said that U18 and the double jabbed won't have to isolate if they are a close contact from 16 August.

This has been taken at face value.

This new report from Oxford says testing for close contacts is a successful way to avoid isolation and that

Prof Paul Hunter, from the University of East Anglia, said schools would probably still need some controls on their return

"At least daily testing... will have less harm on children's education than the current exclusion policy, whether or not it has real benefit in controlling the epidemic,"

So what is the plan, close contacts of primary get tested daily?
Senior school children get tested daily but if they don't agree/can't will they still need to isolate (and therefore will teachers still need to be prepared with online work?)

Why tout the idea of normal school in September when this is not possible?

I wonder how bad it has to get to get education unions to strike.
Hear nhs and police unions might start to strike.

@noblegiraffe

Have you got a link to the pre-print, *@QueenStromba*?

modmedmicro.nsms.ox.ac.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/07/dct_schools_trial_preprint_20210722.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwip8bPK0fjxAhUIilwKHf6mA9YQFjAAegQIBBAC&usg=AOvVaw2jeQWapZW6XaCB7aD2A9C6" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=modmedmicro.nsms.ox.ac.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/07/dct_schools_trial_preprint_20210722.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwip8bPK0fjxAhUIilwKHf6mA9YQFjAAegQIBBAC&usg=AOvVaw2jeQWapZW6XaCB7aD2A9C6

Thank you QueenStromba I have many questions, so am off to read!

@palacegirl77 totally agree, covid will just need to be deal with like any other illness people can catch at any time! It is here to stay.

[quote BustopherPonsonbyJones]@palacegirl77

Yes, I’ve had the vaccine - several months later than NHS staff, many of whom who worked from home doing office jobs. It enabled me to do my job without having a nervous breakdown worrying about being placed in an ICU on a ventilator. You see, I always knew that children were spreading Covid!

However…
a) the effectiveness of the vaccine may fail over time
b) having now been out more, I can see conditions in schools are considerably less safe than other workplaces I have seen, including supermarkets and restaurants
c) the vaccine doesn’t stop you getting Covid and you can still feel very sick
d) there doesn’t seem to be a plan to give teachers a booster in the autumn despite the very significant evidence now shows that schools are places where Covid spreads like wildfire and children do spread Covid very nicely. Parents are forgetting this as staff will not be available to work if they are sick.

I’d also add that teachers are throughly fed up of doing two people’s jobs (teaching online and in school). That needs sorting out, perhaps by providing funding for teachers who work with isolating children in each school. If this is the new normal, don’t expect people to keep giving for free.[/quote]
a) if that happens or new variants break through they will mostly likely revert back to how it was before whilst they create a new version (wouldnt take long).
b) Schools are probably safer than hospitals. Education is essential and they must stay open - theyre in a much better position now as by Sept all staff would be double jabbed.
c)Feeling very sick is something which we have as a risk all the time, from flu, norovirus, chest infections, pneumonia etc. Bad virus can wipe you out for weeks. Unfortunately people seem very scared of being sick at all anymore.
d) There was such a big hoohaa about teachers not getting the vaccine early they wouldnt be ready for a booster in a couple of months time.
There shouldnt be any need for teachers to be creating work for "isolating kids". It should revert back to being classroom only as only sick (or positive) kids will be isolating - theyll miss a couple of weeks of school max which they can catch up on - like what would have happened previously where if youre sick, youre off school.

@ineedaholidaynow

Mild usually means not ending up in hospital, so can still knock you for six but be termed mild.

Absolutely. I had a horrendous chest infection in Jan 19 - Ended up infected sinuses, perforated ear drum - I felt wretched for nearly 6 weeks. But this was before covid. Now being in bed for 48 hours would be classed as being terribly ill!

I’m a secondary school teacher. We were a pilot school for the close contact testing. If a case was reported pupils that were close contact had to report to school by 8am to be LTF tested. If negative sent into school as normal. If positive sent home to isolate and their close contacts were daily tested. The daily tested went on for 10 days after the case was confirmed. If parents didn’t agree to daily LTF testing then pupils isolated for 10 days as per usual system.

Positives were less pupils off isolating due to one case. Therefore more in education.

Negatives were that it took away a while teaching space from PE and drama as the gym and the hall were used for testing. It also took away support staff from their main role to complete the testing.

As a school we provide online learning every week uploaded by each department. We also where possible live stream lessons when pupils are isolating at home.

It’s been incredibly hard work

Flu is the only communicable illness I've had that "wiped me out for weeks". Vomiting bug - couple of days, cold - not off at all, sore throat - probably a day or two if I could hardly speak.
Symptomatic Covid seems to impact adults for more than a day or two. I never want to get flu again, I lost a big chunk of my life at a time when it was important to me to be well, couldn't look after my dc etc.
Having a variety of staff in the same school off for weeks rather than days and returning not fully recovered would be terrible for schools and for the learning of exam years in particular.
I also cannot imagine ever wanting to go up close to a student when they might be a close contact of a positive case, which is a pretty essential part of my job.

Wonder how this is going to work out for medically vulnerable pupils, especially those who can't be vaccinated

[quote Wizzbangfizz]@palacegirl77 totally agree, covid will just need to be deal with like any other illness people can catch at any time! It is here to stay.[/quote]
That’s easy to say if you aren’t in a school environment with rife covid.

Mild isn’t necessarily mild. I had “mild” covid. Yes, I wasn’t hospitalised but I was bloody poorly. Two colleagues are still off school with long covid, 9 months after contracting it. It’s scary when you see it first hand and experience it first hand.

Unless you are in a high risk environment yourself, and you’ve been extremely ill with covid yourself, it’s very easy to say “like any illness, you’ve just got to live with it”

Yet again people who don't work in schools are minimising the concerns of people who do. Telling them their risk is nothing and to suck it up. I'm seriously tired of it.

I'm of the opinion now that school staff should now just switch off from it on here and avoid expressing our valid concerns about September. As we found from last Summer our point of view was disregarded and derided and we had no control over our expected working conditions.

Anyone else confused about the overall aim? Tests are not 100% and if the goal is to stop onward transmission then surely isolation of contacts would still be necessary to break that chain. With daily testing are we just keeping tally of all the times the virus was passed on rather than actually managing it?

I agree. And testing primary aged children is flawed in so many ways.

TA at our local school, fully vaccinated caught covid. He didn't feel too bad while at home, but since returning he's felt fatigued and breathless. School staff are going to be at risk, they'll be in halls with large numbers of children shoulder to shoulder (other situations like that are going to require people to be vaccinated) and very few of the children will be.

I'm not particularly reassured by any school scenario for September. On the one hand I'm sick of having kids isolating and spending more time doing crappy online school work than proper lessons. On the other hand my dc has been isolating as a close contact since the beginning of the week and has now tested positive on a LFT. So if she hadn't been isolating, who might she have passed it on to in the last few days?

I had 'mild' covid, I was too unwell to work for 4 weeks, although most of that was in the holiday so didn't impact school too much. On my return I still struggled but as it was January and we were teaching online it was a bit easier as I didn't have race around the building between lessons, I'd probably have been off longer if we had been doing that (maybe 6 weeks in total before I could manage stairs well). I still have some symptoms now, but I get by. Definitely don't want it again, it would be very disruptive for my students if I was off for 4-6 weeks with 'mild' covid...

@palacegirl77
Do you have children of school age? If you do, regardless of how important you think it is to vaccinate teachers or give teachers a booster, you should be very worried about next term. A ‘mild’ case of Covid can knock someone out for a week and often for longer. If they get Covid, teachers won’t be able to teach; supply teachers won’t want to come into schools (they aren’t stupid) and schools will have to close as no one will be there to supervise the children. I have been a teacher for nearly a quarter of a century. In that time, the only things that have come close to closing schools in which I have worked was a norovirus outbreak and a petrol crisis (not at the same time!). I am not giving these warnings lightly or with any pleasure. You should be worried as disruption will continue. If teachers are sick, you won’t even get the worksheets to do either.

@mrshoho Yes, you’re probably right. They will reap what they sow. Unfortunately their children suffer too.

[quote BustopherPonsonbyJones]@palacegirl77
Do you have children of school age? If you do, regardless of how important you think it is to vaccinate teachers or give teachers a booster, you should be very worried about next term. A ‘mild’ case of Covid can knock someone out for a week and often for longer. If they get Covid, teachers won’t be able to teach; supply teachers won’t want to come into schools (they aren’t stupid) and schools will have to close as no one will be there to supervise the children. I have been a teacher for nearly a quarter of a century. In that time, the only things that have come close to closing schools in which I have worked was a norovirus outbreak and a petrol crisis (not at the same time!). I am not giving these warnings lightly or with any pleasure. You should be worried as disruption will continue. If teachers are sick, you won’t even get the worksheets to do either.

@mrshoho Yes, you’re probably right. They will reap what they sow. Unfortunately their children suffer too.[/quote]
I don't work in school but have 3 school age children and Bristol especially this term has had massive outbreaks within school closing some down.

In sept I have 1 year 11 1 year 1 1 year 7 and 1 nursery school all key year groups I am worried.

Really worried about eldest gcses
My anxious 12 year old settling
That my sen son will get a nice year 7 and be properly supported.
That my 3 .5 year old gets year nursery before reception next sept.

Sadly I think all these freedom lovers will think different

If they get covid badly
They lose family or freinds
That their kids catch long covid or lose teacher.
When they cant do a full food shop
When services they rely on collapse as bi collection been hit here.
When they lose income as if they get covid they can't work.
When sept school are total covid shot show and maybe eventually we told home educate again and cancel xmas.

My friend's daughter is in Year 6. Two week's ago they went on a 2 night residential. Immediately they got back, one child tested positive and the whole class had to isolate. Since then every child in the class of 30 and the teacher (who has been very poorly) has tested positive. This is what will happen if close contacts stay in school. The children on the trip didn't have symptoms but because of their prolonged close contact - which is what happens every day in school - they all got sick.

"Senior school children get tested daily but if they don't agree/can't will they still need to isolate (and therefore will teachers still need to be prepared with online work?)"

This would mean some disabled children would have large periods of time without an education given that many of those unable to test are those who cannot be taught remotely.

Covid will circulate round and round schools. Kids will miss school by feeling unwell. Vaccinated people can catch it and still get pretty unwell. Parents will complain when lots of staff are off sick.

@lonelyplanet

My friend's daughter is in Year 6. Two week's ago they went on a 2 night residential. Immediately they got back, one child tested positive and the whole class had to isolate. Since then every child in the class of 30 and the teacher (who has been very poorly) has tested positive. This is what will happen if close contacts stay in school. The children on the trip didn't have symptoms but because of their prolonged close contact - which is what happens every day in school - they all got sick.

This is absolute nonsense. If this actually happened it would be front page news!

[quote BustopherPonsonbyJones]@palacegirl77
Do you have children of school age? If you do, regardless of how important you think it is to vaccinate teachers or give teachers a booster, you should be very worried about next term. A ‘mild’ case of Covid can knock someone out for a week and often for longer. If they get Covid, teachers won’t be able to teach; supply teachers won’t want to come into schools (they aren’t stupid) and schools will have to close as no one will be there to supervise the children. I have been a teacher for nearly a quarter of a century. In that time, the only things that have come close to closing schools in which I have worked was a norovirus outbreak and a petrol crisis (not at the same time!). I am not giving these warnings lightly or with any pleasure. You should be worried as disruption will continue. If teachers are sick, you won’t even get the worksheets to do either.

@mrshoho Yes, you’re probably right. They will reap what they sow. Unfortunately their children suffer too.[/quote]
If theyve had 2 vaccs, they shouldnt get that ill. If they do, once theyre better they will have antibodies and it wont happen again. Funny how teachers are in such a perilous situation yet somehow theyve not caught it in the last 18 months (Thought schools were riddled?)

This is absolute nonsense. If this actually happened it would be front page news!

No it wouldn't, we've had a school close a week early for summer due to horrendous case rates and that didn't even make the local echo.