New York are lifting all covid restrictions this week

[socialmediamishap]

And yet the Daily Mail are reporting a 'leaked' document of WFH / masks forever and more restrictions in winter.

Surely the people that can will start to emigrate to countries that haven't fucked this up so badly if this way of living carries on and other countries return to normal...

@osbertthesyrianhamster I know! Our friends live in North Carolina and their restrictions have been very light compared to ours.

Banning sex between consenting adults who didn't live together. Banning adults from seeing their own families. Banning people from having whom they invited in their own homes. There wasn't a lot of that in the US.

US laws did not allow "banning" so some (but not all) blue states resorted to shaming and scaremongering. I have got family in the US and I can see how some of my relatives have been left mentally scarred over past 18 months. My very smart and rational family member is horrified that her 10 year old DD will have to go back to school in September post many months of virtual leaning. It is really sad.

On the other hand, my friends in New Hampshire are living a normal life so I agree the picture is very different across the country.

Specifically on NYC - if we compare it to London, it appears London with restrictions is more mobile than NYC without restrictions:

citymapper.com/cmi/nyc
citymapper.com/cmi/london

Even back in January, when London was in full lockdown, the mobility ratios were only marginally lower (high teens vs low 20s). People in the UK generally started getting on with lives way before most of "blue state" Americans regardless of formal rules and restrictions.

"They had only moderna or pfizer. So more effective jabs. Also maybe less hesitancy without the AZ issues plus a choice of jab."

The Pfizer has 98% effectiveness against the Delta variant...AZ has 92%.
The difference is mininal.

www.gov.uk/government/news/vaccines-highly-effective-against-hospitalisation-from-delta-variant

the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine is 96% effective against hospitalisation after 2 doses
the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine is 92% effective against hospitalisation after 2 doses

As someone prior said, you have to think of the US and fifty separate countries. You just can’t compare place like Mississippi and Vermont, with the former having about 35 percent fully vaccinated and the latter having 75 percent fully vaccinated.

The New England states are 68-75 percent fully vaccinated. I believe that 70 percent offers herd immunity. I guess we will see what happens re the Delta variant as this next month unfolds.

^^as, not and.

Right - the states all around me have 75% of over 12s fully vaccinated. (It’s actually 99% in my town.)

I feel like New England is well prepared for the Delta variant.

I’m not worried about hospitals being overwhelmed here.

@ZZTopGuitarSolo

Right - the states all around me have 75% of over 12s fully vaccinated. (It’s actually 99% in my town.)

I feel like New England is well prepared for the Delta variant.

I’m not worried about hospitals being overwhelmed here.

In NYC and like a poster said upthread, no one is worried about the Delta variant. We're 70% (partially) vaccinated so I'm not worried about hospitals being overwhelmed again.

I'm also shocked at the amount of vaccine panic and hesitancy I've seen on Mumsnet. No one I know in real-life was terrified to get vaccinated - even my pregnant friends have been queueing up to get their shot.

Yes - we ran a vaccine clinic in our middle school and the students signed up incredibly quickly. We were at something like 35% vaccinated in that age group within a couple of weeks. They understand that this is their route back to a normal life. Schools have now announced they'll be back to normal in September because the vaccination rates are so high - no distancing, quarantining or masks.

I think what people in the UK perhaps don't realise about the US is that the vast majority of people who've had their first shot here have also had their second. We're not waiting 12 weeks between shots. It's 3 weeks for Pfizer, 4 weeks for Moderna, and only one shot for J&J.

This is why people in the US are not so worried about the Delta variant, as two doses of any vaccine are very effective, and everyone over 12 who wants two doses has been offered it.

I know some parents who are worried about their under 12s, and I do feel for them, especially if they're medically vulnerable. Also those who are immunocompromised are still worried, because even two doses doesn't necessarily give them the same level of protection.

I’m very envious but we’ll get there soon enough.

We should take comfort from successes like NY and Israel - it’s proof it will happen here and can happen everywhere too.

ZZTop you're area sounds as if its done very well, and much better than the US as a whole.

If this is why the US are not that worried about the Delta variant then I would think again! India thought they had it beat.

I agree with opening up but I don't think its wise to be blind to the consequences of opening up.

How will these figures look in 4 weeks time when the UK still has a reasonable non vaccine hesitant population to vaccinate.

@ZZTopGuitarSolo

I think what people in the UK perhaps don't realise about the US is that the vast majority of people who've had their first shot here have also had their second. We're not waiting 12 weeks between shots. It's 3 weeks for Pfizer, 4 weeks for Moderna, and only one shot for J&J.

This is why people in the US are not so worried about the Delta variant, as two doses of any vaccine are very effective, and everyone over 12 who wants two doses has been offered it.

I know some parents who are worried about their under 12s, and I do feel for them, especially if they're medically vulnerable. Also those who are immunocompromised are still worried, because even two doses doesn't necessarily give them the same level of protection.

I was genuinely surprised there's such a big gap between vaccines in the UK - also that they never had a one-shot option, although, I know the J+J had it's issues.

Speaking personally as a New Yorker, I think one reason the vaccine rate is so high is because the spring of 2020 was terrifying. I'm not someone who's easily rattled, but the morgue in central park, the Hospital Ship and the army setting up a field hospital in the Javitz center was really frightening. DH used to go (masked) running on the local track with the marines and the Army medics every morning. NYC also has gigantic, generally well equipped hospitals and they were absolutely overrun. Seeing the city as a ghost town was like something out of a dystopian novel - it was horrible and I think everyone is so eager to get vaccinated because we never want to live like that again.

If this is why the US are not that worried about the Delta variant then I would think again! India thought they had it beat.

You keep talking about 'the US' as if it's one big homogenous mass. It's really not.

The CDC is worried about the Delta variant spreading in areas of low vaccination. It's not worried about it spreading in areas of high vaccination.

I remember reading about NY and feeling sick that your case figures were neck and neck with the whole of the UK’s at one point last spring and it was bad here @allfurcoatnoknickers. I think you’re right in that what people have been exposed to during covid has affected a lot of their outlooks.

I’m glad that NY is looking in much better shape now!

I agree, ZZ and allfurcoat. My father died from Covid in the US in December. My mother survived it. But she was fully vaccinated by March as was the rest of my family. My husband wasn't fully vaccinated (here in the UK) until June. My kids will be getting the Pfizer in the airport if they're offering it (in the US)! We want to move on with our lives, go on a cruise and live without restrictions like masks and distancing.

ZZTop

That is true. Same should be said for the UK. My county has over 62% of adults fully vaccinated and nearly 80% 1st dose so in a much better position than other areas.

ZZ I was replying to your statement BTW. Direct quote below just for your benefit.

This is why people in the US are not so worried about the Delta variant, as two doses of any vaccine are very effective, and everyone over 12 who wants two doses has been offered it.

I don't think you have much to worry about in your state, but if you take the US as a homogenous mass then you do!

@Cornettoninja We're so close to normal now, it's amazing feels like everyone came back to the city and brought friends - I've been here 7 years and I think this might be the most frenetic and alive I've ever seen the place. People are just so joyous right now.

To quote Cuomo "Even if it is a long day, and this is a long day, love wins, always. And it will win again, through this virus". It was a very, very long day.

(sorry, that was a bit of a thread de-rail. I'm having some feelings about this)

@Wakeupin2022

ZZ I was replying to your statement BTW. Direct quote below just for your benefit.

This is why people in the US are not so worried about the Delta variant, as two doses of any vaccine are very effective, and everyone over 12 who wants two doses has been offered it.

I don't think you have much to worry about in your state, but if you take the US as a homogenous mass then you do!

My point was that those who have chosen not to receive the vaccine are not worrying about the Delta variant because they're not worried about Covid generally.

Those who are worried about Covid have had ample opportunity to get fully vaccinated and hence are not worried about the Delta variant.

As I think I already said a couple of times above, some states may well have a bad time, but the 100 million plus of us in areas that are already approaching or at herd immunity are not too worried.

@ZZTopGuitarSolo Nailed it.

Don’t apologise @allfurcoatnoknickers, it’s really lovely to read of some joy!

[quote allfurcoatnoknickers]@Cornettoninja We're so close to normal now, it's amazing feels like everyone came back to the city and brought friends - I've been here 7 years and I think this might be the most frenetic and alive I've ever seen the place. People are just so joyous right now.

To quote Cuomo "Even if it is a long day, and this is a long day, love wins, always. And it will win again, through this virus". It was a very, very long day.

(sorry, that was a bit of a thread de-rail. I'm having some feelings about this)[/quote]
Remember the NY Tough video?

@ZZTopGuitarSolo Oh yes, brilliant video, it really brings it all flooding back though. I remember watching it on my sofa, on a freezing cold day with the whole city sheltering in place and just BAWLING.

Cuomo is problematic AF, but those are some very, very powerful words.

Amazing video.

My SIL and I are planning a girls weekend in NY as soon as I can fly over - she is in Colorado and I’m in London. Looking forward to fun times in one of our favourite places.

@socialmediamishap

And yet the Daily Mail are reporting a 'leaked' document of WFH / masks forever and more restrictions in winter.

Surely the people that can will start to emigrate to countries that haven't fucked this up so badly if this way of living carries on and other countries return to normal...

Feel free to emigrate, no one is forcing you to stay