Shameful treatment of children

[CottageGardener]

Taster days cancelled, work experience cancelled, sports days cancelled, exams cancelled, fetes cancelled, extra curriculum activities cancelled, end of year school assembly cancelled, transition day cancelled, trips cancelled, proms cancelled, the list goes on....

For a virus that 80% of the population now have antibodies for. The kids will never have a chance to do some of these things again. SHAMEFUL.

@CallmeHendricks reopening schools (which was done for a variety of reasons, not least childcare) isn't actually the same as prioritising children. The point is that many restrictions have been lifted, and these
are proportionally those that favour adult activities.

@JaniileJones - are you aware the rule of 30 still in place for outdoors activities? That's more than 1 form of year 11s (normally 32), let alone a whole year group. They cant move leavers proms to outdoor meet ups out of school hours. We are allowed unlimited numbers for a wedding, or sports, but not school based social activities outdoors.

So no, a BBQ or a picnic wouldn't work, there's not enough kids allowed.

Its so unfair on young people. My dc1 is moving to secondary this year. Transition day has been cancelled. Meet ups with his "house" at the local park with a bring your own picnic style affair and the kids play football is illegal due to numbers. Im sure it would be fine in private schools with smaller year/class numbers. 30 max rules out state schools being able to join in.

'having PND with no social support or easy access to the HV service'
'children who are very behind socially and fearful of other children'
'toddlers surrounded by nursery staff in masks'
'small children scared by testing'
'small children who have struggled to be seen for illness because they needed a negative covid test.'

*People have always been able to see others in exceptional circumstances. Gp treatment has continued throughout even if via phone triage

• some disadvantaged kids will be behind socially, true.
• so what if toddlers are surrounded by staff in face covers? Again, appropriate explanations from non hysterical parents will suffice. Look at how poor kids in hospital have to cope with people in face covers. *they aren't scared by testing unless an overanxious parent is projecting which reading this thread will be the biggest issue.
• small dc will have been seen as necessary. Primary Care services have continued.

I have sympathy for teachers they've had to try and keep educating dc throughout and now having to try and get education back on track but ime most are extremely capable and proactive and with the right support I'd expect they will be able to take on the challenge.

[quote Faffinator]@CallmeHendricks reopening schools (which was done for a variety of reasons, not least childcare) isn't actually the same as prioritising children. The point is that many restrictions have been lifted, and these
are proportionally those that favour adult activities.[/quote]
It was the very clear aim that schools would reopen before nearly all other restrictions were to be lifted, yes, because children and their education was a priority.
Pubs and restaurants were opened later, at the same time as/possibly even later than things like playgrounds and wider kids' activities.

'are you aware the rule of 30 still in place for outdoors activities? That's more than 1 form of year 11s (normally 32), let alone a whole year group. They cant move leavers proms to outdoor meet ups out of school hours'

Oh fgs so they have smaller gatherings for now. I didn't mean move the actual prom outdoors I meant they can socialise, just differently.

Honestly the constant 'but what about' on this thread 🙄.

@JaniieJones

So what if toddlers are surrounded by staff in face covers? Again, appropriate explanations from non hysterical parents will suffice. Look at how poor kids in hospital have to cope with people in face covers

Does it not occur to you that small children learn about language by imitating adults and copying mouth movements? That speech sounds need to be clearly enunciated to optimise this? That children learn to understand and empathise with others by studying faces to gauge emotions? And that if they are in childcare settings where masks are worn for long periods none of this will be happening in any remotely normal way?

Thankfully as far as I’m aware it’s fairly unusual for children in the U.K. to be around masked nursery staff all day (willing to be corrected on that one, but at DD’s nursery it’s masks for drop off and pick up only). But I really feel for those in the US who as well as being cared for by masked adults have been made to wear masks themselves from 2 onwards.

Seriously, they cant have one class.

That's not a leavers event. Fine they are cancelled because football and weddings (that could be held next year!) Are deemed more important, but let's not pretend there are other options that are just as good but inventive.

We have a "risk budget" now we arent all in total lockdown. But we have decided to spend that budget on things for adults, at the cost of the things for kids.

We have decided that the tax payet budget available should support various industries, but signficantly less than other 1st world countries are spending on educational recovery.

Pretending we are all in it together is a obvious lie. Children have been treated badly compared to other groups - particularly given the level of risk they have from catching covid - none of this was for their benefit. And everyone seems OK with that. And that's shit.

'Seriously, they cant have one class.That's not a leavers event'

🥱

It isn't a 'leavers event' true. They meet up with friends and have fun instead. Tbh the limos, huge expense on gowns etc with proms had all got a bit silly anyway. What an opportunity to pare it all down a bit, hmm?

You are completely dismissing the importance of these events to say goodbye. To be together. No the dresses and the limos and the drama. The getting together as a group and saying goodbye to the people who after your family, have been the most important to your life so far.

We have accepted that getting married matters to not just be legally wed, but to be able to share that with the people who matter to you. Why is it an adult event that could be delayed is seemed as important, but a child's life event (that can't be delayed by a year) is not?

Its not that we have banned all events over 30 people, but that we as a nation have picked ones that matter and ones that don't and ones that are purely for children (be it transition / welcome events at new schools, leavers /goodbye events at Old schools, sports days etc) and decided those aren't as important as sporting events and weddings.

If everyone was in the same boat, it wouldn't be as obvious.

We have allowed some mass gatherings. We have picked ones that don't include children.

@CottageGardener

Taster days cancelled, work experience cancelled, sports days cancelled, exams cancelled, fetes cancelled, extra curriculum activities cancelled, end of year school assembly cancelled, transition day cancelled, trips cancelled, proms cancelled, the list goes on....

For a virus that 80% of the population now have antibodies for. The kids will never have a chance to do some of these things again. SHAMEFUL.

The school I work in has transition starting later in the month. We also took our class out on a trip last week and the after school club is still still running. Not everything is cancelled.

If certain teachers on this thread think that all these events that children have missed aren’t important then they’re clearly in the wrong job.

This is the second year there’s been no school trips, leavers dos, induction days... children have missed so much.

How awful to say ‘it’s just sports day’

But obviously fine for loads of adults to travel abroad for a football match..

I think 'risk budget' is a good way to think about this, as MargosKaftan says.

Keeping children in face to face education, in crowded schools with crowded classrooms, often arriving by crowded transport, takes up a LOT of 'risk budget', and should obviously be every school's priority (and at a societal level, a significant part of the Government's priority for children).

If there is extra 'risk budget' left over - and that will obviously depend on a range of factors including the age of children, the current community and in-school Covid rate, physical layout of the school, age and vaccination status of staff - then of course spending it on 'extras', over and above face to face education, is desirable, but ONLY if the risk of these compromising ongoing face to face education is low.

If a Head - who is after all ultimately responsible for the H&S of the school - judges that there isn't enough risk budget for e.g. parents to attend sports days, or pupils from 20 feeder schools to mix in a new secondary with teachers (and then go back to their primaries the next day while the teachers go back to their ongoing secondary classes) without running a sizeable risk of ceasing face to face teaching of some or all pupils, then that is sad, but not unreasonable.

Children have sacrificied a massively disproportionate amount of their lives - obviously the whole exam disaster but their social life has completely gone to pot. While, adults are having a great time heading off to the euros, ascot, tennis and cricket matches ,mydaughter can’t even have 30 for an 18th birthday party because her wider circle of friends has completely disappeared over the last 18 months and she wouldn’t find that many people to invite , her social life was her raison d’etre but is now completely dwindled to almost nothing……and if I told her 82 year grand parents that it’s has come to this they’d be even more fucking pissed off than they already are - which of course she won’t because she’s been putting on a brave face for the last god knows how many months and wouldn’t want to see them upset .

@CallmeHendricks

To those who maintain that children have been put last in everyone's considerations throughout, I will point out that it was precisely because they were being prioritised that the Government actively sought to dismiss the terrible infection rates in schools of the Kent variant before Christmas, and to stick to the "schools are safe" mantra so they could reopen "as normal" in January.

And here we have the Delta variant, reportedly 60%+ times more transmissible than the Alpha, ripping through schools (in certain areas), although once again, the Government are suppressing data on it.

But yes, let's all complain about sports day being curtailed.

That wasn't for children. Particularly when the government had no idea of potential long term effects of Long Covid including in children.

It was because they needed the workers working. It was for child care.

They definitely don't seem to care about the health or education of CEV and CV children. Other countries are vaccinating over 12s. Tbf to the government, we have limited supply for now but they should at least try to get vaccines to vulnerable children.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jun/10/children-disabilities-priority-vaccination-england-education-shielding

They disappeared more than a year ago and many are still out of sight. When the pandemic hit, 53,000 under-18s in England with disabilities that made them vulnerable to coronavirus began to shield away at home.

Kept off school long after their classmates went back, and away from friends, they have found their childhoods put on hold. And while the vaccine rollout gave high-risk adults some reprieve in the new year, those aged under 16, who have not been eligible for any vaccine, are still living in limbo.

"It was because they needed the workers working. It was for child care."

Well, I know that was often trumpeted at the time, but actually, only 8% of the working population have children of (primary) school age (who would need childcare).

Really? That's a lot lower than I would have thought. Surprised.

Regardless, they definitely didn't - and still don't - seem to care about the 53,000 vulnerable children.

Well, I know that was often trumpeted at the time, but actually, only 8% of the working population have children of (primary) school age (who would need childcare).

I don’t recall that stat ever being verified.

As far as I recall it was just something pulled from twitter and repeated, continually, as gospel on here.

@JaniieJones - I was not sneering at bbqs on the beach - far from it. I was pointing out that it was you who is constantly sneering at others’ struggles. Just because your dcs are doing just fine, it does not mean that everyone else is in the same position.

Dismissing anyone’s disappointments or troubles is unkind and also quite nasty. So what if proms are a waste of money? Lots of kids really enjoy them. I’m sure you enjoy pursuits that others may well deem unnecessary. You have an absolutely self-centred view of life and win the most mealy-mouthed poster of the week award.

[quote IrmaFayLear]**@JaniieJones* - I was not sneering at bbqs on the beach - far from it. I was pointing out that it was you* who is constantly sneering at others’ struggles. Just because your dcs are doing just fine, it does not mean that everyone else is in the same position.

Dismissing anyone’s disappointments or troubles is unkind and also quite nasty. So what if proms are a waste of money? Lots of kids really enjoy them. I’m sure you enjoy pursuits that others may well deem unnecessary. You have an absolutely self-centred view of life and win the most mealy-mouthed poster of the week award.[/quote]
Oh irma. 'Mealy mouthed' I mean seriously.

Look it isn't that proms are a waste of money, my point being as they are now very ott events with expensive frocks hairdos and transport then perhaps this year with many struggling financially it isn't such a tragic idea to have smaller more laid back leavers celebrations.

Again, not dismissing anyone's disappointment. I am putting it in perspective. Many things are infact open now! Work round it and stop being so defeatist. I do hope that helps.

I must admit I was always cynical about 8%

I really don’t think that is accurate at all.

Ok, I did some very rough calculations. I took this graph of the population of the UK.

I took the working population as the groups 20-69 giving me a total working population of 42.22 million

I took the age of people most likely to have kids in primary school (hence needing school as childcare) to be 30-44, so 12.96 million potential parents of primary kids.

I divided it by two, as only one parent (most likely the woman) would be needed to provide childcare. 6.48 million.

Only roughly 80% of women have children. 5.184 million.

5.184/42.22 x 100 = 12.3%

So we're already down to 12.3% of the working population who couldn't work with schools closed and haven't factored in SAHM, the unemployed or people with other sources of childcare.

8% doesn't seem that implausible.

That would mean no one having a child any older than 33/34 though giraffe which seems to narrow it down a lot. Or any younger than 25/26.

Oh for goodness sake, I'm fed up hearing of the "poor children". You are giving them a rod for their own back by talking like that. Children are resilient normally but all this talk about how poor they are really isn't doing them any favours.

Poor "young people" So many of them haven't given a flying fuck about containing this virus and have behaved atrociously...so no...I don't feel "poor them" either.