Dh has been told to get back to the office

[SmiledWithTheRisingSun]

For a minimum of 2 days per week.
Is this an end to WFH?

Most people we know are still WFH
I'm the only person I know who is working from home!!

I think it’s daft not using a hybrid model. Some days in and some days at home.

I can’t work from home in my job. But I don’t see the point in making perfectly productive people come to the office 5 days a week. I’ll bet companies that don’t offer some WFH will struggle to recruit and retain staff over the coming years.

It has been bloody wonderful watching London come back to life.

My own team has been in the office on rotas since last August (apart from the actual lockdowns) as some work can only be done there. There are rotas for staff doing that work, and other rotas for more senior staff to be in the office to support them (regardless of their own role and whether or not they can WFH). This has felt fair and worked well.

I've been told it's up to local managers (me) to decide how we will be working going forward. So I'll talk to the team and we will probably do some continuation of the above with a bit more office time.

Some people's roles primarily mean they need to be in the physical office more and that's just how it is. But I'm hoping that some WFH can be provided for those who want it ... So long as we can get the job done. Which is, after all, what we are all here for?

@WhenSheWasBad

I think it’s daft not using a hybrid model. Some days in and some days at home.

I can’t work from home in my job. But I don’t see the point in making perfectly productive people come to the office 5 days a week. I’ll bet companies that don’t offer some WFH will struggle to recruit and retain staff over the coming years.

Who gets to decide who is 'perfectly productive' though? Employees may insist they are, but colleagues, clients and employers may not agree.

DH and I are both still wfh. My colleagues are starting to trickle back into work, but DH's London office is completely closed and all 7000-odd employees are wfh.

The hybrid model works for some people and not others. And that's the problem. If Sally works perfectly well from home, but Fred finds it hard to apply himself and Julie has to work on the sofa. In theory a line manager can deal with all those issues and leave Sally happily wfh, but it's much easier to treat everyone the same and have them all in. People will say a good line manager can manage it, but why would they if they don't need to?

It's always going to create friction if managers have to say Sally can wfh, but Fred, who does the same job , can't.

Some people are good at wfh, others really aren't. It's not only whether the role can be done at home it's whether the people can wfh.

It's likely the end of 100% remote working but I don't know anyone going back to the office 100%.

@OrangePowder

The hybrid model works for some people and not others. And that's the problem. If Sally works perfectly well from home, but Fred finds it hard to apply himself and Julie has to work on the sofa. In theory a line manager can deal with all those issues and leave Sally happily wfh, but it's much easier to treat everyone the same and have them all in. People will say a good line manager can manage it, but why would they if they don't need to?

It's always going to create friction if managers have to say Sally can wfh, but Fred, who does the same job , can't.

Some people are good at wfh, others really aren't. It's not only whether the role can be done at home it's whether the people can wfh.

I agree. The 'hybrid' model sounds great in theory, but throws up all sorts of issues in practice. What if there's a need for a quick impromptu meeting? Do they have to set up the room so that Sally can participate from home?

Not to mention that those with ambition for promotion may find they're passed over in favour of the person the boss actually gets to interact with in person. And are employers going to rent full office space so that Sally can pop in to 'touch base' once a week? Yes, I guess people can hot desk but that's pretty grim and not suitable for all jobs.

Some employers may reckon it's just more trouble than it's worth.

Indeed - those companies with a WFH workforce are going to find themselves lagging behind very quickly. It’s simply not possible to be as productive at home via a screen as it is in the office face to face. Plus WFH massively disadvantages anyone who lives in a small, cramped property with no adequate space to work.

I don't disagree with your 2nd point but you can't know productivity for every company. DHs industry has offered covid bonuses because figures are good.

Who gets to decide who is 'perfectly productive' though? Employees may insist they are, but colleagues, clients and employers may not agree

You shouldn’t punish the majority because of a mangers inability to manage their staff properly. There have always been employees who don’t pull their weight.
If those particular employees aren’t working as they should, then deal with those employees.
Banning WFH for everyone because of a few crap employees just sounds like poor management.

Won't this autumn be fun with all these ppl and companies now suddenly deciding wfh is rubbish!

We'll be back to lockdown again within weeks from September. Anyone with a cough will be off work plus anyone they have come into contact with on commutes, in sealed offices etc. Millions of tests, school classes sent home.

All because managers can't face their staff sitting on the other end of a screen rather than in the same room...

Human beings. We just don't learn.

Our company is marching us back in 5 days a week soon despite originally telling us a hybrid model would be the way forward.

Since this announcement 2 people have voted with their feet and moved to companies with hybrid set ups. I'm also looking for a new job.

Most of us are in our 20s and early 30s and not been vaccinated yet. The director who is enforcing the rule is fully vaccinated of course. I understand what @OrangePowder is saying completely - I am sure that is a challenge for employers.

Since the return to work was announced, I have suffered with anxiety and dreams about panic attacks, I wake up hardly feeling I can't breathe. Many of my co workers are feeling similar levels of anxiety and the fact we are returning to the same hot desking set up does nothing to alleviate it.

@WhenSheWasBad

Who gets to decide who is 'perfectly productive' though? Employees may insist they are, but colleagues, clients and employers may not agree

You shouldn’t punish the majority because of a mangers inability to manage their staff properly. There have always been employees who don’t pull their weight.
If those particular employees aren’t working as they should, then deal with those employees.
Banning WFH for everyone because of a few crap employees just sounds like poor management.

Those swinging the leg and doing fuck all "WFH" arguably are more to blame than their managers tbf.

I agree with this @Geamhradh. The announcement no wfh would be permitted came right after a colleague handed on her resignation to go and work in an office full time.

Working with her has been a great source of stress for me, as she is incredibly lazy and did next to none of the workload she shared with me. The management never dealt with it and now it feels we are all being punished for other people's problems.

@WhenSheWasBad

Who gets to decide who is 'perfectly productive' though? Employees may insist they are, but colleagues, clients and employers may not agree

You shouldn’t punish the majority because of a mangers inability to manage their staff properly. There have always been employees who don’t pull their weight.
If those particular employees aren’t working as they should, then deal with those employees.
Banning WFH for everyone because of a few crap employees just sounds like poor management.

Eh? Where did I say everyone should be 'banned' from WFH?

All I'm saying is that being 'perfectly productive' is subjective. Just because someone insists that they are, it doesn't mean their boss or clients will agree.

The hybrid model works for some people and not others. And that's the problem. If Sally works perfectly well from home, but Fred finds it hard to apply himself and Julie has to work on the sofa. In theory a line manager can deal with all those issues and leave Sally happily wfh, but it's much easier to treat everyone the same and have them all in. People will say a good line manager can manage it, but why would they if they don't need to

Sally sounds like an excellent employee, Fred sounds less great, either WFHing or in the office. If you make Sally come in 5 days a week, she’s probably going to get pissed off and move to another company where WFH is an option.

All I'm saying is that being 'perfectly productive' is subjective. Just because someone insists that they are, it doesn't mean their boss or clients will agree.

Very job specific, if DH & I ceased to be less productive it would be pretty obvious at the end of the month.

Eh? Where did I say everyone should be 'banned' from WFH? All I'm saying is that being 'perfectly productive' is subjective. Just because someone insists that they are, it doesn't mean their boss or clients will agree

Apologies iced I thought you were implying that WFH wouldn’t work because employees think they are doing a great job but their managers / clients disagree. I obviously read more into your post than you intended.

@WhenSheWasBad have to agree about poor management. I am grateful not to be working for someone like that.

Productivity isn't always subjective. I know that I'm clearing more cases a day at home than I did in the office -about 10 a day vs 7 a day in the office. None of the interruptions and racket.

@WhenSheWasBad

The hybrid model works for some people and not others. And that's the problem. If Sally works perfectly well from home, but Fred finds it hard to apply himself and Julie has to work on the sofa. In theory a line manager can deal with all those issues and leave Sally happily wfh, but it's much easier to treat everyone the same and have them all in. People will say a good line manager can manage it, but why would they if they don't need to

Sally sounds like an excellent employee, Fred sounds less great, either WFHing or in the office. If you make Sally come in 5 days a week, she’s probably going to get pissed off and move to another company where WFH is an option.

This. I’m sally. Happy in my company. But if they ask me to go back in 5 days a week then I’ll find another company that trusts me and that is happy not to have me in everyday

I am quite amused by people at my work who are desperate to stay at home but have no problem socialising in pubs and restaurants. We have tonnes of space in the office, not allowed to sit less than 2m apart etc. They claim anxiety in some cases but this anxiety magically vanishes in the presence of beer apparently 🤷‍♀️

@tappitytaptap

I am quite amused by people at my work who are desperate to stay at home but have no problem socialising in pubs and restaurants. We have tonnes of space in the office, not allowed to sit less than 2m apart etc. They claim anxiety in some cases but this anxiety magically vanishes in the presence of beer apparently 🤷‍♀️

My problem is not the office. Is the commute. I lose 2h/day of my life on a bus or waiting for a bus. Instead nowadays I spend it with my son / doing exercise or actually working. I don’t mind going 1/2 days max to the office. Full time ? Nah thanks.

My company does reviews every 3 months. Your colleagues give their opinion about whether you’re productive etc , so If anyone is not pulling up their weight they can see it even if we’re wfh.

Tappitytaptap. It's nothing to do with proximity to other people. It's the constant yackety yacking going on when I'm trying to work.

Plus our office was always oppressively hot. There was a constant battle over the thermostats and in the end an 'always cold' manager taped them up.

It's an open plan office of course. DH has his own office where he can shut the door and blinds. Now for that I'd be happy to go in 5/5.

I also work for consultancy where before the projects had to be based where I live as otherwise I’d deployed to another part of the country / world.

Nowadays I can work on a project that is based in another office with people that are working from offices around the country and world. Resourcing is much easier this way as anyone from the company can work for that project no matter the location