I refused the AZ vaccine, now being judged for it

[cosmoswithcovids]

My husband's friend is a Dr, he called yesterday to tell my DH they had spare vaccine and to come over if we wanted one (DH is 33, I'm 30).

We got there and he told us it was AZ, I said I wanted to wait until I was offered the alternative that under 40s are advised to have. My DH looked at me as though I had two heads.

We joined them for drinks at the pub last night where Dr and a couple of other friends were discussing anti-vaxers and I was referenced as one of them. I did reiterate that I'm very keen to be vaccinated but not with AZ. It was then mansplained to me that discrediting the AZ jab (which they've all had and are fiiiiiiiiiiine) was the behaviour of an anti vaxer. I was just meant to feel a bit like an uneducated idiot (I'm not, I'm a solicitor, I'm quite bright) and although my husband says he understood why I didn't want it, the risk is "theoretical" (is it?!)
For the sake of another couple of weeks, I'd rather just wait and have the one which is safer! I'm just feeling a bit rubbish about it all really, I felt quite bounced into it when we got there and it was quite a stress for me having to justify why I didn't want it once we arrived.

If you make a controversial choice, make it. But be prepared to stand up for yourself.

It’s controversial to follow government guidance?

@MaMaLa321 but I didn't post on AIBU? I posted on the coronavirus board?

I don't want my opinion validating, I hadn't really appreciated that they could see me mostly as unreasonable due to wasting a vaccine. And that wasn't my intention as previously explained.

I've had my first dose of AZ but I think you did the right thing. Why put yourself through extra stress when for the sake of a few weeks you can have the recommended one. They were bullies.

Loads of GP practices have been ringing round people they know since the beginning. I don't see much problem with that either as long as the main mechanism of delivery is through the priority lists. Not wasting doses is more important than a small percentage of people who get it because of happenstance.

I honestly do not believe that other posters have not picked up on this angle.I really dont. Maybe coronablindness or something.

Or because it's utter nonsense 😂

What is a GP doing offering friends a vaccine that is not recommended for their age group by our own government? Very unprofessional, questionable even.

In no other medical or health situation would it be ok to try and influence another’s decision over their own body and medical treatment.
Vaccinations are important but so is respecting the rights of individuals and not guilt tripping over herd immunity etc.

I'm 30 and will not be having AZ if it's what's on offer. It has been advised against for under 40s. Happy to have Moderna or Pfizer. They are out of order.

You know Pfizer also has a blood clot risk right?

I've just looked it up.
Apparently the risk of these specific type of blood clots if you have Pfizer is approximately 4 in a million.

AZ is 5 in a million.

The risk if you get covid is 100 times greater.

@MRex thank you for the link. I had my coil put in recently after my second child. I was already cautious as I've suffered a previous ectopic with the copper coil.

I don't really like the idea of the hormonal birth control but were sexually active and we don't want anymore children now, although haven't committed to "never" so I'm just trying to be responsible and weigh up risks with birth control. I'm aware everything holds a risk factor but personally I'd decided I would rather wait as per govt advice on the vaccine?

I assume your DH’s friend is a GP? Hardly an expert in virology or vaccines. Perhaps just say you prefer to adhere to the formal scientific advice.

@majesticallyawkward I agree with you. I actually think the 'offer' of a different vaccination has just been added to the narrative to encourage more people to get vaccinated.

When it was first announced on BBC news they said an alternative vaccine can be offered but the risk of blood clots hasn't changed. In other words (to me) 'we want to be seen to be offering an alternative to make sure people get vaccinated but the risk is so minuscule it's not a concern'.

[quote Tryingtryingandtrying]**@mangoontoast* @pyewacket* For a 30 year old woman in England at the moment the risk of ending up in ICU with a blood clot caused by AZ is higher than chance of catching covid and ending up in ICU. This is not a theoretical risk. Young people have died in this country following these very rare side effects of the jab. Just because their faces haven't been splashed across newspaper front pages doesn't mean it didn't happen[/quote]
I’ve spent the last year in ICU and the youngest patient we had was 18. He arrested 3 times but survived, just. Apart from that I’ve treated people in their 30’s, sadly not always successfully. And incidentally, Covid will and can give you a PE. I’ve had to deal with that. But to say you are more at risk from the AZ vaccine than Covid itself is tabloid scaremongering bollocks.

Yes. I think you’re a bit of an idiot too. But it’s your choice. I hope the gamble pays off and you get the vaccine ASAP.

@GingerbreadPlease

Doctors offering spare vaccines to their pals? That's what needs addressed, they need a priority list of local people or something.

What on earth made you jump to the conclusion that they don't have such a list and haven't used it? Particularly In the U.K. where most priority patients have had both vaccines by now and it's now being offered to the less urgent groups.

I wouldn't call a doctor explaining why he thinks you should have taken the vaccine mansplaining. He is a qualified expert who happens to be a man. Still ultimately it's your choice

How can you be antivaxif you're going to have it?! More selecti-vax. Bottom line is it's none of their business. Anyway the AZ makes many people feel quite ill so you've dodged that hopefully.
Yanbu.

@GingerbreadPlease

Doctors offering spare vaccines to their pals? That's what needs addressed, they need a priority list of local people or something.

They will have a priority list and will have called those people first, as well as vaccinating any of the helpers at the clinic. But it’s often difficult to get hold of people. OP it’s your choice (mistaken in my opinion but that’s beside the point), but you should have ascertained it was AZ and not gone, and they could have quickly called someone else.

[quote cosmoswithcovids]@MaMaLa321 but I didn't post on AIBU? I posted on the coronavirus board?

I don't want my opinion validating, I hadn't really appreciated that they could see me mostly as unreasonable due to wasting a vaccine. And that wasn't my intention as previously explained. [/quote]
What are you looking for then ?

My ex was very ill with embolisms following chemotherapy. She is going to wait for the Pfizer vaccine. I imagine if she had a bad reaction to the Astrazenica jab the same experts would be saying ' well you knew the risks'.

DD 21 had her second AZ yesterday.

I think you should have accepted it, I really hope it wasn't wasted.

If you're antivax you're against all vaccines, I have a friend (abroad) like this. You are obviously not antivax you'd just rather wait a couple weeks for a different make. You're fortunate to be able to do that but you're also fortunate to live in a country with free healthcare, a benefit system, potable water that comes out the tap and a minimum wage.

It sounds like this was a group of men wanting to put the 'silly woman' down and make themselves feel clever tbh. There is a risk, it's not 'theoretical' and although I'm glad to be vaccinated, if I could have had an alternative to AZ at 45 I would.

OP you did the right thing IMO. The vaccine was most likely going to waste anyway. It is all very well your husband's friends saying they'd had it without an issue - at the time they probably had it was before we knew of the link. Personally I wouldn't socialise with them again - it was all uncalled for.

There are huge gaps in our knowledge - e.g. there has been no retrospective study looking at the incidence of potential clotting issues following vaccination in the older population - it is not beyond the realms of possibility there is a link that has been missed because there is a higher incidence of clots in the older population generally.

To people saying the GP shouldn’t have called his friend and should have a waiting list, they probably do. We have a waiting list and do call the people on it, but sometimes it’s the end of the day, we’ve called in a load of extras from the list already, and the last, but one person booked doesn’t turn up. It’s late. Should we (a) ring 10 people on the waiting list to find one who can make it and then wait an hour for them to arrive, (b) ring someone we know who is local and we’re pretty sure hasn’t already had it elsewhere and is likely to be able to get here in 10 minutes, or (c) throw it in the bin?

As regards your question op, in an ideal world you’d have checked before going which vaccine you were being offered, but the world is not ideal. These things go wrong, some vaccines do end up being wasted despite peoples best efforts. You were following government advice not to have AZ and they should not be judging you for that.

You may well have to wait longer than a couple of weeks for a different vaccine though. We have no idea when we’re getting another delivery of Pfizer and haven’t even had a sniff of Moderna yet. That said, we rarely know what we’re getting until a few days before it arrives.

[quote cosmoswithcovids]@SarahMused we went at the end of the day for the unused vaccines that would be thrown away, sorry, that part wasn't clear. My DH's friend called to see whether we wanted unwanted one. I wish my DH had asked but I assumed that as the advice was for under 40s to have an alternative, we wouldn't have been offered AZ.

I understand that the risks are minuscule but I'm an over worrier at the best of times and I'd just prefer to wait for the alternative, having waited this long it seems unnecessary for me not to. The unreasonable part of me also knows that I always have an extreme reaction to bites and medication and so, unreasonably, I think I'll be one of those unlucky few who develops a blood clot.
I just don't think it's fair of them to label me an anti vaxer, I absolutely am not. [/quote]
Actually @cosmoswithcovids what seems very unfair is that your DH and you were offered to jump the queue because your have a Dr who is a friend. !!!!!!!

And the AZ vaccine doesn't 'go off'. The Pfizer one does as it needs to be kept at a low temp before being opened.

The leading scientists are saying that AZ poses a risk for women under a certain age and that they should get a different vaccine. In european countries, other vaccines are automatically offered as a matter of policy. @gottakeeponmovin says a doctor isn't mansplaining but to be fair (a) a doctor should have probably told the OP in advance it was AZ and (b) a doctor behaving like that down the pub sounds pretty unprofessional so despite his qualifications I would say his behaviour in that moment could be fairly downgraded to mansplaining. I am sorry OP i am not an antivaxxer either and based on the advice coming from leading scientists, i am hoping for a nonAZ vaccine too.