Question to Those of you who reckon UK should have closed borders to India long ago

[lljkk]

When should they have closed... on what date, and why on that date?
Plus how "closed" would that mean, onto "red list" or something even stricter -- how strict?

I'm thinking how the "should have closed borders to India sooner" criteria would affect next decisions about which countries to put on red list next.

While people in UK, haven't been to holiday and have to had limited weddings, people could go to India attended weddings birth cermonys ect as they are essential Apparently

This. We couldn't cross the border from Scotland to England to visit family, and funerals, weddings etc have been limited. Why the hell were people going to India?

But we already knew the positivity rate of tests in India was really high, which suggested that however much testing India was doing it wasn’t doing enough and was missing a large number of cases.

Given the fact we are island then we had an advantage in sealing the borders - perhaps had the border been shut earlier to all countries as many asian countries have done with clear quarantine measures we could have got back to normal quicker

The Indian variant is probably everywhere. It’s certainly been detected throughout Europe, American and even AUSTRALIA.

Closing borders wouldn’t have worked. It’s a virus. And how could we have stopped British nationals returning to our country? Australia tried to do that and frankly it was a disgusting move.

We are naturally going to see more cases here due to our Asian communities and the face we are looking for variants more so than anywhere else in the world.

I follow Mac n Chise on Twitter. They are a molecular biologist and they stated days ago (before Matt Hancock today) that the vaccines will protect against variants. Their tweets are very positive and reassuring and in complete contrast to the bollocks we seem to have to read from Sky News; the BBC; the Guardian and the Daily Fail. All who are trying to generate excitement and clicks.

I think the Indian variant will go the same way as the Brazilian and South African variants.

I follow Mac n Chise on Twitter.

Is this the person mentioned on another thread. Someone pointed out they're anonymous. They claim to be a scientist (although not a virologist or epidemiologist) but don't give a real name and could actually be anybody?

Closing borders does work - look at New Zealand they have had a handful of covid cases and will be able to vaccinate their population then open back up safely.

Our excess deaths and long lockdowns were caused by the conservative governments poor and slow decision making.

@Tealightsandd

I follow Mac n Chise on Twitter.

Is this the person mentioned on another thread. Someone pointed out they're anonymous. They claim to be a scientist (although not a virologist or epidemiologist) but don't give a real name and could actually be anybody?

Well if they are anybody, they’re doing fairly well. Some influential followers and a large following. They are also extremely well read looking at their tweets. I kinda trust them a lot more than I trust the writers at the Daily Mail that’s for sure.

Also, SAGE described the Indian variant as having a ‘realistic possibility’ of being more transmissible...let’s see what that means....it means that there is a 40-50% chance that it might be more transmissible. So not proven not that likely at the moment.

One final thing, SAGE modellers give a range of possibilities to the media, for example... ‘we could see between 1000 and 63,000 deaths over the summer’ and the media will jump on the most pessimistic value and tell us that’s what the scientists said....and then social media goes nuts and thinks that we’re all going to be locked down again by the end of the month 🙄

Frankly, it’s getting ridiculous.

@Sadieeloise5687

Closing borders does work - look at New Zealand they have had a handful of covid cases and will be able to vaccinate their population then open back up safely.

Our excess deaths and long lockdowns were caused by the conservative governments poor and slow decision making.

New Zealand has a population of 5 million people. They don’t have the diverse communities we have.
We could not lock down as they have.

Of course we could have locked down like NZ! Of course NZ has diverse communities...
You are making excuses for this crap government.

@Mathshelpme

It's not the daily mail I'm following. It's the experts (the ones who aren't anonymous). Including but not only the scientists of SAGE.

Even shut the stable door after horse has long bolted, nothing to see here shake hands with Covid patients Covid takes Christmas off Boris is concerned. That says a lot.

New Zealand has a population of 5 million people. They don’t have the diverse communities we have.
We could not lock down as they have.

Taiwan, Singapore, South Korea, Japan, Vietnam.

Dense large populations.
They did the same as NZ. Truly essential travel only with proper quarantine.

Japan population: approx 125 million
Total Covid deaths: just over 10,000.

UK population: approx 68 million.
Total Covid deaths: 150,000.

Many African countries also did it.

It was also frankly insane that the government permitted delegates from India to attend the G7 in person earlier this month, some of whom then tested positive.
You couldn’t make this shit up.

www.theguardian.com/world/2021/may/05/indian-delegation-at-g7-in-london-forced-to-self-isolate-for-covid

@Tealightsandd

New Zealand has a population of 5 million people. They don’t have the diverse communities we have. We could not lock down as they have.

Taiwan, Singapore, South Korea, Japan, Vietnam.

Dense large populations.
They did the same as NZ. Truly essential travel only with proper quarantine.

Japan population: approx 125 million
Total Covid deaths: just over 10,000.

UK population: approx 68 million.
Total Covid deaths: 150,000.

Umm, aren’t Japan having a terrible time right now?

Here you go

And remember, our vaccine rollout has been very successful. Plus those with natural immunity, we are looking good.

Places like Australia and NZ have no immunity and the vaccine rollout hasn’t been great. There is also a lot of vaccine hesitancy. I know where I would rather be right now...actually it’s the States.

It's a tiny blip. Particularly compared to us.

@Mathshelpme

And remember, our vaccine rollout has been very successful. Plus those with natural immunity, we are looking good.

Places like Australia and NZ have no immunity and the vaccine rollout hasn’t been great. There is also a lot of vaccine hesitancy. I know where I would rather be right now...actually it’s the States.

Australia and New Zealand are fine wrt their vaccine rollouts.

They're content to go at a slower pace. They don't need to panic rush like us.

Nevertheless Australia's already done the majority of its aged care residents. They're getting there. They just don't have to deal with the huge numbers dead, ill with long Covid, and a devastated economy at the same time.

Yes Japan are seeing more cases at the moment, but deaths remain around the 11k mark. Let's hope it stays that way. Our management of the situation in the UK had been appalling.

But right now we are in a good position. That’s being forgotten in favour of panicking about variants that our vaccines work against.

Anyway, one has to go to bed. I have work in the morning. Hold whatever opinion you please. I’m personally looking forward to the old normal resuming soon.

Oh Christ, not this again.

I am losing count of the number of times I have repeated this to Tea

Tealight, but WE DO NOT HAVE NZ STYLE QUARANTINE IN JAPAN

People just self isolate at home and nobody checks up on them. The Indian variant is already here too.

We have had a low CUMULATIVE number of deaths overall but nobody is too sure why.

The number of deaths per day in Japan has been well over the UK figures for quite a while now. See the Worldometer site. Cases too (and cases will be a massive underestimation because Japan hardly tests anyone).

Just because a country is East Asian does not mean we all have uniform approaches.

@Mathshelpme

And remember, our vaccine rollout has been very successful. Plus those with natural immunity, we are looking good.

Places like Australia and NZ have no immunity and the vaccine rollout hasn’t been great. There is also a lot of vaccine hesitancy. I know where I would rather be right now...actually it’s the States.

Australia have had 910 covid deaths. During both peaks we had more deaths in a day than they’ve had over the entire pandemic. Their vaccine rollout is underway & doesn’t have to be done at the same speed as ours because they have the situation well contained. I spoke to my Australian family this morning, they are living a normal life, just can’t travel abroad. Given the option I’d go for 910 deaths & a slow vaccine rollout.

@Kokeshi123
I'm referring to Japan's border restrictions, not lockdown (or lack of). It's been widely reported that Japan has (to quote one of the media outlets) "some of the strictest border controls in the world". I was given the link by my half Japanese friend. Also, I know you're in Tokyo. Her family aren't from Tokyo and I suspect that what she says is true - that Tokyo (and the people living there) is like London. Not very representative of the whole country.

If I wasn't too tired I'd post the link to the Japanese government travel information pages, which shows the current restrictions.

I admit that Vietnam is probably even stricter.

I feel very sorry for the airline staff, it must be terrifying. There’s been a story in the newspapers this weekend about British Airways, who are still operating flights to India, but the cabin crew are too scared to report for work. They normally have a stopover, but British Airways are now generously (!) saying they can fly straight back after completing the outbound leg to minimise risk.