Breaking News Boris press conference tonight 14/05/21

[Whichjab]

So, is Monday under threat? Change to school masks or hugs?

frumpety
If you do local lockdown people travel to more open one and spread variant that way

Only if you let them.

How do you stop them?

MarshaBradyo If you're not sure of the answer to this, then you haven't experienced a truly tough lockdown. Perhaps a long one, but not a lockdown where you cannot leave your home except for three or four reasons (and not twice in one day). There are police-manned checkpoints to ensure no-one can leave the lockdown area, and police also patrol public area to ensure people don't linger or are in areas they shouldn't be. They are also curfews. That is a lockdown. And yes, I've gone through an 15-week one - and it worked. COVID cases dropped significantly in that time period and after lockdown was lifted, didn't rise again.

@TheClaws we do not have the police or army manpower to implement such measures

@PrincessNutNuts and @picturesandpickles

I said to DP afterwards ‘he wants people to use their common sense’ - and DP replied ‘maybe people will’.

Like you @princessnutnuts, I have a family member I need to be extremely careful around - and will be in desperate need of the NHS over the next coming months. So I will continue to be careful.

I’ve been trying to picture myself in my twenties - with my life goals being severely impacted by Covid - and whether this would have altered by view. I’m currently more in favour of the more Labour approach. I think Boris is now focussed more saving the economy and relying on people to be careful.

@TheClaws, that sounds really tough, especially for 15 weeks !

[quote Wellbythebloodyhell]@TheClaws we do not have the police or army manpower to implement such measures[/quote]
We do imo, if you had very strict rules most people would follow them and it is easier to enfore when very clear/draconian.

Whether they are the correct aproach is a different matter - UK lockdown in 2021 had fewer restrictions on leaving the house but was still very effective at reducing spread.

@TheClaws

frumpety If you do local lockdown people travel to more open one and spread variant that way

Only if you let them.

How do you stop them?

MarshaBradyo If you're not sure of the answer to this, then you haven't experienced a truly tough lockdown. Perhaps a long one, but not a lockdown where you cannot leave your home except for three or four reasons (and not twice in one day). There are police-manned checkpoints to ensure no-one can leave the lockdown area, and police also patrol public area to ensure people don't linger or are in areas they shouldn't be. They are also curfews. That is a lockdown. And yes, I've gone through an 15-week one - and it worked. COVID cases dropped significantly in that time period and after lockdown was lifted, didn't rise again.

No we don’t have the enforcement to do that here.

We’ve had it tough though for months without it. And also worked at getting numbers very low.

@TheClaws when you experienced these measures where the neighbouring towns/cities open as normal and just your area locked down? Your saying these measures could be implemented for local lockdowns to stop people going into other areas, what about those people who live in the lockdown area but work or go to school in the neighbouring town that isn't in lockdown and vice versa?

Sorry my comment was for @picturesandpickles

[quote KurtWilde]@AlmostSummer21 I'm not blaming Boris for people acting like idiots. And saying one rule for one and another rule for others is just a turn of phrase. Of course I know there aren't differing rules.

But Boris IS to blame for the shitty handling of the entire pandemic. And nothing he says on Monday will make any difference to how I intend to proceed. [/quote]
Yes it's a 'saying'. One which you're using incorrectly. The Dominic Cummings situation was a good example of that, this is not.

Irrespective of what anyone thinks of how it's been handled, ignoring the rules risks other people health, not the governments.

I (even if it was still against the rules) don't actually have a problem with you hugging your mum if you're both vaccinated snd if you're a sensible kind of person who has reasonable risk assessed, but I do take issue with people saying 'screw the road map, I'm doing what I want' because it snowballs by making others think 'why should I bother, if she's not'?! Which leads to things like what you're seeing in your neighbourhood.

I hope you enjoy hugging your mum & I hope you both stay well 🤗💐

Wow you really love the lockdown life don’t you!

@Bagamoyo1

No, I don't. That's such a stupid thing to say.

I'd prefer a couple more weeks as we were (which was not a full lockdown) to investigate the Indian variant and see how it needs to be handled than rush into this next really big lifting of restrictions & risk going back into a harsher lockdown

How the living fuck people interpret that as 'lockdown loving' I don't know. I just assume it's lack of understanding about virus transmission & the consequences. After 16 months you'd think people would have a clue, but seemingly not

UK lockdown in 2021 had fewer restrictions on leaving the house but was still very effective at reducing spread

Was it? several weeks longer than than the LDs in europe, France's recent LD has a 10km travel limit.

There is also race issues to having a draconian UK local LD, so won't happen, hence BJ's common sense advice... which doesn't exist, we all have differing versions of c/sense!

Localised low vaccination rates were known about weeks ago, travel from India allowed to continue... nothing done until too late.

@Gladimnotcampinginthisweather

I am tired of the Chicken Licken approach to Covid19. Either the Indian variant is not causing more hospitalisations and deaths as reported or it is.

The problem is, with the gap between positive tests, hospitalisation and death it's simply too soon to know. It's too new here, we need a few more weeks to get the data.

Which is why it would have made sense to put Monday lifting on hold for a couple of weeks, to get more data.

No ones suggesting going backwards, just pausing the roadmap. But no, Boris values his popularity too much to take the unpopular decision until absolutely forced.

@GlomOfNit

I'm watching Independent Sage at the moment and the data does indicate that the Indian variant B1617.2 is more transmissible than the other variants currently in the UK (Brazil and SA variants haven't gone away but they peaked and fell), including the Kent variant that is (was??) the dominant variant here. At the moment they're thinking that the Indian variant isn't necessarily vaccine resistant, it's just more transmissible, but that in itself is worrying if you get large outbreaks in contained areas, as they can provide a 'reservoir' for further mutation.

I don't know why we wouldn't be worried about this. I am also very 'oh FFS' - we have a break booked in the UK for half term and I am really looking forward to going into museums and maybe having the odd coffee inside while the weather is so shite - but what else are we meant to do? BJ should probably put the breaks on further lifting of restrictions for at least a couple of weeks - it wouldn't have a massive impact on our lives and the economy (2 weeks) but might be enough to put into place local measures to try and stamp out this new variant.

We are still doing really well. Why would we want to throw it away by saying 'well fuck it, I'm done'? I just don't get it.

Exactly!!

[quote MarcelineMissouri]I think boris will be saying Monday going ahead as planned, we’re keeping an eye on Indian variant and doing x,y and z to help.

Initial data on vaccines working looks positive

twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/status/1393124817902133249?s=21[/quote]
They don't currently know if it's the vaccine that's helping or whether this is simply the virus doing what it has done with every variant so far, started with the young (the sociable age group) & moved up the age brackets as it finds more easily infected people. So we might just not be there yet.

Fingers crossed it's the vaccine making the difference!

I'd like to understand what all those people travelling to and from India were doing. It's been illegal to travel for leisure so all these people were travelling for business? Was their paperwork checked? Was anyone not travelling for business, and if so, were they fined?

The management of this, while the rest of us sat at home, sticking to the rules, was disgraceful. And now look where we are.

My profession has been decimated by this. Everything I've worked for has gone. And yet it continues because we allowed people to think the rules don't apply to them. Or so it seems. I'd just like to understand why they were travelling. Did anyone check people were quarantining?

[quote Wellbythebloodyhell]@TheClaws when you experienced these measures where the neighbouring towns/cities open as normal and just your area locked down? Your saying these measures could be implemented for local lockdowns to stop people going into other areas, what about those people who live in the lockdown area but work or go to school in the neighbouring town that isn't in lockdown and vice versa?[/quote]

If they were able to work from home, most people did. Only essential businesses stayed open. Only In exceptional circumstances could anyone travel outside the lockdown area (it was quite a large area, anyway). Neighbouring towns were open - cautiously - but geographically, they are some distance away, so it was relatively easy to enforce a lockdown of this type.

It is a problem. Why are so many people still travelling? This could really damage our country, the economy and what is left of our collective mental health. It should be stopped immediately. People travelling for 'essential' reasons, there is nothing more essential to the country than some end to this nightmare.

@jasjas1973

UK lockdown in 2021 had fewer restrictions on leaving the house but was still very effective at reducing spread

Was it? several weeks longer than than the LDs in europe, France's recent LD has a 10km travel limit.

There is also race issues to having a draconian UK local LD, so won't happen, hence BJ's common sense advice... which doesn't exist, we all have differing versions of c/sense!

Localised low vaccination rates were known about weeks ago, travel from India allowed to continue... nothing done until too late.

The issue for the UK was it came too late (Johnson's trade mark!) so took a very long time, but yes the drop off was effective.

We are not the only country to have imported the Indian variant. www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2021/may/14/indian-covid-variant-which-countries-have-highest-infection-rates

Be interesting to watch those countries too. I just hope this is all panic stations and that's it.

JVCI guy on BBC1 saying the India variant will become the covid strain in wide spread circulation very soon.

We don't know enough about how the AZ vaccine works against this strain yet, esp transmission.

Is Pfizer more effective?

Clearly the travel restrictions and quarantine system hasn’t worked. Bit late now but an enquiry in to that needs to happen. What’s the point in having a system that isn’t working? It needs to change. If the government acted too late with regards to India (and yet again we all suffer and more businesses collapse) then they need to be held accountable.

For example, those the delegates that travelled from India who were exempt from quarantine then subsequently tested positive.

I will be seeing my northern family (all double vaccinated) as planned in a few weeks as I’m sick of the government constantly messing this up and then expecting us to pay the price. I won’t have massive parties and if things aren’t open I can’t go. But apart from that I’ll live my life the best I can and ignore their ‘rules’.

@Leonardsgirl

I'd like to understand what all those people travelling to and from India were doing. It's been illegal to travel for leisure so all these people were travelling for business? Was their paperwork checked? Was anyone not travelling for business, and if so, were they fined?

The management of this, while the rest of us sat at home, sticking to the rules, was disgraceful. And now look where we are.

My profession has been decimated by this. Everything I've worked for has gone. And yet it continues because we allowed people to think the rules don't apply to them. Or so it seems. I'd just like to understand why they were travelling. Did anyone check people were quarantining?

I agree, it’s an absolute shambles. We shouldn’t br getting any variants in from abroad. The government have really fucked up. I’m done with the rules now.

If I was Johnson i would be asking 'what could I do now that would make this situation less risky' - maybe something like:

• reverse the guidance on masks in schools
• reverse guidance on overnights stays in family homes
• reverse guidance on close physical contact

• carry on with unlocking hospitality
• carry on with in home meet ups - but really emphasise need for distancing

That seems a decent half way house, while we wait two more weeks for data.

The problem from the satrt os we have carried on while we wait for data - then had to over react. We should be cautious for a shorttime, then hopefully things would be less messy when we do realise there is a problem.

But Johnson is not going to change - he is absolutely rubbish at managing covid.

My sister travelled from Africa last year (when travel was permitted). She had to quarantine, I can't remember exactly for how long, I think it was for 14 days. No-one checked. Not once.

I've tried to keep positive about losing my career, my savings and everything I've worked for. I've got my health. But it's getting hard when situations like this make you realise we really are not all in it together making sacrifices.

AZ vaccine DOES work against the Indian variant, they know this already. So the issue is not the vaccine as such, but the transmissible rate. Many millions are still waiting for second doses, many millions are unvaccinated. So the potential for things to go wrong is still high. Hence the decision to fast track all second does to over fifties, and to try and get as many people vaccinated as possible. This is now a race against time.