No more masks in classrooms - hurray!

[TeddingtonTrashbag]

Hurray!
I am a secondary teacher and just hope it really happens.

www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/05/06/exclusive-end-masks-classroom-boris-johnson-defies-unions/

Simplistically: if I meet 1 infected person every 100 days, under conditions perfectly suited to spreading the virus, and I have a vaccination that is 95% effective, my change of being infected is 100x less than if I meet 1 infected person every day (in which case my chance of catching the virus is 1 in 20).

That’s not how it works, you’ll have to meet a hell of a lot more people:

One common misunderstanding is that 95% efficacy means that in the Pfizer clinical trial, 5% of vaccinated people got COVID. But that's not true; the actual percentage of vaccinated people in the Pfizer (and Moderna) trials who got COVID-19 was about a hundred times less than that: 0.04%

www.livescience.com/amp/covid-19-vaccine-efficacy-explained.html

@HazeyJaneII

Lol are we going from the vaccine isn’t 100% effective to think of the unvaxxed children? Catching up with this thread, why is it 'lol' to bear in mind unvaccinated children (who may be vulnerable)

You act as if all children are equally vulnerable. But we already know that’s not the case.

All the children who have died of COVID in the UK have been profoundly ill. So it makes sense to protect those children with preexisting conditions (will be easier once the vaccine is approved for them), and let other children live normally.

Could you point to the scientific study that says this, please? Obviously tight-fitting N95s would be BETTER, but that doesn't make the alternatives 'as good as useless

There is no real-world evidence for mask wearing. Everything we have now is poorly designed lab studies.

The Danish study (you can Google) is the largest study to date with a control group. It found that mask wearing did not give the wearer protection. After it was published, you started to see advice change to reflect that there ‘may’ be a protective effect of source control, but no real evidence for or against.

But source control for masks only vaguely works if we are talking about droplets. Aerosols are small enough to pass through a mask and can hang around in an unventilated space for a relatively long time. Only a N95 that fits tightly on the face will give any protection in this scenario. But most people would not be able to handle wearing that all day ... probably

You can promote N95 masks for your students though. Otherwise, they can ditch those surgical masks, it’s not doing anything for them.

I never thought my wearing a mask would protect me. I wear one to protect those around me.

@Parker231

I never thought my wearing a mask would protect me. I wear one to protect those around me.

You are totally correct

UsedUpUsername

Again you are failing (quite spectacularly) to understand the post that I made.

The Danish study is flawed and useless. You can Google it.

@FrippEnos

UsedUpUsername

Again you are failing (quite spectacularly) to understand the post that I made.

You need to be called out for your misinformation that the vaccine is ‘only 95% effective’ (your words). People need to know what that number really means.

@Piggywaspushed

The Danish study is flawed and useless. You can Google it.

It is the best study we have on masks. The largest one to date, with a control group. You won’t find anything better than that one.

UsedUpUsername

And people like you need pulling up when you twist posts to meet your narrative.

The vaccine is not a cure.
People that have had the vaccine can still get covid (although not as badly) and can be asymptomatic.
People that have had the vaccine can pass the virus on.

This is not mis information.

That's nonsense used.

New regulations are out www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2021/585/pdfs/uksi_20210585_en.pdf - the Health Protection (Coronavirus, Restrictions) (Steps and Other Provisions) (England) (Amendment) Regulations 2021

fullfact.org/health/danish-mask-wearing-spectator/

And the guidance (not the above regs) now says
"All schools, colleges, nurseries and childminders

From 17 May, in line with Step 3 of the roadmap, face coverings will no longer be recommended for pupils in classrooms or communal areas in all schools.

Face coverings will also no longer be recommended for staff in classrooms.

In all schools we continue to recommend that face coverings should be worn by staff and visitors in situations outside of classrooms where social distancing is not possible (for example, when moving around in corridors and communal areas).

Where schools are delivering education and training, including extra-curricular activities and wraparound childcare, in a community setting (for example, library or community centre), staff and pupils will be exempt from the legal requirement to wear a face covering if they are in a private room or the premises have been exclusively hired for the sole use of its pupils and staff.

College students may be asked to wear face coverings where:

the teaching setting is more similar to, or is, a workplace environment
it is a requirement in the workplace or indoor environment and students are likely to come into contact with other members of the public

The reintroduction of face coverings for pupils, students or staff may be advised for a temporary period in response to particular localised outbreaks, including variants of concern. In all cases, any educational drawbacks should be balanced with the benefits of managing transmission."

There is no research into educational drawbacks, largely because of timescale. It's all hot air. And fear of legal threats from a certain strangely influential pressure group.

Many many schools have decided what they think is best for their staff and students and have emailed that masks will continue to be required in the schools.
Why have the government announced a change when so many teachers and school staff have not had even one vaccine yet. No wonder the schools have had to make their own decisions.

@UsedUpUsername
You act as if all children are equally vulnerable. But we already know that’s not the case
In what way have I done that...there are medically vulnerable children who are in school now shielding has ended, along with their siblings. None of them are vaccinated if they are under 16...therefore they are still vulnerable.

Xenia, i think it remains clear - unless the regulations specifically state it is illegal - that while face coverings are not 'recommended', there is no legal barrier to them being worn, or even advised?

Replace the word with 'suits' - 'suits are not recommended' does NOT make it in any way illegal to wear a suit, nor does it trump the legal H&S responsibility of the school's head to assess and mitigate risks, knowing the risks in their particular environment?

cant, yes I understand that people can wear them if they want. What I wanted to find out (but failed) is if a school says you do not come into the class room without a mask on you are suspended that is fine? Similar to if you have the wrong hair cut or shoes on. Or is the Government saying an individual teenager can choose?

My friend teaches at a local secondary school. They have told parents, teachers and students that masks are still to be worn - it is school rule. They aren’t anticipating any problems as it was discussed in classes on Friday and they have found that the students understand the benefits of wearing a mask better than many adults.

Also, masks don’t work, especially now that we know it’s spread via aerosols. Unless you make your child wear a tightly fitting N95, those surgical masks are as good as useless so might as well bin them.

In my experience, people generally believe what they want to believe, whatever the evidence says. But there’s plenty of evidence that says masks work. Here’s a nice readable one:
royalsociety.org/-/media/policy/projects/set-c/set-c-facemasks.pdf?la=en-GB&hash=A22A87CB28F7D6AD9BD93BBCBFC2BB24

@Xenia

cant, yes I understand that people can wear them if they want. What I wanted to find out (but failed) is if a school says you do not come into the class room without a mask on you are suspended that is fine? Similar to if you have the wrong hair cut or shoes on. Or is the Government saying an individual teenager can choose?

Xenia I’m sure it’s already been said on this thread, but if any student or their parent tells us they are exempt from wearing a mask, then they do not have to wear a mask. Exemptions could be for medical reasons or mental health reasons.

Pretty irrelevant anyway now that masks are not required in the classroom, but I didn’t want to leave that misconception unanswered.

In my school the Head had said that it is unreasonable to tell the children to do something because it is imposed by he government and then as a school choose to pick and chose which to adopt and ignore. Those headteachers who do so set a very poor example and dangerous precedent to the children .

@TeddingtonTrashbag

In my school the Head had said that it is unreasonable to tell the children to do something because it is imposed by he government and then as a school choose to pick and chose which to adopt and ignore. Those headteachers who do so set a very poor example and dangerous precedent to the children .

Excellent point.