Why do people want to go on holidays abroad this summer? (Not travel to family)

[WombatChocolate]

Given we have put in huge efforts to reduce the virus in this country over many months, I struggle why people (not the holiday industry) are so keen to whizz off for a couple of weeks of sun, when we know the virus is surging in parts of the world.

What is this about?

The only thing I can think of which makes any sense to me is that they have already booked, or had a booking carried forward from last year and fear losing the money. Somehow they would rather go than sacrifice the money and that has led to large numbers wanting to go.

We all know that mutants will come into the country through travel and it’s impossible to keep them out, so why do people want to go so much?

Is it that they just love a sunny holiday so much they don’t think about the possible consequences? Is it that they do t want to lose the money? Is it that they are jabbed and so don’t believe their travel can have any consequences? Is it that they don’t know about levels of virus around the world? Or is it that because the holiday industry wants to open up (very understandably) they have been influenced by them?

I really understand people who have family abroad, how difficult the travel issue is for them and I do understand why they want to go and often feel they must go. I’m not asking about that. It’s just the standard holiday I’m interested in, because I don’t really get it.

Anyone who has thoughts about it, or is keen to go and feels like saying why.....many thanks in advance for your thoughts.

Ok, so I have a right to leave the UK, but it would be perfectly fine for every other country in the world to say that I don't have a right to enter them.

Yes it would. You must not be very wel-informed if you're only realising that because someone on MN told you.

Where should I go?

Greece is beautiful and is currently welcoming British tourists. But I'm not your research assistant.

Is the penny only just dropping about the benefits of the freedom of movement across the EU?

@IcedPurple

Ok, so I have a right to leave the UK, but it would be perfectly fine for every other country in the world to say that I don't have a right to enter them.

Yes it would. You must not be very wel-informed if you're only realising that because someone on MN told you.

Where should I go?

Greece is beautiful and is currently welcoming British tourists. But I'm not your research assistant.

I think you are correct that I am not very well informed.
But I think I have got the hang of it, everyone has a fundamental right to leave the country they live in, but no fundamental right to enter another country. Which I think means that the fundamental right for a holiday is to get on a ferry at Dover and go for a jolly up and down the Straits.

We have a holiday booked in France in August. If it is lawful for us to go then we will. I will be fully vaccinated by then, DH will have had one jab, and I am unconcerned about the effects of the virus on small children, so we are content to take DD abroad.

As with the entirety of this pandemic, I will continue to act within the law, but I will not further restrict my activities because posters on Mumsnet think that I should.

Basically, I like holidays! I don't have to justify my lawful actions to anyone.

But I think I have got the hang of it, everyone has a fundamental right to leave the country they live in, but no fundamental right to enter another country.

Finally you've got it. Well done!

Which I think means that the fundamental right for a holiday is to get on a ferry at Dover and go for a jolly up and down the Straits.

As I've said, bad sarcasm doesn't substitute for an actual argument.

Nobody has a 'fundamental right to a holiday'. However, in democracies, citizens normally do have a right to leave their country. Whether other countries choose to allow them to enter or not is up to them.

In any case, now that you've finally understood that the right to leave your country is fundamental in a democracy, presumably you will also understand that 'allowing' travel isn't simply about making money for a small number of vested interests.

@IcedPurple

But I think I have got the hang of it, everyone has a fundamental right to leave the country they live in, but no fundamental right to enter another country.

Finally you've got it. Well done!

Which I think means that the fundamental right for a holiday is to get on a ferry at Dover and go for a jolly up and down the Straits.

As I've said, bad sarcasm doesn't substitute for an actual argument.

Nobody has a 'fundamental right to a holiday'. However, in democracies, citizens normally do have a right to leave their country. Whether other countries choose to allow them to enter or not is up to them.

In any case, now that you've finally understood that the right to leave your country is fundamental in a democracy, presumably you will also understand that 'allowing' travel isn't simply about making money for a small number of vested interests.

I am very glad that we are in agreement that nobody has a fundamental right to a holiday. There were some posters on the thread who were giving the impression that they thought they were.

@jgw1

I think you are playing Devils Advocate?

There is a distinct difference between having the right to travel (then return back to your normal country of residence) and the right to permanently reside or be classed as a refugee, thus be able to stay in another country.

[quote jasjas1973]@jgw1

I think you are playing Devils Advocate?

There is a distinct difference between having the right to travel (then return back to your normal country of residence) and the right to permanently reside or be classed as a refugee, thus be able to stay in another country.[/quote]
I am just trying to understand what other posters are saying.

So you are saying that for instance a Syrian has every right to travel to the UK, as long as at some point in the future they intend to return to Syria. Seems perfectly reasonable to me.

So you are saying that for instance a Syrian has every right to travel to the UK, as long as at some point in the future they intend to return to Syria. Seems perfectly reasonable to me

No, because any Syrian (pre CV) needs to apply (from a british embassy) for a visa to travel for almost any reason to the UK, that visa will state the entry requirements and time periods to remain here.
Normally 6 months, with a host of other conditions attached.

@jasjas1973

So you are saying that for instance a Syrian has every right to travel to the UK, as long as at some point in the future they intend to return to Syria. Seems perfectly reasonable to me

No, because any Syrian (pre CV) needs to apply (from a british embassy) for a visa to travel for almost any reason to the UK, that visa will state the entry requirements and time periods to remain here.
Normally 6 months, with a host of other conditions attached.

It strikes me as rather unfair to make a Syrian jump through all those hoops, when we don't for everyone wanting to come to the UK. Someone earlier was using the example of the Eastern bloc totalitarian regimes as to why it is important to allow people to travel. They won't be happy that it is so difficult for someone to come to the UK from the Syrian totalitarian regime.

The UK places visa restrictions on many countries nationals, in the case of Syria, these have been in place for many years & usually to do with national security.

Perhaps though with the USSR countries, they weren't allowed to apply to travel full stop, mainly due to risk of defection to the West and we were wary because of the risk to national security... that old chestnet!
Anyway, its a poor comparison and one i wouldn't have made because we are talking about legally allowed tourism, i don't suppose anyone from MN, going on a Hayes 10 day holiday to Mallorca is planning on applying for asylum once there.

As i'm recovering from an op, i ve the time for your Devils Advocacy!

All countries have some form of visa restrictions in place.
Even if I wanted to holiday in the US or Australia etc I would need a visa.
Whilst countries might welcome tourists from around the world with the appropriate travel documentation I don’t think there is a single country where anyone from around the world can go to and start work without some sort of visa.

I don’t think there is a single country where anyone from around the world can go to and start work without some sort of visa

Any country in the EU, inc the UK, used to be able too, one of the errors of brexit, FOM works both ways, it was fantastic for our uni's, science and finance sectors, it might have needed tweaking but that was all.

jasjas1973

But the EU countries would still require a visa for those countries outside of the EU.

As I said there isn’t a single country that has no visa restrictions.

No one is saying there is a right to holidays. I had never even had one night away from home until I was 10. However some countries stop people travelling eg North Korea bans it for most people and for those they force to work abroad as in effect slaves they ensure they have some of your family captive back in the homeland so they can kill them if you disobey orders.

I had to get visas for example to work for a few days in Nigeria and Iran.

However a lot of countries want British holidaymakers' money so are pretty keen we go there on holiday. I am sure they will be doing whatever they can so as not to lose a second summer holiday season. I hope our July holiday goes ahead although I am not so sure my daughter's May honeymoon will proceed but we shall see.