EU threaten to cut off vaccine supply to the UK 2

[Baileysforchristmas]

As the other thread is full

www.politico.eu/article/commission-proposes-six-week-vaccine-export-ban-amid-fears-of-trade-war/

The EU is coming apart at the seams at almost every level.

[quote Baileysforchristmas]And the mad thing is Germans and French are off you Spain for their holidays, when the numbers go through the roof I bet the UK and AZ will get the blame.

www.politico.eu/article/spain-holiday-tourism-coronavirus-travel-restrictions/[/quote]
French people have been going into Spain for a while. My friends haven’t been allowed to see their families because they had to stay local yet they could see how french people have been coming into the country with no pcr or quarantine.

@MrsHuntGeneNotJeremyObviously

The sad thing is that I don't think they even really want it. They just want us not to have it. The leaders of the EU seem to be utterly morally bankrupt. Who dissuades their people from having a vaccine in a pandemic?

^^ this but there is also a sense that some of this is a risk management approach against reputational damage for the EU. Derail the UK vaccination process on the off chance we might have actually got this right... all the damaging claims from the EU about efficacy, gaps between the doses, efficacy in over 65's, blood clots etc and yet it looks like the approach in the UK is working. This clearly calls into question the EU approach to decision making.

It is so disappointing.

@EasterIssland that’s madness, I would be really upset if I was Spanish. The poor Spanish islands that have low Covid infections at the moment are going to go through the roof after the Easter holidays from all the tourists, I hope the hospitals can cope.

I'm feeling a bit confused about how the shelf life of vaccines is being managed across Europe. Norway announced another 3 week hold on the AZ vaccine, surely there should be a scheme to donate the doses that aren't being used elsewhere and then get some back later. I'm sure UK would do a sort of futures-swap, probably also countries like Ireland, Lithuania, Czechia, etc. Is there anything like that being discussed to prevent wastage?

[quote Baileysforchristmas]@EasterIssland that’s madness, I would be really upset if I was Spanish. The poor Spanish islands that have low Covid infections at the moment are going to go through the roof after the Easter holidays from all the tourists, I hope the hospitals can cope.[/quote]
Yes. Spanish aren’t understanding why they can’t travel around the country , some not even leave their city but then Germans wirh a pcr can go to Mallorca. Why can’t my parents get a pcr done and travel to Mallorca ? Ministry has also been really misleading. Saying Spaniard weren’t allowed to travel abroad and then saying they could and then they can’t.

@MRex

I'm feeling a bit confused about how the shelf life of vaccines is being managed across Europe. Norway announced another 3 week hold on the AZ vaccine, surely there should be a scheme to donate the doses that aren't being used elsewhere and then get some back later. I'm sure UK would do a sort of futures-swap, probably also countries like Ireland, Lithuania, Czechia, etc. Is there anything like that being discussed to prevent wastage?

No I don’t think so, Norway is not Eu so not sure they can divert their doses.

Norway are part of the same procurement scheme, so I don't know why not?

Macron and Merkel are acting like spoiled thwarted children and fgs dont seem to care about eu / uk lives lost with this palaver going on with bans etc. Like i dont care if uk havent exported any when they poured billions into the AZ development. Az must be fuming at their bad publicity and abuse by the " leaders " of the EU . It seems Novavax are reluctant to do business with the EU . The EU dilly dallyed over contracts etc sure we all know the panto antics which have ensued. The UK have given enough by their initial investment to the eu and the world !! Its envy pure and simple add in a bit of pharma profit greed to bad mouth AZ to get minions opting for THEIR vaccine -there is a bit of this by the EU. VdL and Macron sure arent thinking of their citizens.
Az vaccine factory in braintree in essex bought in July 2020 cant open quick enough. The EU reputation as a vehicle to do business with must be in tatters- i truly believe the EU is going to crumble over this.

An interesting article in the NY Times on the EU’s vaccine woes:

www.nytimes.com/2021/03/25/world/europe/europe-covid-19-vaccine-shortage.html

There is an article in the Telegraph this morning by the amazing Sherelle Jacobs and it covers the decline of Merkel in some detail. As a result Germany are in stagnation. Many Germans calling for a fixed two term like the US to avoid leaders remaining in post long after their sell by date.

www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/03/26/witnessing-end-german-miracle/

Meanwhile Merkel is offering Sputnik vaccine financial support and production in German facilities. It makes sense in that it comes within their sphere of Eastern European borders, but honestly, it's pretty much the same vaccine as Oxford, with less trial or efficacy data. Shall we guess how that's received.

Putin is using/weaponising vaccines to win favours and cause discord within the west, and is happy to let every day Russians die in the hospitals. And this is supposed to be ethical? Something the German population will welcome?

This is the Times today:

"After a week of frantic behind-the-scenes diplomacy the two sides [EU and UK] are expected to seal an agreement as soon as this weekend under which the EU will remove its threat to ban the export of Pfizer-BioNTech jabs to Britain. In return the government will agree to forgo some long-term supplies of the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine that had been due to be exported from Holland."

Apparently former EU ambassador Sir Tim Farrow has been leading the talks. I wonder how many doses will be forgone

The EU is probably looking at 100k plus deaths in the next six weeks, even with a ramped up vaccine drive the wait for immunity will not stop the immediate deaths. The need to blame someone, anyone is huge. The reluctance with AZ will fade with the rising death toll. I am extremely worried about Poland and their cases and deaths.

even with a ramped up vaccine drive....

They've still got to persuade people to have it, what with pre-existing vaccine hesitancy and the mixed messaging about AZ that's been coming out over the last few weeks. Are France and Germany on the same page yet about whether it works on over 65s? I can't keep up.

@UserEleventyNine

even with a ramped up vaccine drive....

They've still got to persuade people to have it, what with pre-existing vaccine hesitancy and the mixed messaging about AZ that's been coming out over the last few weeks. Are France and Germany on the same page yet about whether it works on over 65s? I can't keep up.

I think they now ONLY give it to over 55s. It's confusing.

In return the government will agree to forgo some long-term supplies of the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine that had been due to be exported from Holland."

So our vaccine rollout will be slowed down due to EU incompetence. I wonder how many of these jabs will actually be used?

I can't see anyone feeling comfortable with any vaccine after the endless campaign of misinformation.

I have total confidence in the vaccine because I have high levels of trust in our scientists that has built up over decades not months, but I am not sure if I would go ahead if I was an already worried person in the south of France with low trust and the confusion with every week a different message coming out of my government. So I can see why 'the people' otherwise known as EU political fodder might have reservations.

Moderna is manufactured in Switzerland apparently so they can’t get their mits on that! It’s just the Pfizer that is the issue, but I thought we already had enough supplies here for second doses?

@nonono1

Moderna is manufactured in Switzerland apparently so they can’t get their mits on that! It’s just the Pfizer that is the issue, but I thought we already had enough supplies here for second doses?

Bottled in Spain

"It is if the contract stated 'best efforts' as the EU one does. Discussed as nauseum earlier in the year"

Gosh you all seem very sure about the legal effect of the EU contract. The contract is (i) governed by Belgian law (ii) heavily redacted (95% of the redactions were at AZ's insistence, incidentally). Perhaps you are all Belgian procurement lawyers? No, thought not.

Published legal commentary on the contract generally adopts a more nuanced position - most lawyers would, I think, accept that it is at least arguable that AZ has breached the contract.

Thank goodness this mess is getting sorted out, we need to all just get on with vaccinating, the quicker the better.

@TheMancunianCandidate

"It is if the contract stated 'best efforts' as the EU one does. Discussed as nauseum earlier in the year"

Gosh you all seem very sure about the legal effect of the EU contract. The contract is (i) governed by Belgian law (ii) heavily redacted (95% of the redactions were at AZ's insistence, incidentally). Perhaps you are all Belgian procurement lawyers? No, thought not.

Published legal commentary on the contract generally adopts a more nuanced position - most lawyers would, I think, accept that it is at least arguable that AZ has breached the contract.

Those words are/were clearly visible in the not very well redacted EU contract.

Spoken by quite a few EU beauracrats and European leaders.

Discussed at some length by people fully conversant in Belgian contract law

I don't make any claim to understand it any more than they do.

Oh, and even UvdL confirmed those words!

I think the most that can be said about AZ is that they fully expected the same response from the EU that they got from the UK when setting up brand new manufacturing sites had problems. That they put themselves on the line with this and that their reputation is being traduced for reasons that include lies, obfuscation, politicking and fear.