Is life never going back to normal?

[JuneMoonstone]

I feel incredibly lucky that I've lived 44 years of a normal life. I am heartbroken at the way life has become. Like so many others, I feel like I am existing, not living. I don't see any point in making plans, I don't feel any hope for the future. I was feeling quite positive about the progress made in the UK with vaccines and seeing the infection rates and death rates lower. However with the news about the rest of Europe going into lockdown due to escalating infection rates, I can't help but feel that we are never going to get out of this bloody mess. I cannot help but believe that we will have to live our lives under constant restrictions forever now because of this virus. Is life really going to be shit from now on? Will I ever be able to, for example, go into a busy pub on a Friday night and watch a live band and have a bloody good time again? Will we have to wear face masks permanently in public places from now on? I get a very strong feeling that this will be the case. It's my daughter I feel for the most. She's just 5 years old. What kind of a life is she going to have?

The virus will never be eradicated. It will continue to mutate. That's what viruses do.

The vaccine, which will be tweaked to cover new mutations, is to allow us to return to normal life and will protect the vulnerable and prevent surges in hospitals. Thus allowing normal life to continue.

Lockdowns are not normal and cannot continue in a functioning society or economy. They will not become the new norm.

Social distancing is not normal in a healthy or functioning society. Humans are designed for and need social contact and connection.

I'm appalled that anyone would accept these restrictions as permanent or even semi-permanent.

If this is what people will accept, and indeed say they want for their own protection, then politicians will deliver restrictions on freedom forever. If you don't agree with your freedom being removed, write to your MP. Every poll is currently telling them that 80% of the population is cool with this pointless bullshit.

I think we all thought we'd be past this all by now, I guess. And I've noticed that people have been really ground down by this last lockdown. We've got a few neighbours living alone that we've been chatting to through their windows/offering to get things and it's been a tough few months for them which has been horrible to witness.

I also think that the moment that all the idiots start flying abroad again for their essential holiday sat in the sun drinking British beer and eating British food by the pool, we'll get another wave. I personally think we should ban all non essential travel for another 12 months and keep the borders as closed as we are able.

@missbridgerton

I think we all thought we'd be past this all by now, I guess. And I've noticed that people have been really ground down by this last lockdown. We've got a few neighbours living alone that we've been chatting to through their windows/offering to get things and it's been a tough few months for them which has been horrible to witness.

I also think that the moment that all the idiots start flying abroad again for their essential holiday sat in the sun drinking British beer and eating British food by the pool, we'll get another wave. I personally think we should ban all non essential travel for another 12 months and keep the borders as closed as we are able.

Oh ffs, are you being serious?

Trying to blame it on a certain section of people. Do you remember how the first cases got here?
Skiing holidays. I can fucking guarantee to you it was not "people drinking English beer" on beach holidays.

Don't you dare try and blame these on people you perceive to not be as good as you because it's utter bollocks and it makes you look stupid.

The virus, and it’s many forms in terms of mutations, will just keep going round. World wide. The vaccines will be tweaked accordingly. It won’t go away but hopefully will weaken over years.

Unless we, as an island nation, are prepared to “isolate” and close borders fully for a very long time we cannot stop worldwide variant circulation. So, we update/perfect the vaccine (as we do with ordinary flu variants) and get on with it.

I'm appalled that anyone would accept these restrictions as permanent or even semi-permanent.

I think for a lot of people it has been a bit annoying but not really all that bad. So they feel it’s reasonable to say “we’ll all get used to it in time”, because from their perspective, they’re not seeing all the ways in which it’s totally unsustainable.

I thought that the vaccine was to be the answer and can't believe that I'll be vaccinated by the summer but still can't go abroad - so what's the point.
I'm fed up of people telling me I'm being selfish and to think of the people who have died. Nobody knows how much time they have left. I'm at the stage when i'm free to do as I like but feel I'm just existing atm, not living as a PP said.
It was tolerable at the beginning as it was only "to flatten the curve". Now over a year later we're still in lockdown and there are endless mutations - I can't see a way out of this.

I feel quite positive atm, the weather and season helps, lighter nights and longer days always give me a boost.
Normal wise, I think, like last year, we will have a fairly normal Summer, some face mask wearing indoors, handwashing and sanitising continuing to be encouraged and possibly even flights to other countries depending on how quickly those countries get on top of their third waves and vaccination programmes. I think they will be in a similar position to us by the Summer, as far as infection rates are concerned, the vaccination programmes will depend largely on their populations desire to have one, some countries populations are less inclined than others.

The Spanish flu pandemic lasted from February 1918 to April 1920 and had four waves so our current pandemic has not yet lasted that long. Having just completed our Census this morning, the 7th one I will have been listed on, its made me think about how my "normal" has changed over the years, normal never stays the same, society changes continually, this pandemic just means some things have changed at a more noticeably speed than usual. I do think that we will be able to meet in large groups soon, hopefully in the UK you will be able to listened to live music in the pub by the summer. Other countries may take longer so foreign travel will return but I think that will take longer. Some things that I think will change is that our high streets will never recover to where they were, people will work from home much more and communicate via platforms like zoom far more. A year ago I did not know what zoom was I now join an exercise class each week, my local church service, and a church service in the USA (I'm in UK) which a friend there recommended, I "stay" for coffee and chat with other USA church members after the service in zoom rooms which is fun. Plans are in place for all of these to continue to some extent after we go back to face to face meetings. I think this pandemic has made us all think about new ways of doing things and try them, some of my fellow churchgoers are in their 80's and have mastered the technology, so I think in time we will return to some of the old ways that we miss but continue with some of the new ways we have learned.

Eventually. It may take 18-24 months. But it will never get back to normal for an awful lot of people who have lost close friends and relatives. And nobody knows what the long term effects of Covid infection are.

World has been changing constantly - pandemic or not. We don't normally notice that because it's gradual and Covid accelerated some changes. But this was already happening with WFH or major role of technology in different aspects of our life like education and communication.
Humans evolve and adapt. It's not a bad thing. What's normal for us wasn't normal to people in 20th century and won't be normal to people in 100 years.

If I was able to travel abroad, I would be making sure my travel insurance was the best available and included cover for illness due to covid, or travel disruption caused by covid.

@Cassilis

Hmmm bats - well given that the WHO, Chinese and US Governments and most medical experts around the world confirm the most likely original host animal was bats then we already kind of know that it started with a corona virus in bats.Note: I probably don't need additional schooling to have understood this bit.

The tricky question is how DS it jump from bats in a cave in Northern China to infecting 123 m people worldwide. The two main theories being a wet market (which has implications for food hygiene across the world) or a lab leak (which has implications for bio hazard security across the world). Or do you have another theory you would like to enlighten us with?

@GoldenOmber

I'm appalled that anyone would accept these restrictions as permanent or even semi-permanent.

I think for a lot of people it has been a bit annoying but not really all that bad. So they feel it’s reasonable to say “we’ll all get used to it in time”, because from their perspective, they’re not seeing all the ways in which it’s totally unsustainable.

This is very much the case. I won't use the phrase 'lockdown lover' but it is a fact that for many people, lockdown is quite tolerable. They may enjoy WFH, are saving thousands through commuting and childcare, and maybe never enjoyed travel or had much of a social life to miss. These people - and there are quite a few of them here on MN - are really in no hurry for lockdown to end.

They may also say 'Oh I think social distancing should go on indefinitely', not realising, or maybe not caring, that it makes thousands of businesses financially unsustainable. There are examples of these attitudes on this very thread.

@missbridgerton

I think we all thought we'd be past this all by now, I guess. And I've noticed that people have been really ground down by this last lockdown. We've got a few neighbours living alone that we've been chatting to through their windows/offering to get things and it's been a tough few months for them which has been horrible to witness.

I also think that the moment that all the idiots start flying abroad again for their essential holiday sat in the sun drinking British beer and eating British food by the pool, we'll get another wave. I personally think we should ban all non essential travel for another 12 months and keep the borders as closed as we are able.

Do you have any idea how snobby you sound? It's embarrassing.

I thought that the vaccine was to be the answer and can't believe that I'll be vaccinated by the summer but still can't go abroad - so what's the point.

1). It will take time to set up any ‘vaccination passport’ system and by its nature it would require international agreement.

2). Many people in many countries aren’t yet vaccinated and we don’t know how much vaccination controls transmission. The U.K. is very far ahead of many countries that people would want to visit.

Although a lot is still unknown it seems likely that the vaccine and vaccine developers will be able to cope with mutations.

The timescale for getting global vaccinations up to speed is likely to be at least a couple of years. That will depend on the will of richer countries, but is likely to be partly driven by the desire for international travel.

I’m not going to tell you that you are selfish or pretend that this is easy because I have no idea what you have gone through.

@EarringsandLipstick

Claudia

That poster really isn't obfuscating, at least not in the part you quote.

This pandemic is entirely linked to the physical destruction of the planet, and how we've changed natural habitats, in line with massive population growth.

The way in which new viruses have emerged is not any different to how it's happened always - but the potential for it to happen has been massively increased by population growth & changed habitats.

On the R4 programme I mentioned, they talk about it as 'buying a lottery ticket'. The virus just needs one successful lottery ticket (the ability to jump from animal to one human). Densely populated areas where there is close intermingling of animals & people, provide the virus with many many lottery tickets. Centuries ago, they had maybe only 10 lottery tickets, so that mutation was harder to happen.

In 2019, epidemiologists had essentially predicted a new SARS virus. It was just when & in what form - and if happened to be Covid-19.

There was an episode of The Infinite Monkey Cage broadcast in July 2018 called “Invasion” which covered this, including one scientist stating “It’s the bats that will get us!”

Summary
“Brian Cox and Robin Ince are joined by comedian Phill Jupitus, bat expert and ecologist Professor Kate Jones and forensic botanist Dr Mark Spencer to look at the problems caused by alien invasions, although not of the little green men kind. They look at why such innocent and innocuous sounding plants such as floating pennywort strike terror and fear in the heart of environmentalists up and down the country, and how clever microbes and diseases are able to jump from animals such as bats to humans causing devastating consequences.”

Link: www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0bbp7sr

@RaraRachael

I thought that the vaccine was to be the answer and can't believe that I'll be vaccinated by the summer but still can't go abroad - so what's the point. I'm fed up of people telling me I'm being selfish and to think of the people who have died. Nobody knows how much time they have left. I'm at the stage when i'm free to do as I like but feel I'm just existing atm, not living as a PP said. It was tolerable at the beginning as it was only "to flatten the curve". Now over a year later we're still in lockdown and there are endless mutations - I can't see a way out of this.

Exactly this ! I think summer will be largely normal to an extent but the doom mongers are predicting lockdown again over the winter and the vicious cycle starts all over again. This is what I can't bare, the unknown, how long will we have our freedom again before its snatched away and we're all back on here seeing the smug and sanctimonious posts about how they predicted a 4th wave ,they haven't set foot out the door for 2 years and it's everyone's selfish fault for actually living a life. I can cope with the end of this lockdown, what I cant cope with is the prospect of this becoming a regular/yearly thing if the vaccines don't end up being as effective as we hope

@Wildswim

The virus will never be eradicated. It will continue to mutate. That's what viruses do.

The vaccine, which will be tweaked to cover new mutations, is to allow us to return to normal life and will protect the vulnerable and prevent surges in hospitals. Thus allowing normal life to continue.

Lockdowns are not normal and cannot continue in a functioning society or economy. They will not become the new norm.

Social distancing is not normal in a healthy or functioning society. Humans are designed for and need social contact and connection.

I'm appalled that anyone would accept these restrictions as permanent or even semi-permanent.

You do understand that if one of the bad mutations gets in the population we will be under restrictions to slow the spread whilst we administer top up vaccines? Covid is NOT seasonal like Flu so it’s not as if you can say ok everyone start booking in for your covid jabs it’s that time of year. They are formulated based on the knowledge of the current variants at the time.

It’s taken us almost 4 months to get where we are and already there are whispers that B1351 and P1 aren’t affected by the vax being used currently.

Once a mutation is in circulation the whole population is at risk especially if it is a highly transmissible one. It’s not a case of yearly topping up, our primary tool to slow a mutation down are closures and social distancing.

Vaccines are great when they work but as soon as things change you have to restart the whole program and that means those who were at risk the most initially face a similar situation again.

Our way out of this limbo is a cure.

I think compliance will drop so low they’ll have to just open up, to be honest - people are willing to take the risks more, once the very elderly and vulnerable are vaccinated. And if we have to update the vaccine to cope with new variants people will expect that, like flu - not that we continue with restrictions indefinitely. I’m still amazed people have been as compliant as they have though to be honest.

@MarshaBradyo

We’ll accept a level of deaths (like flu every year) and move on

Of course we won't. Don't be so ridiculous. You might but fortunately there are people with compassion and an understanding of science and they will prevail. Prevail against those who want to go to the pub or to Benidorm and more dead people is a cheap price to pay. They were probably sick or old so don't really matter, eh?

Dreadful attitude.

Do you actually understand how the virus broke out, Claudia?

Yes. Do you @Cassilis ?

The pandemic emerged from close contact between humans and some kind of wild animal, maybe a bat or a pangolin, which was caught for meat and butchered. Along the way, through either blood, other fluid or through airborne transmission, a virus which is endemic to that animal species arrived in a human. Through sheer chance it was able to replicate itself and caused an immune system response that meant it was transmissible.

Not a single word of that is evident of some kind of retribution from Mother Nature, or a higher plan to show us how much we have meddled with the earth. It’s a huge chain of coincidences.

The whole nature has its limits thing, as if we pressed on its last nerve and it hit back, is absolute rubbish. And not only that, it’s the same argument that was used to ignore HIV AIDS outbreaks (homosexual men and heroin users deserved it, right?).

Sooner or later a pandemic would have happened - as they have since the beginning of time.

Very good post CheeseCakesSunflowers

Personally I am looking forward to:
Clocks springing forward next week
Easter
Shops and hairdressers 12th
Having friends for dinner in the garden
DC returning to uni (as are they)
A holiday in Norfolk in May (cottage)
Mini break in the UK in July
Flexible working 2/3 days at home moving forward

I think the way we work will change along with the high street forever. It may be that some high street units are turned over to offices and the London property bubble will burst.

If it means less air travel that may be good and more sustainable for the planet and our UK holiday industry and revive towns like Margate, Southend, Bognor etc.

I miss France desperately as we have a home there but we decided last minute not to go last summer as cases nearby were rising and we will not go this year.

All I can say is thank goodness for Brexit. Without it we would be where Europe is now - enduring an escalating third wave. We are not. We do however need to restrict overseas travel for the time being until there is more information about transmissability amongst the vaccinated and the overall duration, efficacy of the vaccines and a booster system for variants and/or the most vulnerable.

People can judge all they like - there can be many reasons for going overseas - some of us have properties that are going to rack and ruin, some have family or friends that we haven't seen for 2 years and some of us will be traveling to places with much lower infection rates.

Personally I can handle everything BUT not being allowed to travel this summer. I have flights booked ds and I to spend 5 weeks in my second home country, to sort out a load of financial and legal issues, see friends and be in the place I love.

I'm a single parent of a teenager and a teacher - this has been a bloody hard year and I've put up with all restrictions and the irony of everyone else being restricted whilst I was still packed in to school with 1000+ households and I have gotten on with it and one my best.

If I can't go this summer it will be another year before I can go and sort out stuff (I can only travel in school holidays and summer is the only one long enough for the legal issues and paper work hell and repairs etc to get done).

People are so judgemental. I will do everything I can to get on my flight in July and to get away from here and sort out the other half of my life that has been stuck on hold and falling apart whilst I've just taught, ate, slept and not been allowed to do anything else for much of the last year. I don't need to go to a crowded pub, I can live without the theatre or clothes shops or bloody flower shows or football matches. I can happily keep teaching and looking after the kids and putting a smile on and keeping them positive and happy and maintaining as much normal for them as I can and doing twice the amount of work I'm paid for and I'll happily do it through all the waves to come.

I cannot live with another year of not being able to get to my second home.

Covid is NOT seasonal like Flu so it’s not as if you can say ok everyone start booking in for your covid jabs it’s that time of year. They are formulated based on the knowledge of the current variants at the time.

It is seasonal like flu, and formulating based on the knowledge of the current variants at the time is exactly what we do with flu. Usually we look to see what’s happening with flu strains in the southern hemisphere and guess from that. So we have a good model for dealing with annual vaccinations to cover new variants, if that in fact is what’s needed.