When will normality fully return?

[ThornAmongstRoses]

The other night, when I checked on my youngest son at about 10pm, he felt quite warm and sweaty. My first thoughts were one of panic, not of Covid but that a temperature would mean he wouldn’t be able to go to the childminders and I wouldn’t be able to go to work. Again.

I checked his temperature and thankfully it was fine.

But when will the time come where temperatures don’t matter?

As in, he may have a slightly raised temperature in the evening, but I would give him some Calpol, he’d be absolutely fine in the morning so I’d send him to childcare as normal and I would head off to work.

When will normality in that respect come back?

I was just reading another thread about a woman who’d been told to isolate via the NHS app because she may have been in close contact with Covid in the supermarket, and so was having to isolate for 8 days. When will this stop?

When will we stop needing be monitored like this? Where even if you may have walked past someone in the supermarket with Covid, it doesn’t matter and you just carry on with life as normal?

When does the time come where a temperature doesn’t mean we have to get tested? When does all that stop?

If you are worried about the supermarket, take the app off your phone.

If you are worried about the supermarket, take the app off your phone.

I don’t have the App on my phone.

Personally I don't want to make that worse by not limiting the spread just now. Schools have been open 1.5 weeks. Let's not fuck everything up straight away by being too hasty.

I’m not taking about currently, I don’t want to rush the easing of lock down....I’m talking about 12 months down the line. Surely all this tearing and isolating won’t still have to be going on if everyone is vaccinated?

This can’t be life forever.

What concerns me is the changing goalposts.
Protect the NHS,so schools closed
Let's get the top 4 groups vaccinated,that will help lots
Let's get the top 9 groups vaccinated

Then....what?

School also worried me. Last Sept,for the 1st case,they sent home the whole year group. Then they did just the close contacts. Yesterday,there were about 25 kids sent home to self isolate,the whole of my son's class and more. How can they ALL be close contacts of 1 child? This is year 7 at secondary.

I think we have to worry about 12 months' time when it gets here. There's no point saying this can’t be life forever because a) forever is a highly emotive word, it has no real meaning and b) it could be better, worse or similar in 12 months' time.

We still need these restrictions now, is all I know.

P.s. if you don't have the app on your phone, you can't be asked to isolate from the supermarket. The person who has the app on their phone is choosing that, so there's no need to worry about them.

@ChameleonClara

How long will this sending home close contacts last? Indefinitely?

I think there's a huge grey area between school isolation ending now, and lasting indefinitely, so don't lose hope. UK is moving forwards.

Personally I want isolation to remain in school until things are improved as the last thing we need is a bout of nasty illness.

Can you explain what you mean about the huge grey area between it ending now and lasting indefinitely

@Layladylay234 I mean people say 'it can't last indefinitely' as if that means it should end now.

It would be foolish for it to end now. But that doesn't mean it will last forever.

I understand uncertainty is horrible, but the truth is - no one knows how things will be by June, September, December. Things are indefinite, that is the nature of things just now.

Op I do know exactly what you mean. I coughed the ohter day and wondered when my first thought wouldn't be covid. However I do think that might be here to stay - a difference in the way we handle 'minor' illnesses. That said, I wouldn't have taken the temperature!
However I agree isolating contacts, and other restrictions of asymptomatic people needs to end at the right time, in line with the vaccination programme.

Ok, let’s imagine this scenario....

A child gets sent home with symptoms and the next day tests positive for Covid but the rest of the class just carries on at school as normal. And as the mother/father of this child who got to isolate cant take time off work for 10 days so they ask his grandparents to look after him, and they do, and it’s not a problem or illegal in any way shape or form. Just like life used to be.

That’s what I’m trying to imagine, when that scenario comes into play.

Where if someone feels a bit run down with a slight temperature and a small cough, their first thought doesn’t have to be, “Quick, I need to book a Covid test.” - and instead they can just relax in bed with some paracetamol and then when they feel better in a few days they can just go back to work.

Just like how life used to be prior to Covid.

Is this 12 months away? 18 months?

There has to be a point where it stops. I just wonder how far away that is.

I know we can’t really speculate as who knows what’s going to happen over the coming months - I guess what I’m scared of is that the time will never come.

Schools and isolation are a huge issue for working women (/ male primary careers).

If my DD is home I can't go to work, if I don't go to work I don't get paid. The more I can't go to work the more likely they are to let me go.

I have a feeling that testing and isolation in schools will end either:

1. Once the adult population is all vaccinated they let it run rife in the schools and just isolate the 'real' close cases (which I highly doubt they'll do because the vaccine isn't 100% effective)
2. Once children can be vaccinated, which is years off and I suspect a high number of parents won't want their children vaccinated anyway.

Either way I doubt my career will last long enough to see either of those out.

Either way I doubt my career will last long enough to see either of those out.

This is exactly. It’s fine for the Government all safe in jobs, but for a lot of society, especially women, this needing to take time off work for 10 days to look after what is an essentially well child, is just not feasible.

Yes I agree. In terms of grandparents, I suspect many are already doing it.

@ThornAmongstRoses

Ok, let’s imagine this scenario....

A child gets sent home with symptoms and the next day tests positive for Covid but the rest of the class just carries on at school as normal. And as the mother/father of this child who got to isolate cant take time off work for 10 days so they ask his grandparents to look after him, and they do, and it’s not a problem or illegal in any way shape or form. Just like life used to be.

That’s what I’m trying to imagine, when that scenario comes into play.

Where if someone feels a bit run down with a slight temperature and a small cough, their first thought doesn’t have to be, “Quick, I need to book a Covid test.” - and instead they can just relax in bed with some paracetamol and then when they feel better in a few days they can just go back to work.

Just like how life used to be prior to Covid.

Is this 12 months away? 18 months?

There has to be a point where it stops. I just wonder how far away that is.

I know we can’t really speculate as who knows what’s going to happen over the coming months - I guess what I’m scared of is that the time will never come.

I had the exact same question. Son has now had this happen throughout year 6 and year 7,will it continue through year 8,year 9. Or do we get to the end of the vaccination programme and say,right we just have to now do our best. My understanding of the road map they published a weeks ago was that the final chapter was about living with Covid and it becoming endemic ( I think,I read it when it first came out). So that gives me the tiniest bit of hope that they might be thinking eventually,the topics you mention above - classmates having to self isolate,parents returning to work,grandparents being able to help out - are on the horizon.

Sorry I can't give any further opinion/reassurance. My mental health is desperate this morning,never felt this low throughout the whole thing and it's defo the,this will never end,feeling I have that's driving it x

I know we can’t really speculate as who knows what’s going to happen over the coming months - I guess what I’m scared of is that the time will never come.

I think it will come, but not now, so I'm filing that under 'in due course'. I think four important factors remain unknown:

• long term impact of adult vaccination programme
• introduction of child vaccine
• variants
• seasonality

We have a lot of fallout and adjustment to come, however much the Tories want to pretend otherwise.

In Spain they protected workers who had to isolate or care for family for covid reasons.

Working age people should absolutely not vote Conservative, they do nothing for women in the workplace and have made no efforts to support.

We shouldn't have to trade off between our children's health and our jobs - in other countries this hasn't happened so much. This is a political choice made by the government.

New norms have been established about how we (govt, society) handle any signs of illness. I'm not sure that will ever go back to the 'old normal'

@ThornAmongstRoses

Either way I doubt my career will last long enough to see either of those out.

This is exactly. It’s fine for the Government all safe in jobs, but for a lot of society, especially women, this needing to take time off work for 10 days to look after what is an essentially well child, is just not feasible.

Preach!

Pre-Covid I would have been the last out in the event of redundancies; never taken much sick, always worked to a high standard and willing to put in extra hours where need be. Now I'd 100% be the first out the door.

I don't really blame the company, I'm no longer reliable and when I can't work for 10days the work doesn't stop existing.

In Spain they protected workers who had to isolate or care for family for covid reasons.

How did they do this?

And on the other end of the spectrum, most employers need their employees to be in work to do their job. I understand that the workers need to be protected, but what about the businesses whose productivity is reduced (and their finances) as a result of parents frequently needing to take time off?

It’s just crap all around.

Where I work, we once had 3 staff at one time looking after their well child who was having to isolate for 10 days and the knock-on effect to the rest of us was so difficult in terms of our increased workload, and stress, in their absence.

"In Spain they protected workers who had to isolate or care for family for covid reasons."

I'll be interesting to see what impact this has on women in the work place over the next 5-10years.

Sounds great as a short term solution but if it was at any impact (financially or on productivity) to the businesses then surely it would have an impact on their view of employing women in the future?

I totally agree with you OP and it’s a question o have asked myself many times, different schools and authorities seem to handle it so differently, sending kids home for just a runny nose etc.

I would not be keeping my child off for a runny nose and a little cough if they are perfectly well in themselves as it would be the common cold, If everyone was off for a sniffle then no one would be at work and find it quite frankly ridiculous. We need exposure of these germs, and especially in younger people to build their immune systems or we are starting a whole new problem for the future especially in a world where antiobiotic resistance is becoming a problem

Oh and to add I work in NHS If every staff member stayed off for a little cold they would be even more short staffed then they already are

A child gets sent home with symptoms and the next day tests positive for Covid but the rest of the class just carries on at school as normal. And as the mother/father of this child who got to isolate cant take time off work for 10 days so they ask his grandparents to look after him, and they do, and it’s not a problem or illegal in any way shape or form. Just like life used to be.

Once my parents have had their second doses they would absolutely step in to help in this situation. Because really, what’s the risk to them of looking after a well child who doesn’t have covid when covid no longer poses as much of a threat to them anyway? I actually think some of these things will just functionally break down before they get formally rescinded. Compliance with the rules in this country has been spectacularly high, exceeding expectations, and a lot of that has been because of fear. Fear will recede and compliance will start to reduce.

One aspect I'm thinking about is keeping my desktop computer & monitors at home in medium term. Mostly gathering dust, but if suddenly I can't go to work (due to a persistent cough, which I have had in normal times, and doesn't bother me but may become socially unacceptable to be in public with) I can keep working. Workplace is disorganised about tracking IT equipment and I never officially told anyone that I brought this stuff home, anyway. I do not have a good work laptop & even if I did, I couldn't get my work done efficiently at home with a dinky laptop screen. Will suddenly turn into an issue If I need IT hardware support, perhaps.

12-18 months when you can lateral flow test to check at home. But I would imagine the days of sending ill children, not ill ill but slightly snotty children in are a thing of the past. Yes more parents will need days off work to look after children at home.

I think normal interaction at schools from September when all adults have been vaccinated and there are booster jabs if need be for different virus strains.

To be honest in our preschool we have always had a guideline that children are not given a dose of calpol and sent in with a temperature - I kind of wish that never happens Covid or not (but know it does)

I hope that when children are able to be vaccinated that it will lead to greater normality.

Throughout all of this, though, I've held on to what we know now, and getting through this bit before worrying about the next bit...IYSWIM!

@Layladylay234

What concerns me is the changing goalposts. Protect the NHS,so schools closed Let's get the top 4 groups vaccinated,that will help lots Let's get the top 9 groups vaccinated

Then....what?

School also worried me. Last Sept,for the 1st case,they sent home the whole year group. Then they did just the close contacts. Yesterday,there were about 25 kids sent home to self isolate,the whole of my son's class and more. How can they ALL be close contacts of 1 child? This is year 7 at secondary.

The children sent home will vary depending on things like if the child travels to school on the bus so close contacts on the way to and from school will have to isolate and the seating plans for the child in classes, one child might have always say next to the same group of children but the other could have sat next to several in different classes, or the child could have been in contact with more people at lunchtime, or the child could have been to a club after school so will have been in contact with more children, a child might only have friends in the same class but others still hang out with the same friends from primary school so this crosses classes. They look at close contacts on a case by case basis.