55 years and over in Group 8 actually means 56 and over.

[bellinisurge]

An FB friend has spotted that the nhs website calls Group 8 "56 years and over" and the government calls Group 8 "55 years and over".
It's fiiiiiine

@Xenia

Gosh, dementia must be setting in. I typed test but meant first injection.

I will bide my time and think it over.
I wish we knew:-

1. How long it gives you immunity once the first 21 days are up. I think it is 4 - 6 months but no one seems to have studied those who had the vaccination in December 2020 yet or not enough time has passed to know or from the trials. Everyone I know who has had it has been ill for 2 days and I am just about never ill so I doubt my body would be too happy with it either. Obviously I realise loads of people have no after effects at all of course.
2. If it stops you passing on the virus to someone else.

I went to worship today for the first time since lockdown.. It is perfectly legal to go to worship, and has been throughout this lockdown. There were several older people there. I was asked if I had had the vaccine. I havent[not quite old enough for my area yet]. The lady at the door said not to worry, she had had hers so couldnt infect me. I thought, well she may have that wrong, but I didnt say anything.

This seems to be the thought amongst many people, that having the vaccine is the end of pandemic problems.

I have had covid. I have no idea whether I still have anti bodies or T cells or whatever. And no seems to be trying to find out either.

Seriously, @lightand? There are studies going on right now on Covid immunity! I mean, that's one of the first things they started doing!

And, as I said, having the jab seems to result in less likelihood of passing it on.

But, agreed, some older people don't realise that they still need to follow the rules.

When did they start the studies?
I, along with many others got covid back in March last year. 1 year ago! Why is it taking them so long, assuming you are correct, to find out the answers?!

@bellinisurge

Hi HelloThereMeHearties , this isn't a thread about other countries. Although you are, of course welcome to talk about that. And I suspect it would mean more to you if you were 55. As you were.

Nope, they’re just doing it one year at a time.

If you want answers, just look. And, amazingly, medical research sometimes takes a little while!

COVID research updates: T cells might provide rescue from rampant COVID variants
www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-00502-w

Covid-19: T cell response lasts for at least six months after infection, study shows
www.bmj.com/content/371/bmj.m4257

Study of Healthcare Workers Shows COVID-19 Immunity Lasts Many Months
directorsblog.nih.gov/2020/12/08/study-of-healthcare-workers-shows-covid-19-immunity-lasts-many-months/

I could post more, or you could look yourself

I could post loads more articles, @lightand. Just because you haven't heard about something, doesn't mean it isn't happening.

A quick Google search will inform you

@lightand

When did they start the studies? I, along with many others got covid back in March last year. 1 year ago! Why is it taking them so long, assuming you are correct, to find out the answers?!

People seem to be simultaneously cross a d worried about “the speed the vaccine was developed” but also cross and worried that we don’t have all the answers yet.

Back in March, the infrastructure wasn’t there to set up studies. The scientists are working as fast as they can, all over the world. Vaccines are a game-changer, new variants also possibly game changers.

Patience is a virtue etc.

Xenia - neither of your points seem enough to me to not have the vaccine. Not having all the answers to how long it confers immunity and to what extent it reduces or stops transmission don’t seem a good enough reason not to have the vaccine because on the basis of the research so far we can say it reduces transmission and severity of symptoms (good). If you’re concerned you’ll react badly to it that’s a different matter.

I think it's really important to keep repeating this point, as @NoSquirrels' answer seems to fall into the same trap:

The Covid jab does not confer immunity

The Covid jab lessens symptoms.

Patience is a virtue etc

Costs lives more like.

Quite right MeHearties I should have said “whether it confers immunity or for how long”.
My general point still stands though - not having all the answers doesn’t mean we don’t know enough to say the vaccine is worthwhile. It is worthwhile and unless people have serious medical doubts that it’s an appropriate treatment for them because of underlying conditions etc then they should have the vaccine - that’s what the research shows.

Yes, I’m annoyed about this as my dsis has just turned 55!

@lightand

Patience is a virtue etc

Costs lives more like.

OMG. Literally @lightand just do a very very quick Google search on "Covid immunity study". You'll find hundreds of articles on various different studies.

"I haven't been spoonfed a thing by the press" does not equal "This thing is not happening".

@NoSquirrels

Quite right MeHearties I should have said “whether it confers immunity or for how long”. My general point still stands though - not having all the answers doesn’t mean we don’t know enough to say the vaccine is worthwhile. It is worthwhile and unless people have serious medical doubts that it’s an appropriate treatment for them because of underlying conditions etc then they should have the vaccine - that’s what the research shows.

There is no "whether" it confers immunity, @NoSquirrels. It doesn't! At all! For any length of time!!

And we do pretty much have all the answers now about the vaccine. It lessens symptoms, massively decreases the necessity of hospital treatment to virtually 0%, and lowers the risk of transmitting the virus.

So if you aren't going to catch it then lessening immunity is irrelevant. Eg my neighbour never (and I mean never) leaves the house. She is a kind if hermit.

Or if we think if you might catch it this summer but not get it very badly but having the jab means 2 days in bed with no financial compensation and feeling rotten - difficult balance. Or if the protection is only likely to last 4 months and if it is mostly likely you would get covid next winter season so jab would have worn off by then and you would have had 2 days in bed with lost money for no reason....

Not easy issues even for those of us who are pro vaccination.

There is no "whether" it confers immunity, @NoSquirrels. It doesn't! At all! For any length of time!!

But I was just responding to the posters questions, the first of which was “how long it gives you immunity” and OK, rather than saying “It doesn’t! At all!” I was going for more of a “OK so even if we don’t know everything we know enough” which I hoped might be persuasive.

But apparently we do know everything so that’s also wrong.

I was trying to be encouraging not spread misinformation. My general point is the vaccine is safe, effective and valuable, regardless of whether it gives immunity or not, or if we have fully comprehensive research. (Which I am happy to accept your points on that no immunity and plenty research!)

There is no "whether" it confers immunity, @NoSquirrels. It doesn't! At all! For any length of time!!

What is your definition of ‘confers immunity?’ My understanding of it is ‘if exposed to the pathogen will not become infected.’

I would suggest that it does indeed confer immunity to some people, on the basis that people who have been vaccinated are around 2/3 less likely than the non-vaccinated to have a positive PCR test. What we don’t know is how many of those who didn’t become infected just didn’t encounter the pathogen as against being immune.

However, they are starting challenge trials, aren’t they? Those should show pretty clearly what proportion of people do not become infected despite being deliberately exposed to the virus.

As for the duration of immunity..... time needs to pass, obviously. They are still monitoring the original trial participants in order to be able to answer that question.

I have been following the booking website intently - its not going down by groups necessarily - it goes down in age sometimes. Ie once it was 65 year and over, then it was 64 years and over etc.

@Xenia If you are worried about not being right for 48 hours then book your vaccination for a Friday afternoon and keep your diary clear on Saturday/Sunday.

Or if we think if you might catch it this summer but not get it very badly but having the jab means 2 days in bed with no financial compensation and feeling rotten - difficult balance. Or if the protection is only likely to last 4 months and if it is mostly likely you would get covid next winter season so jab would have worn off by then and you would have had 2 days in bed with lost money for no reason....

If you have the jab you *may feel rotten for 48 hours, but you’ll have advance warning that this may^ be a possibility, so can plan accordingly.

If you catch it unvaccinated in the summer you will probably have symptoms much longer than 48 hours and may potentially have much more serious symptoms. You’ll also have no warning so no chance to plan, leading to greater disruption.

By winter flu season there’s the expectation that it will continue with booster jabs or vaccinations like the flu jab, the vaccine being tweaked every ‘season’ for predominant strains/variants.

I just think a known quantity of ‘feel a bit shit for 48 hours’ is likely to be much less disruptive overall than rolling the dice, plus it’s good for society as a whole that the more people who can be safely vaccinated take up their opportunity to do so.

My mother had the AZ jab, felt a bit ropey overnight. NightNurse sorted her out.

My DH had the jab on Friday - no side effects whatsoever.

And even if they'd been in bed for 48 hours - so what? Much better than getting Covid with no protection!

I must say, @Xenia, for someone who professes not to be anti vaxx, you're finding a lot of reasons not to have it!

A few points:

1. can’t believe some people are complaining how LONG it is taking to get scientific evidence ... the breakneck speed with which researchers around the world have sprung into action on something we didn’t even know existed just over a year ago is AMAZING. It’s one of the biggest feats of medical achievement in the modern age. It is incredible that we are so successfully vaccinating our population right now.

2. those getting bogged down in the practicalities of the trade off between possibly feeling a little unwell for a day or two with the vaccine (many people, probably a majority, have no symptoms btw) versus not bothering - you are completely missing the point that vaccinating you is not just about stopping you from getting the virus. This is a collective effort by humanity. Vaccination is about population-scale benefits, not your selfish narrow little perspective. Do your fellow humans a solid and get the bloody vaccine.

I had the first vaccination yesterday - the AZ. No side effects but a huge sense of relief that in three weeks I’ll have a significant amount of protection and a big step towards life returning to normal.
If I develop any side affects or need a booster in 6 or 12 months time, it’s not a problem. A small price to pay.

On the side effects, I have heard on here about them but I now know more than 20 people who have had the jab, mostly all AZ, and none of them, nor I, had any side effects at all other than a faintly sore arm at injection site. I think people who don’t get side effects are less likely to post than those who do so it makes it seem as if they are more common than they actually are.

@Karmatime

On the side effects, I have heard on here about them but I now know more than 20 people who have had the jab, mostly all AZ, and none of them, nor I, had any side effects at all other than a faintly sore arm at injection site. I think people who don’t get side effects are less likely to post than those who do so it makes it seem as if they are more common than they actually are.

Yes, I wondered this as all my neighbours have had it and haven't mentioned side effects, it's a bit like complaints about things as you are much more likely to complain if you have had a bad experience than mention it if you had a reasonable experience so I imagine many just had a sore arm which you would expect anyway.

Hi - I’m aged 55 and was able to book my vaccination just after midnight - earlier in the day I was still not eligible so looks like they are now doing 55 year olds.