Is anyone planning on refusing to allow their children to have the lateral flow tests.

[Witchcraftandhokum]

I'm really not looking to start a bunfight. Just tying to better understand the reasons if you are not planning on allowing your child to be tested.

@middleager no idea just sharing what was said earlier in thread.

[quote wildchild554]@middleager no idea just sharing what was said earlier in thread.[/quote]
You are right. It is 90 days.

DS had Covid back in November. He's y10 and had 6 isolations too.

He's missed so much time in school (45 days between Sept and Dec) and I worry that if he still tests positive, he will not be allowed in school.

And his Y10 brother would miss school too.

If some countries are saying you can still test positive after 180 days, then I'm nervous about our 90 day benchmark.

So far, I've given consent for my one y10 who hasn't had Covid, but I haven't yet replied to the other's school (a different secondary).

My area has just confirmed that kids who don't get tested in school can access other local test facilities.

This makes me more comfortable as that avoids the school chaos.

As I said upthread I think the tests are largely a performance to placate parents but at least that way it'll be done in a calmer environment, and nothing to do with teachers.

Middleeager: if a child tests positive, they shouldn't *be in school. That's the whole point of testing.

As for not allowing one's child to be tested, that's just appalling. It's also yet another example of why the UK has such a high death toll.

@MmeLaraque

Middleeager: if a child tests positive, they shouldn't *be in school. That's the whole point of testing.

As for not allowing one's child to be tested, that's just appalling. It's also yet another example of why the UK has such a high death toll.

No, it really isn't. The testing hasn't happened yet. None of the death toll can be blamed on that.

Johnson encouraged mixing over Christmas and over 30,000 people died in January.

Let's put blame where it belongs

The blame game starts before its even put in place 😆

@PracticingPerson

The blame starts at home with responsible adults. We know how a pandemic starts so have you checked and been mindful of your potential Covid footprint once you leave your safety home bubble. Have you always risk mitigated? Do you understand the science and follow the rules? Have you pushed the headroom boundaries of doing least possible or have you been astute and vigilant and proactive. Do you carry out multiple household mixing eg shopping too frequently than necessary etc? Do you therefore carrying out periodic asymptomatic testing to be sure that you are not the "inadvertent" super spreader? If you take this pandemic seriously you are a part of the solution as otherwise you may be a part of the cause. Make sure when called up you get vaccinated to protect yourself and your loved ones and those around you in everyday settings.

Why would anyone refuse measures to keep people safer? Do these people prefer risks to safety?

[quote ResIpsaLoquiturInterAlia]@PracticingPerson

The blame starts at home with responsible adults. We know how a pandemic starts so have you checked and been mindful of your potential Covid footprint once you leave your safety home bubble. Have you always risk mitigated? Do you understand the science and follow the rules? Have you pushed the headroom boundaries of doing least possible or have you been astute and vigilant and proactive. Do you carry out multiple household mixing eg shopping too frequently than necessary etc? Do you therefore carrying out periodic asymptomatic testing to be sure that you are not the "inadvertent" super spreader? If you take this pandemic seriously you are a part of the solution as otherwise you may be a part of the cause. Make sure when called up you get vaccinated to protect yourself and your loved ones and those around you in everyday settings.

Why would anyone refuse measures to keep people safer? Do these people prefer risks to safety? [/quote]
I'm in the 'polishing my halo' category on the covid front

I simply could not spread anything. I have done significantly more than required since I cancelled my first travel in February 2020.

My DH tests twice per week.

If I thought LFTs in schools were worth doing, I would do them. I still might do them, for the sake of it being easier than explaining.

I have explained again and again - I think LFTs risk making school less safe.

And it is because I (try to) understand the science, as much science as I can read, that I think LFTs are a big pile of crap

@PracticingPerson

Thanks for the halo although it is not deserved as all I trying to do is to make a little change. Perhaps even one person reading these messages might result in saving someone's life - who knows?

It's not personal as we are all in this together. You do not need to explain yourself to me but you are obviously in the alert and proactive category as most of us are. This is great as more of us need to be as alert and civic duty minded to all help to contain this pandemic.

I do believe that the lateral flow tests as according to agreed scientific reports not that perfect especially when compared to the PCR polymerase chain reaction test which is more accurate. However on balance both tests or simply tests and so more helpful than unhelpful. I rather get a potential false positive with a LFT so that I can follow to investigate more accurately with a PCR. And in doing so isolate in case positive rather than taking the opposite risky view of hopping to be not infected and contagious. Being cautious than risky.

You must understand the UK Covid statistics is shocking and perhaps this is a direct result of our relaxed attitude overall when compared to nations with much healthier Covid performance as implemented real lockdowns and imposed normal stricter risk mitigation measures including single masks for everyone bar the very young. We are fortunate in the UK to be world beating with vaccination as otherwise our Covid statistics will be even more elevated. The UK simply did not test test test in the outset to separate the ill from healthy and so locking down the majority healthy (as well as some ill) with resulting economic and mental pain and suffering.

The more serious we follow the agreed science the sooner we can move on post pandemic to save lives and livelihoods. Nobody likes masks or tests. I don't but I do it for the obvious benefits.

@PracticingPerson hear hear on all counts - we've been unbelievably goody two-shoes throughout, but are hugely conflicted about whether to consent to testing for exactly the reasons you cite. Like you, we may just do it anyway because I don't want to be thought a bastard, but it's such a bad idea. I did the maths: in our area, the prevalence is about 140 per hundred thousand - so 0.14%. Meanwhile, the false positive rate for LFTs is 0.32% (at least). So for every one case you pick up, you also generate two false positives. In a school of 2,000, testing twice a weeks, that's approx 6 false positives a week, I think 🤯

Thank you for making me feel less alone @BabycakesMatlala

And that maths is worrying

There will be approx 12 false positives a week in a school of 2000

It's apparently going to be confirmed with a PCR once the home testing starts. But the letter from my child's school just says children and contacts will have to isolate after positive ltf.

So it's potential false positives versus unchecked unknown incubation and super spreading until someone is seriously ill and needs hospitalisation.

I will prefer the LFT falsie positives than hoping there is no facilitation of super spreading especially as these tests will pick up more real positives than falsie ones.

Glad I came back on the thread - I was feeling bad until I saw yours and spring's posts. Found my spoddy stats people!

It's potential false positives AND BEHAVIOURAL CHANGES DUE TO FALSE REASSURANCE Vs cases it'll pick up. And the Birmingham trial run by Jon Deeks showed only 3% of positive cases were picked up. 3. Not a typo. 50% for self-administered is best case scenario. That's the concern. It's certainly not "agreed science" that's being followed.

Emphasis not shouting

@BabycakesMatlala

If the science is mixed or conflicting and these LFT tests are proven useless - obvious question why weaponise children as guinea pigs? Why not just implement the more accurate tests to avoid more issues?

@ResIpsaLoquiturInterAlia

They have bought these tests and need to use them up.

Because they'd already bought all the LFT tests (for billions) and they'd otherwise just not be used. And the PCR tests cost way more as they have to be sent to labs to be processed. (And, speculation not fact, unlike the previous sentences) the govt are desperate to make.school return look safe, and don't want to have to fork out any extra cash to do so, so easier to use the LFTs already purchased.) This is all in the mainstream public domain - it's not weird conspiracy theory stuff.

AND BEHAVIOURAL CHANGES DUE TO FALSE REASSURANCE

This x oooh, a million

Maybe we shouldn't go Fred's house in case we spread covid?
Doesn't matter, the tests will pick it up if we catch it anyway...

@PracticingPerson exacto. And there's massive thread full of people saying what a selfish twunt you'd be if you didn't consent to a test, will no one think of the children, but in reality, MN and real life are full of people seeing themselves as "bubbled" with friends, neighbours, family etc when it's just people they fancy seeing, letting the kids meet because "they're in school all day together anyway", whatever.

That behaviour will be massively worse once the testing is in place. If you can't understand why it's not OK to let your kids have friends round even though they're in class together, no bloody way are you going to understand the limitations of the LFTs.

When one think about 0.1+million who would otherwise be here healthy and breathing - I think this happened for many reasons but the major contributor is our collective behaviour.

This pandemic is as much as the deadly disease itself as much as our individual and collective behaviour.

The more I see people treating daily life as if nothing is going on the more I am super alter and cautious with my own over zealous health and safety mitigation regime. That does sadly include much time shielded away from potential trouble when ever possible.

This is a pandemic behaviour problem. We have different much worst Covid performance data to comparable neighbouring nations because of our British entitlement exceptionalism not scared behaviour! We don't care basically. Not you personally but probably your neighbour or someone you see being blasé. It all adds up and therefore the overwhelming of the NHS and our shocking Covid fatalities data.

Again shocked that potentially unfit for purposes tests may be dumped on children. Possibly need to prepare for schools to close shortly after fully reopening as it appears unsustainable in the longer term. Not until new vaccines for children too.

People on both sides of this issue over this ind of test are good people wanting to protect others. In my view using up the tests we over bought might do more harm than good and may be we should donate them to another country instead or to employers who want them.

@MmeLaraque

Middleeager: if a child tests positive, they shouldn't *be in school. That's the whole point of testing.

As for not allowing one's child to be tested, that's just appalling. It's also yet another example of why the UK has such a high death toll.

Did you read my post?

My one child had Covid in November, the other did not.

I'm concerned as to what might happen if children, just outside the 90 day test exemption window, still read as positive. In some countries the window is 180 days.

In theory, my child could have a false positive for every LFT test he takes, then when exactly would he be allowed into school again? He's year 10 and had six isolations between September and December, so of course I'm concerned.