Australia vs UK

[JC17fj74]

Ok so I follow some celebrities and influencers on Insta who live in Australia, I've just watched their stories of them out yes that's right OUT in bars and clubs dancing, drinking and partying all close together having FUN 😫 Do you remember what it was like to go out and have Fun? 😂🤦🏻‍♀️
I understand Australia is the other side of the world but they had bad cases not so long ago didn't they?!
HOW are they at that stage where they even have bars and clubs open, let along be able to party with no masks inside in close proximity?!!!
I can't see us doing any of that anytime soon 😭
What are we doing wrong? Why are we in lockdown with no date or plan to get out of this hell when other countries are getting back to normal? Dubai is another one I've seen people enjoying life there too. But surely the Rona is still around in these countries?

I’m just posting this for people who keep going on about population density of Australia ( this is 2016 but will be very similar)

Bearing in mind as well that the state premiers who enforced lockdown have come in for fairly intense criticism and even threats. Most people have been supportive - the QLD premier won re-election with her rigid border closure and covid response generally viewed favourably - but it doesn’t detract from their strong leadership.

I have posted before about how there was an element of luck that Australia wasn’t hit harder by covid, they certainly made mistakes that they got away with( to a certain extent).

The fact the individual state premiers made their own decisions regarding it( with their health teams of course) meant that one persons mistake didn’t cost the whole of Australia. They also learned from each other’s mistakes and triumphs.

@starrynight21, you forgot to mention that Abbott has zero actual experience with trade deals. Man's an embarrassment.

I'm getting a bit sick of people saying our numbers in Australia are only good because it's summer. Covid19 started for us in February (today is the anniversary of our Premier declaring a public health emergency) and we were heading into winter. There's not been an appreciable difference between winter and summer numbers for us.

I think it’s low population density, distance from the rest of the world and government restrictions that saved us.
It has come at a cost though. Through my work I know of quite a few people who were unable to say goodbye to loved ones living overseas before they died. Their relatives were usually unable to get a flight to Australia due to restrictions on numbers and airlines cancelling flights. If they got here they still had to spend two weeks in hotel quarantine. There were even delays with relatives struggling to get approval to cross state borders.

Australia doesn’t have low population density!!

I am glad for them that they can move freely but scared and anxious as an expat when I will be able to travel back without 2 weeks quarantine which as a person with a full time job and 2 toddlers effectively means the country is closed to me for the foreseeable future & I am cut off from my family.

I don’t see any will in oz to reopen and my anxiety is through the roof about probably not seeing elderly family members again at all, or even my siblings and my nephews and nieces for years on end.

(And I know no one gives a sh1t and it’s my fault for being a selfish expat who expected to be able to travel the world but it’s still upsetting.)

@Insert1x20p

A good summary .

But our media is intent on comparing the uk with Australia and New Zealand rather than that of sour European neighbours such as Spain , france and italy. Just to prove how everything is the governments fault .

They also conveniently forget how even when we did have rules people were resentful and broke them .

And also when warnings were given about mixing people only heard the bits they wanted to .

It’s not black and white and very unfair to compare countries with totally different demographics .

I am not saying mistakes were not made , but if you look at at European graphs the general lines are very similar , even if the governments chose to do different things .

"I am not saying mistakes were not made , but if you look at at European graphs the general lines are very similar , even if the governments chose to do different things ."

No European country has implemented a working track and trace system. That's the issue.

No track & trace system in the world can cope with a large number of cases - there were even jokes about Mildred the beleaguered contact tracer in Victoria back in the early days

By far the biggest contributor to success has been the ability to shut borders (international and national) which is not really an option in europe or even the U.K. with its heavy dependence on trucked freight and lack of true control over the northern Irish border

Speaking to my bff in Cairns yesterday and comparing our situations (I live in London) was really depressing.

Lockdown 3 with no end in sight. I know UK and Aus are not strictly comparable. But I have to say, when I moved here I really thought this country would cope well with emergencies and disasters. Sad to be wrong.

@stealthbanana

Australia doesn’t have low population density!!

I am glad for them that they can move freely but scared and anxious as an expat when I will be able to travel back without 2 weeks quarantine which as a person with a full time job and 2 toddlers effectively means the country is closed to me for the foreseeable future & I am cut off from my family.

I don’t see any will in oz to reopen and my anxiety is through the roof about probably not seeing elderly family members again at all, or even my siblings and my nephews and nieces for years on end.

(And I know no one gives a sh1t and it’s my fault for being a selfish expat who expected to be able to travel the world but it’s still upsetting.)

I totally hear you about being anxious around not seeing family. My family are in the UK and usually try to visit once a year. I know that I won’t be able to travel back with my daughter until end of 22, by that point I won’t have seen my dad for four years. Im hoping at some point the borders reopen so they can visit before then. It’s so hard 😔

"No track & trace system in the world can cope with a large number of cases"

Right, and the countries that implemented them quickly didn't ever have to cope with a large number of cases, precisely because they had the system.

Totally circular argument. Numerous Asian countries offered to help European countries set such systems up, but were told the help wasn't needed. And still, the west can't accept that Asia is doing better than them in almost every area these days.

@Lauraa7 and @stealthbanana hugs to you and anyone else who hasn't and won't see their family for a long time. Just want to hug my parents. They are getting old. It's so hard isn't it

@stealthbanana

Australia doesn’t have low population density!!

I am glad for them that they can move freely but scared and anxious as an expat when I will be able to travel back without 2 weeks quarantine which as a person with a full time job and 2 toddlers effectively means the country is closed to me for the foreseeable future & I am cut off from my family.

I don’t see any will in oz to reopen and my anxiety is through the roof about probably not seeing elderly family members again at all, or even my siblings and my nephews and nieces for years on end.

(And I know no one gives a sh1t and it’s my fault for being a selfish expat who expected to be able to travel the world but it’s still upsetting.)

There are plenty here in Australia that want to see international borders open again. Don’t forget it’s a country with a huge number of migrants and they won’t want to be separated from family forever. Even among those without relatives overseas plenty want the chance to travel again once the vaccine is rolled out.

Yes, there is a vocal ‘keep us locked down and safe forever’ minority but they don’t represent the whole country.

@bluetongue

That’s a good point. I know I’ve been of the opinion that it’s ok, I will see family next year, our holidays abroad can happen next year.

We are now next year and it still seems at least another year away before travel will resume.

However I’m still happy with how things have been handled here as my family have been able to experience day to day living as close to normal as possible.

I'm getting a bit sick of people saying our numbers in Australia are only good because it's summer. Covid19 started for us in February (today is the anniversary of our Premier declaring a public health emergency) and we were heading into winter. There's not been an appreciable difference between winter and summer numbers for us.

Totally agree with this - we did the hard yards at the riskiest time, heading into winter.

I do feel that many in the northern hemisphere, and I definitely lump the US in here too, were so blasé (those in charge, and the general populous) because they were going into summer, and it just didn’t feel like a real problem.

I too have not seen my family in a long time.

Our son, my brother & his young family and my elderly parents.

We are not likely to see them until 2022 at the earliest. So a full four years for us.

I am so so grateful to be in Australia, but it is surreal and so so worrying to not be able to see my family.

@stealthbanana

Australia doesn’t have low population density!!

I am glad for them that they can move freely but scared and anxious as an expat when I will be able to travel back without 2 weeks quarantine which as a person with a full time job and 2 toddlers effectively means the country is closed to me for the foreseeable future & I am cut off from my family.

I don’t see any will in oz to reopen and my anxiety is through the roof about probably not seeing elderly family members again at all, or even my siblings and my nephews and nieces for years on end.

(And I know no one gives a sh1t and it’s my fault for being a selfish expat who expected to be able to travel the world but it’s still upsetting.)

Yeah but compared to the UK we do have low population density. It’s just that often people look at the size of Australia on a map and assume that we live throughout the country when in reality the bulk of Australia’s population is around the coastal fringe.

From mumsnet posters, I get the impression that so many people in the UK live in housing conditions we would consider cramped, many seem to not have gardens or only tiny ones, and whenever they go on walks or parks or whatever so do hundreds of others. While obviously you’re not going to catch covid from your neighbours just because you can hear them above/below/thru walls etc, that density of housing is reflected in shops, parks, etc and hence probably the spread of covid. That squishiness is just not the norm in Australia (except maybe if you’re trying to park at some beaches in high population urban areas on weekends).

So while things in the UK were handled poorly, Australia definitely had an edge against the spread that the UK didn’t, so part of the Australia situation with covid is also down to better circumstances to limit the disease to begin with.

It really isn't just population density, and location, plus a bit of luck...

The UK - with a population density of 275 people per square kilometre - has lost well over 100,000 now.

And yet South Korea - with a population density far greater than the UK at 503 people per square kilometre - has suffered only 1,399 deaths.

www.abc.net.au/news/2021-01-30/seven-countries-with-better-coronavirus-response-than-australia/13102988

I’m not sure how the countries were ranked but a little information about what some of the higher ranked countries done

Looking from the outside I think two recent contributing factors in the UK have been people's need/desire/ sense of entitlement for a holiday in the sun and Boris's decision to load up the sentimentality around Christmas. From here both those approaches were like watching someone drive over a cliff.

And on the other side of the ledger, UK seems to be doing an amazing job rolling out the vaccines while Australia has not yet started.

Probably because there is no great need to hurry.

Exactly that. It would be selfish to be vaccinating ahead of those countries who really do need the vaccine to get on top of things. If there are few, or none, in the community with the virus there is no rush to vaccinate. We can cope with the borders being shut for a while longer.