Can we unlock the schools at start of Feb?

[MeandT]

I'm totally supportive of the lockdown BUT by the end of next week, case numbers nationally will be the same as they were at end of November. Hospital admissions are falling again.

Rather than going back into tiers with the shops and food pubs open (where all the spreading happened in December), can we not issue all the teachers with N95 masks (and vaccines for the clinically vulnerable), make all the kids wear triple layer face masks all the time, and just get on with the important job of educating this country's kids in person? Starting again 1st of Feb.

AIBU to ask if we can send the kids back as soon as we hit the case rate we unlocked at on 2nd December?

IABU= no way, the cases will shoot up too quickly again, even if they all wear masks all day.

IANBU = yes, get them back before half term, the only reason it went nuts in December was because everyone was out Christmas shopping and seeing family.

NO

YABU

I don’t know, Marsha. From their viewpoint, their businesses are being run into the ground over and over, whilst the schools which are causing the problems were being kept open. A beautician said to me that she accepted it until she realised children could be taught online but she has no chance of doing her job unless she works in person. I just don’t think there is much goodwill left and parents/teachers are not the only people who are affected and have an opinion

@Flinstones

Schools need to open ASAP will people stop saying keep them shut!! If your scared keep your kids out. Our children need there schools. There are other issues in the world other than COVID

There won't be if you let the virus run free

@noblegiraffe

Zobo I can see what you’re trying to do but the thing is that schools opened with no mitigation measures on the premise that it was safe to do so. That children didn’t catch covid as often and if they did, they didn’t transmit it as readily.

That data from SAGE shows that was not true.

It was as if living in a parallel universe from September to December. On every news bulletin we were told wear a mask, keep your distance blah blah blah, hands, face, space. Restricted numbers in pubs, restaurants, shops and perspex screens in every establishment but walk into a school and bam! Crowded spaces and no masks. it made absolutely no sense. Even the public transport buses in London dedicated to school children were permitted to exceed the numbers stated for adult commuters. The science experts went into great detail telling us that covid is a highly infectious, airborne virus and that we all have a duty to observe distancing and restrictions to avoid this exponential growth. They stood next to Boris Johnson and all the others who in the next breath said oh but it's absolutely fine to ignore all this science when it comes to schools. I'm just amazed that there are people who feel we should just go ahead and repeat the same mistakes all over again.

Why are people so awful on these threads, blimey some of you need to back to school yourselves

@BustopherPonsonbyJones

I don’t know, Marsha. From their viewpoint, their businesses are being run into the ground over and over, whilst the schools which are causing the problems were being kept open. A beautician said to me that she accepted it until she realised children could be taught online but she has no chance of doing her job unless she works in person. I just don’t think there is much goodwill left and parents/teachers are not the only people who are affected and have an opinion

It’ll be a mix. Some people are desperate to work and need schools open to facilitate it, this will include beauticians.

In the sector I work in usually spending seems to track what is open and what is not. People hold back more when schools shut.

We’ll see but school as priority has been one constant lately, so fingers crossed it sticks.

@2018SoFarSoGreat

I'm in California and our schools have been closed since last March. All but a very few private (I think exclusively, maybe a few non-private) schools back with restrictions and submitted safety plans.

It does not look like they'll go back this school year either. Terribly sad, but look at our numbers - 400,000+ without schools being in. What would it look like if our (California being enormous) schools were in session? Unbearable to consider.

Wow-I didn’t realise that.

Can I ask a few questions?

Have most families got devices to work remotely on? Is there Key Worker provision offered by schools so that many teachers are in the building? What do parents do about work/‘childcare’?

@ImBoredAgain I see the problem. "They need to go back their education has suffered enough. However there’s no way my 7 year old is being forced to wear a mask all day or sit in a cold room with windows open."

Parents generally would like kids back in school as soon as it can be reasonably safe.

Some parents are not prepared to take any measures whatsoever to reduce the rate of covid transmission.

And so, we sit at home and wait. And wait some more. And our kids stare at screens and miss classroom discussions, and seeing their friends.

Because in this country we've given up on science. Cause and effect. And being prepared to give a tiny iota of personal privilege for the greater good.

What an amazing 'first' world nation we are.

@Parker231 I agree, the sooner everyone wears masks everywhere outside the home (including, by default, schools), the sooner we can get through this. It is after all, a RESPIRATORY virus. Some countries have got their heads around this. Apparently it is still eluding quite a lot of people here in the UK thanks to vocal social media groups posting reams of anti-science every day. Hey ho

DH’s secondary school made staff and pupils wear masks in corridors and classrooms from mid-Nov. Covid then ripped through all year groups and the school shut early for Xmas. Masks aren’t enough.

@MeandT

I’m well aware of the science, I’m frontline NHS (or was until November and still would be if allowed but I’m pregnant) but this is boring now and we need to go back to normal, let the vulnerable and those who wish to hide away from it do so and let everyone else go back to normal

Not all beauticians need schools to open as they don’t have school-aged children, Marsha. I think we (on Mumsnet) forget everyone isn’t passionate about schooling as they aren’t directly affected.

I’m glad it’s not my decision. So many lives are affected either way.

If only it was a thing that your nose grew every time you told a fib! We'd have some real stonkers on here!

We need to get cases right down and then open with masks, ventilation and possibly rotas. We need this to happen as quickly as is safely possible - for most kids, including mine, in-person school is the best. Kids need other kids, a screen is no substitute.

But we can't just send them back as we were before until the infection risk is under control. This isn't just about the risk to the adults in their lives and wider community. Children are also at risk from Long Covid and a human right to be protected from this:
aged 12-16 it is one in seven chance
aged under 12 it is one in eight

Figures from ONS surveillance survey
www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/healthandsocialcare/healthandlifeexpectancies/adhocs/12788updatedestimatesoftheprevalenceoflongcovidsymptoms

Yeah, all those 5 year olds are gonna keep them on properly.... And then break time they'll all have to come off, and then lunch time...

@BustopherPonsonbyJones

Not all beauticians need schools to open as they don’t have school-aged children, Marsha. I think we (on Mumsnet) forget everyone isn’t passionate about schooling as they aren’t directly affected.

I’m glad it’s not my decision. So many lives are affected either way.

No they don’t but schooling is generally seen as a priority for our society.

Tg! It’s hard enough to get dc in without this prioritisation.

STAFFDONTBLOWITNOW Why do you feel the need to point out my grammar errors? What a mean person you are. Is this how you have a debate? My opinion is different to yours so you go to bullying playground behaviour. How sad

@SleepingStandingUp
But in the words of the advert, ‘every little helps’ and they will learn very quickly how to use them properly. If the alternative is to keep your child, at home, I think you will soon come round to the idea.

IMBOREDAGAIN Well said & I think your in a position to say

We don't have good clear public info videos, and people still think it's a hand washing issues. Everyone is on a different page,we need unity, it's on our breath, stop talking.

I actually think masks and visors should be used for senior school and staff.
I struggle with some masks but others are much more bearable and a visor to help stop aerosols in the eyes.
Imagine how much we could surpress this by wearing masks and visors.

What I find strange however is I have someone collegues who are genuinely scared of the virus, they have highly vulnerable relatives, they are very scathing of play grounds open and used and they want to get into the classroom now.

I can't get my head around it?
It's really not that they don't fear this virus!

@ImBoredAgain Wow! "It's boring now."

What a great reason to give up and just let the virus rip through society so that hospitals are even more packed than the 30%+ covid beds they already are in my local area.

Because you are BORED of it?!?

If you're sat home getting bored of covid because you're on pregnancy leave, could I perhaps suggest that taking up knitting would be a more constructive way to fill the time than advocating for giving up on applying sensible, science based measures to let as much if society open up as possible without transmission rates going up?

I think we should all be worried that you are, literally 'bored again'...sounds distinctly sociopathic!

Schools will need to stay shut a bit longer to get the infection rate right down. I don’t honestly believe teachers can teach properly and communicate in an ffp3, younger children can’t wear masks safely (as per WHO guidance for schools, not something the UK made up), sitting still in temperatures in single figures in the classroom because all windows are open and it’s snowing outside is a definite health risk as well as being unpleasant and making learning difficult. I don’t want to follow countries who have introduced non evidence based rules. People suggesting that wearing a mask walking on your own in a field just sound ridiculous , let’s have some common sense. It’s not ideal having kids out of school but perhaps it’s the least worst option for the next few weeks. We’ll be in a different situation in March/April

Surely keeping us alive and safe is societies first priority?

Teachers can and have wear a mix of visors and masks, a visor at least stops their breath shooting directly towards the students, and then switch to a mask, for other work.
But that doesn't protect them from 30 students.

@LickEmbysmiling

Surely keeping us alive and safe is societies first priority?

Who are you asking? If it’s me then sort of

The objective atm is to lower hospitalisation

After this schools are the priority

but this is boring now

Right.