Staggered reopening of schools by area?

[LacyEdge]

Jenny Harries has said today that schools might be reopened gradually by region, depending on the local infection rate.

What do you think about this? And which areas do you reckon would be first/last?

I think it would be ok if consideration is given to the impact of this on young people, especially Years 10 - 13 in areas left closed longer, in terms of their outcomes/grades and what is done to support them in future. Because let's all give up the pretence that online emergency learning is in any way as good as learning in school.

And it would be much better all round if proper investment was made in making school setting safer, as well. PPE, commandeer space, recruit additional teaching staff, rotas if need be, WHATEVER. And before anyone starts on about how much that is going to cost - these are the very young people who will be paying for this shitshow so it would probably be best if we all started to invest in their learning and wellbeing.

Unless, hopefully, they stage a revolution instead.

@Truelymadlydeeplysomeonesmum

Oh sorry you are right I should have said how BAME was defined in this scenario.

They are saying black and Asian people. Black carers has been a particularly issue as you can imagine. When they say Asian it seems to be the same Asian communities are at highest risk. I know the Muslim community is being targeted with a campaign to promote the vaccine for example.

I only mentioned it as we make up a small percentage of the population, but have heard many say they won't be involved. It's hard because the government haven't helped us at all, in fact they have been so racist and upset a lot of people who just don't trust them. It is hard because as one community refuses it spreads to other areas when word gets out.

Talk is definitely happening about priority list 2. The vaccine minister definitely seemed to suggest that police, teachers and customer facing retail staff will be the top of that. Nothing official confirmed yet though.

I hope he meant school staff not just teachers.

Anyway that would be one thing ticked off. Plus the staff over 50, in group 4 or 6 will be done soon no matter what.

It does kind of make sense, but I would only support it if there were set rules about what criteria had to be met before schools open. I'm in the north, so based on experience of the tiers system, my kids would be the last back no matter how low our rates are.

In my part of Greater Manchester, rates are similar to where we were in October, when schools were open. I disagree that schools need to be closed here now when they weren’t then.

Reopening gradually makes sense, my kids are really suffering from a social isolation perspective (too young to leave the house to meet a friend solo).

I can’t see the Us for Us brigade accepting a moment’s delay in full reopening, for a start

Literally don't give a shit what those bellends think. Teachers and school staff have been 'for them' for their whole careers, irrespective of who 'them' is.

Have they completely forgotten about the new strain ripping through schools just before Christmas? Is that no longer a concern? Are we going to have schools opening and closing on a weekly basis as it spreads across the country?

Tbh i think JH will end up in court over some of her pronouncements.

Take everything she says and reverse it and you will be ok.

Problem with tiers and opening schools in tiers is
Cities are more likely to be higher.
But say our city also has all the shops / most of the pubs and services.
So supermarkets spreading it will spread it more in cities as more customers etc.
Rural needs the city services but doesnt get the school closure.
Then when finally low enough rates in city then all schools open then pubs and cases rocket as there are more pubs and gyms etc too.
Also some areas with say coastline but also a lot of shops seem to get hit when everyone day trips.

But it could be a good motivator. Behave and your kids will get back to school though not last long parents will be straight back at the clubs and swimming etc...

Schools up north were badly hit early last term now shut when some of their cases are lower.
Rotas are fairer.

If people want the schools open then push for masks as it may slow cases down.
And proper whole class self isolation.
Or saliva tests where they test whole classes or schools.

GypsyLee

Yes I know there are a lot of issues. Lack of trust in the government and the experts is massive.

Also I personally think some of the social media stuff is deliberately there to cause a problem. There are some evil people about. As well as nutters.

My friend is Muslim and the stuff she gets sent to her from people in her community. It is very worrying that some people believe the anti vax stuff.

'No, my understanding is Dr Harries is saying children can and do transmit the virus but she doesn't have evidence of them being drivers of large-scale community infections. In other words the infection rate in schools rather reflects the infection rate in the community as a whole.’

spot on.

@HSHorror

Tbh i think JH will end up in court over some of her pronouncements.

Take everything she says and reverse it and you will be ok.

Problem with tiers and opening schools in tiers is
Cities are more likely to be higher.
But say our city also has all the shops / most of the pubs and services.
So supermarkets spreading it will spread it more in cities as more customers etc.
Rural needs the city services but doesnt get the school closure.
Then when finally low enough rates in city then all schools open then pubs and cases rocket as there are more pubs and gyms etc too.
Also some areas with say coastline but also a lot of shops seem to get hit when everyone day trips.

But it could be a good motivator. Behave and your kids will get back to school though not last long parents will be straight back at the clubs and swimming etc...

Schools up north were badly hit early last term now shut when some of their cases are lower.
Rotas are fairer.

If people want the schools open then push for masks as it may slow cases down.
And proper whole class self isolation.
Or saliva tests where they test whole classes or schools.

Masks actually do very little in reality, they are just a placebo to make everyone feel better. Classes were ‘properly isolating’ in most cases before xmas Saliva tests are very unreliable

@RuleWithAWoodenFoot

I can’t see the Us for Us brigade accepting a moment’s delay in full reopening, for a start

Literally don't give a shit what those bellends think. Teachers and school staff have been 'for them' for their whole careers, irrespective of who 'them' is.

Massive round of applause for this. Very well said.

Can't believe anyone takes Jenny Harries seriously when she has spouted misinformation time and time again and said things that are blatantly idiocy. She cares more about trying to force everyone to believe her earlier assumptions were right than about actually being right. And she has a deep contempt for teachers.

@noblegiraffe

but I like JH. She speaks sense

Hmm. She said that covid wouldn’t transmit in classrooms because all the kids would be facing forward. And also that kids never ate stuff from each other’s lunchboxes.

She has been catastrophically wrong on the issue of schools so far.

Agree.

Where schools are concerned I think the opposite of what she said is probably sensible!

We are at a stage where who shouts the loudest gets listened too.

Union pressure has helped, as has all the unions uniting in one aim and teachers and heads, supporting that.

It won't be as easy to open school again without it being safe, esp now legally, the gov has been put on notice.
Secondly, with the background of our horrific world beating death rates, no one should be pushed or rushed anywhere.

In other words the infection rate in schools rather reflects the infection rate in the community as a whole.’

And this graph says she’s talking bollocks.

And the data that shows that a child is 7 times more likely to be the first case in a household and more than twice as likely as age 17+ to infect family members. That’s from a bloody SAGE report. She knows.

Masks do considerably help!

They slow the rate of aerosols expired on the breath!

Everyone has to wear one though.

@noblegiraffe

Have they completely forgotten about the new strain ripping through schools just before Christmas? Is that no longer a concern? Are we going to have schools opening and closing on a weekly basis as it spreads across the country?

I think between the vaccine and the new variant being less transmitable than first thought (40% more not 70%) they are feeling less worried.

It would be foolish to immediately rely on the vaccine and tiers alone but there you go.

The data for age groups by cases definitely means there is real evidence for masks from year 5 upwards. They can't escape that now. The evidence wasn't there in September.

Sadly JH has no idea at all about schools!! I can see the logic about those opening 1st in areas of low infection , however I wonder how this will be defined? For example in my county there are areas with very few cases, but in other areas of the county cases are high. Therefore if it’s done on a whole county basis areas of low infection will be penalised.

Jennie H is marginally better than ‘Gav the Muppet’.

The most important thing is some orderly planning to this.

We certainly don’t need a media frenzy of London schools are all back in so let’s reinstate exams.

And we definitely don’t want a situation where we are all back in for half a term only to be out again.

Here’s why it’s idiotic to be less worried about the new variant in terms of schools. Look at London and the SE on the school attendance graph! Redbridge secondaries had 17% attendance the last week of term.

Jenny on masks.

Is she going to clarify whether communal areas with no social distancing include classrooms because the government don’t usually count them under that term.

Whatever happens with schools opening, they need to take account of children who are vulnerable to covid. They have pretty much been forgotten about by everyone as far as I can tell. In September they were forced back into schools just the same as all the other kids. They can't have a vaccine and neither can those caring for them. As the mother of such a child, I get so cross whenever someone says 'once all the vulnerable have been vaccinated'.

@noblegiraffe

Here’s why it’s idiotic to be less worried about the new variant in terms of schools. Look at London and the SE on the school attendance graph! Redbridge secondaries had 17% attendance the last week of term.

My London school no one attended in the last two weeks of term

Totally agree. Why keep a school closed in a rural area where barely any infections.... some areas have lower population and much lower infection rate and yet closed. Reopen those and stagger. Don't reopen in areas with higher infection rate yet.

@noblegiraffe

Jenny on masks.

Is she going to clarify whether communal areas with no social distancing include classrooms because the government don’t usually count them under that term.

I think it is dreadful that classrooms are not counted as communal areas. Our classrooms will have up to 8 different groups of students in it a day plus registration groups so potentially 225 students plus staff in and out over the course of a day.