Two Women fined for walking for Starbucks

[Superketchup]

What rule have they broken? I don’t understand. Two of them met - yes can meet one other person - they’d driven 5 miles - surely that’s ok?! - and they had a Starbucks each which the police said was a picnic?!
Why are they keeping takeaways open if it’s agaisnt the law to get one? I took my kids to the park, the coffee shop was open for takeaway. It was freezing. We got a hot chocolate each. I’m too scared to do so again!

@TrustTheGeneGenie

&No, let me clarify it properly for you* You are allowed exercise. Not a stroll 5 miles from home and a nice warm drink. If you can’t exercise at home, then go to your local park or whatever

No, let me clarify it for you. You are allowed to drive for exercise. You are allowed to buy takeaway coffee and you are allowed to meet up with one other person outside. Totally legal. A stroll is exercise and therefore legal. There is no minimum speed at which a walk is classed as exercise.

If those women are in the right then perhaps i will drive 10 miles from home and meet up with my sister and her kids under 5 and “exercise” my DH can go in his own car and tag along and meet up with his “one exercising mate”
That's fine, whats your point?

While we are at it why don’t I get my other family members to join us in separate cars and meet up with one mate there? If we all bring a food item each bet we can have a picnic too. ...

Well yes you could but that's when it becomes a gathering and therefore not legal. They didn't do that though so it's pretty irrelevant. They also didn't eat anything, let alone sit down on a blanket and share food.

It’s about not abusing and bending the rules to do something that’s not essential. It’s about understanding why we are actually in lockdown in the first place

I think we all understand why we are in lockdown, but I think most of us also understand that this is not a risk, and the payback in mental health is massive.

The point is we can all find perfectly legal ways to not take any personal responsibility towards helping to bring the cases and R rate down. You prove my point.

If I wanted to go to the local park for exercise, I would drive there. As it’s a mile away and coming back we would have a steep hill to climb. I don’t fancy pushing my baby in a pushchair and walking with my youngest DS that far.
Did these women have to really drive so many miles to get to the first park or suitable area to exercise? If they want they can make excuses up such as the nearest park to them is not suitable or nice etc etc
If we start accepting excuses then people will continue making them.
In the same way I said if I wanted to I could also make excuses up. Such as meeting up with my friend and our under 5s in a park 5, 10, 15 miles away. As long as we went in different cars. At the same time my DH could take his car and meet up with one of his pals so many miles away too. In fact why stop there, I could get my siblings to also drive out in their own cars and meet their “one” friend in the park. It’s perfectly legal. We traveled alone. We met one friend each. Big deal? However, we don’t do this despite missing each other tremendously. We know doing so will not help our current situation and get us out of lockdown. My risk is low and so is my family’s, however we still stick to the rules and do the bare minimum.
Your only response to the scenario I gave was “that’s fine what’s your point ?”

I understand MH is important. I totally get that. However, hearing of 1000+ deaths a day and the fact we are in lockdown because of the increased deaths/positive cases, must not help MH greatly either?? Having delayed hospital appointments for MH care and over the phone GP appointments for MH, don’t help people suffering with MH just like lockdown doesn’t.

@QueenoftheAir

Indeed *@maddiemookins16mum*

What do people NOT understand about "STAY AT HOME" ?

You all think you can calculate your risk. You can't. We should all be behaving as if we were active carriers of the virus, and are infectious.

..... but we can?

If we all behaved like that the country would immediately collapse as nobody would be going to work for a start off...

What do people NOT understand about "STAY AT HOME" ?

You're ALLOWED to go out for a local walk!
I agree with you that it's debatable whether driving into another county and meeting up with a friend is acceptable or taking the pee, (after all as you say we're supposed to be staying at home unless essential) but there is nothing wrong with going for a walk/exercising in the fresh air locally, in fact it's vital for mental health.

The point is we can all find perfectly legal ways to not take any personal responsibility towards helping to bring the cases and R rate down.
You prove my point.

How are they not doing that?

I prove the point that you're making up your own rules.

@TrustTheGeneGenie

No she's having a walk. What is your life when that's a "jolly"

Is that essential exercise or socialising though?

A walk is exercise regardless of who you're with. The action of walking is an exercise.

If I wanted to go to the local park for exercise, I would drive there. As it’s a mile away and coming back we would have a steep hill to climb. I don’t fancy pushing my baby in a pushchair and walking with my youngest DS that far

See, this is the difference between drivers and non drivers (aware I'm generalising there, not all car drivers etc lol) - but seriously, a mile?!
That's literally a 15 - 20 minute walk.

Is that essential exercise or socialising though?

Why can't it be both? You are permitted to walk with someone else, the idea being (presumably) that it allows people to make contact with other people and so do them good both physically and mentally / emotionally.

@QueenoftheAir

Indeed *@maddiemookins16mum*

What do people NOT understand about "STAY AT HOME" ?

You all think you can calculate your risk. You can't. We should all be behaving as if we were active carriers of the virus, and are infectious.

But you are allowed to exercise. That is written into the law. Stay indoors if you want, I will be using my legal right to exercise out of doors for my physical and mental health.

So basically you’re having a jolly.

We’ll I’m having a walk - I do expect to have a nice time catching up with my friend. It’s specifically allowed to meet one other person!

but there is nothing wrong with going for a walk/exercising in the fresh air locally, in fact it's vital for mental health.

And for physical health. I’d rather meet this virus when reasonably fit, with a few good lungful of fresh air, rather than as a pasty blob.

Staying outside for exercise, away from other people - which might mean travel, for some- makes good sense.

"So basically you’re having a jolly."

You do realise that being miserable is no protection from Covid?

"It’s about not abusing and bending the rules to do something that’s not essential. It’s about understanding why we are actually in lockdown in the first place"

actually, as has been pointed out numerous times, no "rules" were abused or bent in this intsnace. and actually I totally understand why we are in this lockdown. It is to reduce the transmission of a virus, which is currently very prevelant in the community. And thus my point that what the women were doing was not only within the rules, but also a very, very low risk of increasing transmission of the virus, which is precisely why it is, you know, within the actual rules.
And it is not up to you to decide what is "essential" to a person. You have no clue what someone else is expereincing. Nor do I. It is not my job to make that deicison either. But I do appreciate that people have other essential needs that may not be the same as mine.

Maybe they should put a restriction on how far then everyone knows , 5 miles especially in some places isn't a lot , but some are going -15/20 and some more

Just read someone elses update which says sat in car ?? If thats the case that's why then

A poster said that, but the news report doesn’t.

Did these women have to really drive so many miles to get to the first park or suitable area to exercise?

Maybe they thought it was better to drive 5 miles to stay away from other people?

The problem with this story is if it's true / there's nothing more too it, it makes a complete farce of situation.

People would be far more tolerant if the police had spend NYE breaking up house parties and fining everyone who attended- that's against the law.

Fining 2 women who happen to have driven 5 miles to some hills for a walk with a takeaway coffee just looks like the police are taking the piss and picking on a potentially easy target to reach whatever fining target they have for that day.

And I suppose you could argue "it's against the spirit of the rules" or some shite, but I cannot see where they broke the law.

It also seems odd to fine them a total of £400 when they weren't actually breaking any rules. That is the equivalent of 4 speeding tickets.

It’s dreadful.
The police should be chasing criminals not arresting innocent women.

@donewithitalltodayandxmas

Just read someone elses update which says sat in car ?? If thats the case that's why then

Nowhere in the article linked does it say that that was just something a poster added but it doesn't say that.

It's counterproductive because it adds fuel to the fire for all the lockdown sceptic MPs who will be pressuring Johnson to lift restrictions as soon as possible.

@donewithitalltodayandxmas

Maybe they should put a restriction on how far then everyone knows , 5 miles especially in some places isn't a lot , but some are going -15/20 and some more

That is all well and good except for when you are in a support bubble with someone who is not local...

Oh ffs. I've been extremely careful but I've also had enough Starbucks and enough long walks to single handedly keep the makers of hiking boots and peppermint syrup in business.

Okay driving long distances to go for a jolly in a crowded beauty spot is taking the piss, but plenty of people have legitimate reason or would be safer travelling some distance. I live in a tower block in a very urban part of London, there's a bus stop a bank and a supermarket directly outside my block, all three of which have long queues during the daytime. I can't physically step outside my building without immediately being in a huge crowd of people. But my building has a basement car park and there's a huge and basically empty ancient woodland plus a large marshland nature reserve just 3-4 miles away. Travelling there is clearly much safer than jogging around crowded pavements.

I meet a local friend for a walk once or twice a week. We meet halfway between where we live (so no driving) or we occasionally cycle. One of us (usually me) brings along 2 flasks of hot drinks and at some point in our walk, we usually sit on a (typically wet) bench while we have our drinks. We may push the boat out and eat a snack too (I usually bring a surprise cake each). And then we carry on with our walk. Our average walking distance per trip is 17km. I class that as exercise. Yes we talk, yes we drink hot drinks and yes we eat (I'm wondering if the Snickers bars we shared on Mon evening has turned our exercise into a picnic ha!)

Next week is my friend's birthday. A big birthday. We both live alone and I'm damned if I'm not going to try and make our 'birthday walk' as special as possible for him. There will be flasks of hot drinks, there will be cake (and I have a sparkler to put in it) and there will be savoury snacks. We plan to walk for 3 - 4 hours as usual. My friend can't see his family (he was even alone on Christmas Day) and I haven't seen any of my family for over a year now. We both have high pressure jobs and supporting each other (as 2 singles who both live alone) is how we've got through the past 10 months. We're not breaking any laws. We're not putting anyone at risk. We will exercise AND try to enjoy his birthday as it's one of the few things we have left before we all go bloody insane.

If we get quizzed by the police, it will not go well for them. My birthday friend is a criminal barrister for the CPS. Let's see them try and fine him.