I fucking knew it. Second vaccine dose.

[NiceGerbil]

News is that people who have had first dose are only getting second 3 months later. Against the guidelines of the org who made the vaccine.

I said this rush to push it out would result in, how are they going to follow up and make sure they get the second?

And here we go. Second dose not organised. UK govt say this is AOK.

FFS. I'd rather they took the time to do it properly. But hey. Pissup in a brewery situation again.

I said a few days ago to DH. Are they properly tracking this to make sure the follow up jab isn't missed?

I was too optimistic. Govt have decided second jab isn't that important.

FFS.

You’re amazing OP. Truly.
Wish you were running the country
We’d never be in this mess.

@Kazzyhoward

Are you entitled to nhs flu vaccine?
I’m not hence getting at my chemist

@WiseUpJanetWeiss

We have had months to organise & train teams around the country to administer vaccine but did little with this time.

Why weren't we training up people in october/nov/dec/?

This is a very fine question.

Probably because it doesn't take 2-3 months to train someone to admister injections, so why would they?

@frumpety

With both vaccines when talking about 'protection' are you talking about the level of illness you will have as a result of catching the virus if vaccinated, so a 50% or 70% reduction in the harm the virus causes you personally. Or is it a case that if you have the vaccine you have a 70% less chance of catching it ? I thought it was the former but could be completely wrong ?

From what I’ve heard (about the Oxford trial anyway) it sounds like they look at how many weren’t hospitalised due to covid during the trial. So to me it sounds like you can still get it, but not seriously?

This isn't this first vaccine doses have been different to the manufacture's guidelines.

The nasal flu vaccine for children - the recommendation from the manufacturer is two doses (I think 4 weeks apart when you very first receive it, then one dose annually thereafter. This has been the case since it was introduced, but when I enquired about it when it was first introduced the doctor confirmed yes two doses, and had to call me back to say the government said only one dose to be given.

My youngest had it for the first time this year - only one dose.

@MoreLikeThis

So much incorrect information on here. It's painful to read. 😭😭😭

It's a good idea although dissapointinb for those expecting their second vaccination and a logistical nightmare for those having to re-organise the appointments.

My parents have had one dose and that will give them 91% effectiveness. That's ok. Two doses would have given them 95% effectiveness.

There are advantages for my parents in giving up their second dose and having more of 'their' community immunised. Their hospitals won't be as overrun and their friends who haven't even received a first dose won't be at risk of dying or becoming very ill.

I think it's the right thing to do.

I think it was a mistake to have not given this more thought when the vaccination program was started.

Is 1 vaccine 91% effective? I don’t think I’ve seen that number banded about yet. Seen a few 50% and quite a lot of 70%.

Hopefully the Uk experimenting with dosing regiments works in their favour and other countries will know what to do and what not to do.

Well now there is a vaccine available they have to keep throwing down more roadblocks and fucking things up. Otherwise everything would go back to normal.

@CovidHalloween

While they are at it, why don’t they split each vaccine shot into two or more and then give it to more people this way? This way they can double or triple or even quadruple the people “vaccinated” too! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

They have already established that they can get six shots of vaccine out of each vial rather than the five stated.

Increasing the time between first and second jabs enables the programme to get more people protected more quickly. They each won't be protected quite so well but then it was never a 100% effective vaccine so there were never any certainties.

Getting more people protected reduces the number of people suffering serious complications and enables the health services to give effective care to those who need it.

Good point earlier about who can be doing new first shots vaccines 12 weeks worth of second shots falll due.

Assuming 1million a week If you are in the top 4 maybe 5 categories, you will probably be done, both shots, by May. But assuming finite number of vaccinators, all rolled asap, then what starts is the next 24 week cycle (the next 12 or more million people)

It's not going to change how long most people wait for the licensed level of protection, and for many it will be longer. It's only going to make a small difference (never more than 11 weeks) to when you get your first (a date you never knew in the first place)

But it is going to look nice and active.

@Bathroom12345 Some people are incredibly selfish. Me me me all the time and stuff everyone else. You do know it will give more protection to many others as opposed to just you and your relative. So true. Residents in the care home where I work were so excited that they were going to get the vaccine but they are still waiting for a date, staff haven't got a date either. Doesn't affect me as I am admin and working from home so I'm not talking about me but so sorry for them.

We have had our first outbreak in December, managed to keep it out all year but a routine hospital appointment introduced it and it has spread to staff and residents.

I just hope they can get the first jab soon.

My parents have had one dose and that will give them 91% effectiveness. That's ok. Two doses would have given them 95% effectiveness.

Where are you getting this number from?

Is 1 vaccine 91% effective? I don’t think I’ve seen that number banded about yet. Seen a few 50% and quite a lot of 70%. I did hear an "expert" on tv saying this a few weeks ago, it was the first I heard about why not do one dose. I can't remember who he was but he was definitely rolled out as some sort of expert.

"we can't procure enough vaccines like we promised, give us the best advice you can based on our incompetence'?"

I think the UK has done relatively quite well re procurement so far, hasn't it? UK does seem to have started earlier and vaccinated more per capita than most other countries so far. Ah, just realised you may mean comms raised expectations beyond what is now being delivered - yes, that is a separate question!

Some people are incredibly selfish. Me me me all the time and stuff everyone else. You do know it will give more protection to many others as opposed to just you and your relative.

Most are not coming from this perspective. If one dose was proved effective enough then I would be happy with that for myself and my relatives. But we don't know it is, such data doesn't exist and the government are rolling the dice with potentially deadly consequences.

@tenredthings

My elderly frail dad has had his first dose and now been told his second dose, due next week, is to be delayed.

He lives alone and has been self isolating since March . He now won't know if he will have any benefit at all from his semi administered vaccine. Does he risk it, start to live his life again, only to find he catches Covid because he's not properly immune ? How will he know ? Or can he go about his life potentially spreading Covid under a false assumption he is ' vaccinated' ?

He's taken on the risk of being the first to have the vaccine but without any credible benefit.

I'm furious. This government is a joke. It's all about how many people they can say are 'vaccinated'. Bloody pointless waste of time and money if it's not effectively administered.

@tenredthings

No your dad hasn't 'taken on the risk' - that was done by the thousands of trial volunteers. Your dad has had the PRIVILEGE of being one of the first people in the world to get at least one shot of vaccine.

@MoreLikeThis

Where did you get those stats
They are wrong. Well at least according to a BMJ article

As per

Oh god. Another thing for everyone to become "experts" on

I wonder when it is 52% or 91% effective? Both could be true at different times e.g. 52% a week after the jab and 91% effective a month later or something like that.

@Kazzyhoward

Sorry you're having the same issues.

My dad is on end of life care so I suspect they just don't think it's worth bothering, and my mum is a raging hypochondriac and totally neurotic so they probably just don't want to deal with her tbh.

So.... if we only have a quite small amount of doses of the Pfizer vaccine, and it's going to be given as a single dose to begin with, then isn't the danger that it will run out and people who've had one dose will then be unable to get a second dose of it as it'll be out of stock? The MHRA still recommends you get 2 doses of the same vaccine, not different vaccines. So might that not result in some problems further down the line with people having to get the Oxford and then a second dose of that, because our Pfizer vaccine supply has run out?

@NiceGerbil

News is that people who have had first dose are only getting second 3 months later. Against the guidelines of the org who made the vaccine.

I said this rush to push it out would result in, how are they going to follow up and make sure they get the second?

And here we go. Second dose not organised. UK govt say this is AOK.

FFS. I'd rather they took the time to do it properly. But hey. Pissup in a brewery situation again.

I said a few days ago to DH. Are they properly tracking this to make sure the follow up jab isn't missed?

I was too optimistic. Govt have decided second jab isn't that important.

FFS.

Another Labour voter. Made up hysteria. The science behind 12 weeks is sound unlike your knee jerk reaction.

Sorry that post was a bit garbled. I mean further down the line some people who've already had one dose of Pfizer will then be unable to get a second dose of it (as stocks will have run out) and they'd need to start over with the Oxford vaccine?

"@tenredthings*

No your dad hasn't 'taken on the risk' - that was done by the thousands of trial volunteers. Your dad has had the PRIVILEGE of being one of the first people in the world to get at least one shot of vaccine."*

I think ten red things' point is that her dad gave informed consent thinking that he would get the second dose after 21 days, and that has now been changed. (I haven't seen an original consent form/info leaflet, would be interesting to know what they say.)

I had my first dose yesterday. The trust email came out at 2pm saying that it would now be 3 months. But when I went for my appointment they were still making the follow ups for 3 weeks. But telling us they would be cancelled.