Friend said DH is abusing furlough

[amy198820]

DH been on furlough from 2 jobs since March (one full time job and one part time job he does one evening a week). He has been back to work on and off since the summer and is now on the flexi furlough scheme and both jobs have topped his pay to 100%. Since the tier 4 announcement he has been put back on furlough completely.

As tier 4 is looking like it will continue through Jan/Feb, and so unlikely he will be going back anytime soon DH had applied for another job to keep him busy rather than sit at home. DH found out before Christmas he has got the job and he has made this new employer aware that this job will just be a fill in whilst he is on furlough and the employer has accepted this and are happy to take him on. (its a friend of a friend type thing)

Spoke with my friend and earlier and told her about DH's new temporary position explaining that its better than him sitting at home all day /gives him something to do until all this passes etc. My friend took umbrage with this and said that we are abusing the system and that this isnt what the scheme was designed for. I didn't really know what to say and so said sorry she was offended and would speak to her later on.

For background before anyone says anything, I was not being insensitive, my friend has not suffered financially due to COVID as she has been working from home continuously throughout.

I want to call my friend back soon as to not let the bad feeling grow. How would you suggest I approach this? I do not think we are doing anything wrong, just trying to get through this pandemic and doing the best for our family as would anyone else.

@nicknamehelp

I don't think this is actually allowed under scheme rules.

It is perfectly allowed within the rules. All legal and above board

We have tried locally in our area to volunteer, no one has responded to us though.

Perhaps it depends on the area, but i've seen so many different roles / appeals for volunteers since the start of the pandemic. I'm surprised he's been able to find a job, but not heard anything about volunteering.

My friend on 100% furlough has saved thousands on train travel, has taken on a part time job and has done up her kitchen, bathroom and converted the garage.
She’s taken up painting and cake decorating as she has so much extra time.

I’ve been working throughout, putting my health at risk, dealing with getting dc to/from schools which have staggered start and end times and no public transport due to the buses not letting school kids on (tripling my petrol costs) and having to take unpaid leave when their school bubbles close. My mini extra job has ceased to exist so I’m losing more money. Keyworker so my pay will be frozen to pay for the furlough scheme also.

Yes I’m bitter, yes I’m jealous.
I think the furloughed shouldn’t be able to gain extra paid employment, especially as so many people haven’t even got income form one job anymore.

So he's getting paid double?

This is allowed under the furlough scheme though - you can get another job

I’d just stop sharing so much with this friend or anyone tbh and do what you want?

Normal Employer I mean't. I would feel bad for taking the extra 20% from them.

It's perfectly allowed and acceptable. Good on him I say!

Loving some of the replies, typical benefit bashing "They get more than us, they have a big telly and go on holiday twice a year! Our TV is eleventyseven years old and we can't even afford the fuel to drive round the corner" types, now turning on a hardworking employed guy. Bravooooo!!!

With the uncertainty of the jobs market I think it’s a very sensible thing to do provided you’ve informed the relevant channels and paying the appropriate tax. I’m not sure I agree with the “you’ve taken away a job from someone who needs it” folks, you could say about many people probably (parent who has returned to work after children despite having a partner who is wealthy, people who continue to work after a large windfall, inheritance etc, teenagers who can be fully supported by parents...) at the end of the day if you have a drive to work and you’re competent and trained for the role why shouldn’t you?

I’m one of those struggling having been made redundant and the only people I would begrudge having a job would be these who didn’t get it fairly.

My head says that it’s allowed, and therefore not surprising that people would take advantage of that.

My heart says that I couldn’t take a third job right now when I was earning fine... Then who would pay our mortgage then? for that very reason, you’re taking jobs everywhere and stockpiling money to be able to pay in the future, plenty of people can’t pay it now. But that’s likely my weakness, and therefore my failing. As it’s legal, its all about how it sits in your conscience. If it’s fine with you, it’s alright. It’s not fine with your friend, but there’s not a lot you can do about that.

Well its allowed so I don't think your dh has done anything wrong. Shore up your finances whilst you can. If I had been furloughed I'd have got a job as a delivery driver I think.

"Well obviously not - he is doing it to earn money funnily enough"

Thwn why claim at the start of the thread that he was doing it out of boredom? He's seen a way to grab extra money and taken it. It is unethical, just own it and don't expect all of your friends to agree with what you are doing.

@FancySomeChips

My friend on 100% furlough has saved thousands on train travel, has taken on a part time job and has done up her kitchen, bathroom and converted the garage. She’s taken up painting and cake decorating as she has so much extra time.

I’ve been working throughout, putting my health at risk, dealing with getting dc to/from schools which have staggered start and end times and no public transport due to the buses not letting school kids on (tripling my petrol costs) and having to take unpaid leave when their school bubbles close. My mini extra job has ceased to exist so I’m losing more money. Keyworker so my pay will be frozen to pay for the furlough scheme also.

Yes I’m bitter, yes I’m jealous.
I think the furloughed shouldn’t be able to gain extra paid employment, especially as so many people haven’t even got income form one job anymore.

Exactly this.

I think you just have to accept that some people, including those you know in RL, will find this morally dodgy and judge you for it. Some will tell you, some won't.

Nothing you can do about that, so just crack on.

I can't see what anyone thinks OP's husband has done wrong. When the scheme was first announced back in March it was made clear that people are perfectly free to get other jobs so long as they are available to return to their original jobs when needed. The suggestion that a potential employer should leave a post unfilled, or filled by an unsuitable person, just because the best candidate is on furlough is absurd.

@Spiratedaway it's is but doesn't help when you read about grabby types like this 🤦‍♀️

I was furloughed pending redundancy earlier this year. I got another job and immediately contacted my employer to bring my redundancy date forward. Although it would have been legal to take on the new role when furloughed it didn’t sit right plus having a new job I just wanted to cut ties with the old one.

What an outraged tone among the responses on this thread that talk about taking a job away from someone else who might need it! They remind me very much of the condemnation of women who dared to go out to work in the 50s and 60s for 'pin money' - it was often said that they were taking away a job from a man who might need it to feed his family. In a capitalist society, such as we have in the UK, the labour market is about supply and demand. OPs DH is able to supply his labour to a friend who needs it temporarily. Who knows whether or not there is another person who could do the job equally well and is in straitened circumstances ? The same question could apply to every job advertised. As many posters have pointed out, what OPs DH is doing is perfectly legal and the taxpayer will not suffer at all. But yes, I agree, best keep quiet about it, because there are some very judgemental people out there!

@unchienandalusia

Whether it is legally right or not it is abhorrent immoral to take tax payers money during a crisis which was designed To help people abs businesses stay afloat whilst being paid for doing other work. He should be going on unpaid leave from his current employer until they have a position that they can pay him for.

You are scroungers and cheaters. Whatever the law says. I hope hmrc get I involved (unless of course it's the double whammy of cash in hand). People like you and your DH make me sick. Whilst so many are suffering and the economy is tanking you only think of yourselves.

Despicable

you sound unhinged. Everything we are doing is perfectly legal and in the interest of our family.

I think people see things around furlough as someone is getting something I'm not. In my experience, furlough was an awful experience, worrying about my role I subsequently was made redundant from.
IMO, taking on this 3rd job is sensible to save money, open up more experience should he be unable to return to either job.
The point of furlough is not just about paying people's wages but also about keeping trained, experienced staff in situ so hopefully ready when they can gi back to work. Training & recruitment is a huge cost to businesses so having a paused workforce helps businesses to start generating income. This is beneficial to the wider economy.
Saying 'I am paying your furlough' is just unkind & shows a very narrow understanding.

@PlanDeRaccordement

I’d understand taking furlough pay and then one other job. But OPs DH is taking 100% furlough pay from TWO jobs and now on his THIRD job for yet more pay. What will he do if furloughed from job #3 at 100%? Get a fourth job? Because “he can’t sit at home”

At what point is it enough money to actually give back to the community and volunteer instead of going out and taking, taking, taking?

He wouldn't qualify for furlough for the new job. Read the rules.

We have both been tax payers for 15+ years, so have put in a lot more than taken out

This comment above makes you sound like the unhinged one, OP.

Good for your DH.

Contrary to a PP/employer who claims she'd consider him top of the list to get rid of I'd be impressed with his work ethic and he'd be one of the last I'd consider.

Don't discuss it any further with your friend. Nothing is guaranteed and he might end up with no jobs in 3 months time, I'd do exactly the same as him if I had to.

You came on here to ask what you should say to your friend about her having a go a you about this. I think you have to accept that a lot of people find what your husband is doing morally wrong. Yes it might be legal and you can tell your friend that. It hasn’t changed opinions on this forum, I doubt it would your friend. Especially as she has spoken to you about it and not just silently judged.