Friend said DH is abusing furlough

[amy198820]

DH been on furlough from 2 jobs since March (one full time job and one part time job he does one evening a week). He has been back to work on and off since the summer and is now on the flexi furlough scheme and both jobs have topped his pay to 100%. Since the tier 4 announcement he has been put back on furlough completely.

As tier 4 is looking like it will continue through Jan/Feb, and so unlikely he will be going back anytime soon DH had applied for another job to keep him busy rather than sit at home. DH found out before Christmas he has got the job and he has made this new employer aware that this job will just be a fill in whilst he is on furlough and the employer has accepted this and are happy to take him on. (its a friend of a friend type thing)

Spoke with my friend and earlier and told her about DH's new temporary position explaining that its better than him sitting at home all day /gives him something to do until all this passes etc. My friend took umbrage with this and said that we are abusing the system and that this isnt what the scheme was designed for. I didn't really know what to say and so said sorry she was offended and would speak to her later on.

For background before anyone says anything, I was not being insensitive, my friend has not suffered financially due to COVID as she has been working from home continuously throughout.

I want to call my friend back soon as to not let the bad feeling grow. How would you suggest I approach this? I do not think we are doing anything wrong, just trying to get through this pandemic and doing the best for our family as would anyone else.

I just can't believe this. I haven't been furloughed so am not familiar with how the system works. Is it the case that you can be furloughed, be paid by the taxpayer, then take another job and keep on receiving your furlough money? As well as your new salary? That's insane! Quite apart from the terrible rip off from the tax payer, the other job could have gone to someone who really needed it, who wasn't receiving furlough pay!

Even if this is completely legal, I wouldn't want to associate with someone who does it. Its awful. Really milking the system and the taxpayer. It shouldn't be legal. What was Rishi Sunak thinking of?

@CrazyCatLover

I’m with the majority on this one. I’ve been on a salary inconsistent with inflation for years, haven’t had a day off sick this year, worked throughout and will most likely be taxed more to pay for it in the future whilst your husband is yet another person abusing the system 🙄

He isn't abusing any system, he is acting perfectly lawfully and presumably paying plenty of tax.

@TheGreatSloth

I just can't believe this. I haven't been furloughed so am not familiar with how the system works. Is it the case that you can be furloughed, be paid by the taxpayer, then take another job and keep on receiving your furlough money? As well as your new salary? That's insane! Quite apart from the terrible rip off from the tax payer, the other job could have gone to someone who really needed it, who wasn't receiving furlough pay!

Even if this is completely legal, I wouldn't want to associate with someone who does it. Its awful. Really milking the system and the taxpayer. It shouldn't be legal. What was Rishi Sunak thinking of?

Yes. Because having a new job is nothing to do with it. They are being paid in the understanding they will return to work when they can, which DH has said he will. He's not doing anything wrong.

And again, the job COULD have gone to someone who needed it, but jobs are awarded on merit, not who needs the job the most.

@reginaphalangeeee

Maybe he should try "sitting at home" and not increase the chances of spreading the virus? Wasn't that the point of furlough? He doesn't need to work as he's getting paid still. This is ridiculous. Sick hearing about people who "don't want to sit at home".

No, the point of furlough is to enable people to keep their jobs when their employers would otherwise make them redundant.

He is legally allowed to do it, it's not abusing the system.
In a passing conversation at a factory the other day, they were delighted to discover this as their workload has gone through the roof and they are struggling to find temporary emoyees to cover it.
Stuck up noticed asking if any employees had fuoughed relatives that wanted a few months extra work.

@Idontgiveagriffindamn

I believe it is not against the rules so your husband is doing nothing wrong but to me it does leave a nasty taste in my mouth. I’d perhaps not have said anything but would view you and your husband in a negative light.

I agree with this. He isn't doing anything wrong legally, but morally, i think it's a very different story.

He is receiving 100% of his pay, the majority of which is being paid by the government, whilst earning a wage elsewhere. Does leave a bad taste I'm afraid

Whether it is legally right or not it is abhorrent immoral to take tax payers money during a crisis

OP's husband isn't taking taxpayers' money. He is being paid by the employer who has chosen to lay him off. It is the employer who then applies for taxpayers' money.

So you've been furloughed from 2 jobs. Sitting at home for months on end, all jobs round house done, tv is bloody boring.
You are bored and losing the will to get out of bed. A Friend offers some light relief in way of a temporary job. Great, something to do, do you decline (oh shit better give it to someone else more needy) or do you accept. Should you then do it for free or take payment for the work you do?
Would you do it for free?
No I didn't think so!

If it gives a little extra cash and makes you sane again why not and of course it is Covid secure.

You are lying if you say you wouldn't take it along with the pay.

The furloughed scheme was introduced to ensure people KEEP their jobs during the pandemic. If the company doesn't need him now and is happy for him to work elsewhere on a temporary basis then that's fine. He's not stealing a job, that's down to the man he working for.
Most people need to be working for sanity, not sat around all day left to rot. Furlough is not a choice, if you want to work you should.
He's also not fleecing anyone if he's paying taxes.

Some people on here are self righteous hypocrites.

You have no idea whether someone else in need of a job could have taken the new temporary job. It may well be that the job needs the level of skills and experience which OP's husband has but which are not necessarily universal.

Unless OPs DH is a Nobel prize winner, there is no way that his jobs could not be done by another person. And with over a million more unemployed, I doubt further that not a single one in a million didn’t need that job.

I hope that he is declaring this new job as a secondary income and paying 50% tax.

@MaryLeeOnHigh

Whether it is legally right or not it is abhorrent immoral to take tax payers money during a crisis

OP's husband isn't taking taxpayers' money. He is being paid by the employer who has chosen to lay him off. It is the employer who then applies for taxpayers' money.

Yes he is taking tax payers money. The tax payers are the source of the money regardless of how many middle men it passes through to get to him. And being put on furlough with 100% pay from TWO jobs is not being laid off.

@nicknamehelp

I don't think this is actually allowed under scheme rules.

Yes it is.

All over the country, employers are saying to themselves something along the lines of "Well, I've managed without John/Jane since March when they've been on furlough, I've had to revamp the business anyway to accommodate different ways of working so they'll have to be retrained if they come back, plus I've lost a lot of money and probably need to cut down on staff anyway." And, when furlough comes to an end, John/Jane will find themselves on the receiving end of redundancy notices. If, in those circumstances, they find themselves with the offer of temporary employment whilst on furlough they would be insane to turn it down.

Ignore your friend, she sounds very jealous!

There are many jobs available in care for example, and people simply don’t want to do them, believing them to be demeaning and dirty.

At least your DH has shown some initiative and work ethic.

Many people claim benefits that they don’t NEED, they just want and claim out of GREED, surely that’s a lot worse??

Granted, they have cracked down on the ridiculous amounts some people were claiming, but it’s still perfectly possible to claim a lot as a single parent of two children, private renting in London. Enough certainly for a lot of luxuries.

Oh, and irrelevant if the EX partner is a high earner and pays a lot of money in maintenance.

And again, the job COULD have gone to someone who needed it, but jobs are awarded on merit, not who needs the job the most.

Except that OPs DH didn’t get his third job on merit, he got it because he’s mates with the hiring manager. There’s a word for that. Corrupt cronyism.

Unless OPs DH is a Nobel prize winner, there is no way that his jobs could not be done by another person

But you still don't know whether anyone else with qualifications and experience at least as good even applied.

@Keratinsmooth

I hope that he is declaring this new job as a secondary income and paying 50% tax.

Errrr what 50% tax rate? There isn’t one. I would assume that the man is on an emergency tax rate and paying tax on all earnings, then it will all be squared up at the end of the year, either through a tax return or when HMRC receives all the end of tax year data,

@PlanDeRaccordement

And again, the job COULD have gone to someone who needed it, but jobs are awarded on merit, not who needs the job the most.

Except that OPs DH didn’t get his third job on merit, he got it because he’s mates with the hiring manager. There’s a word for that. Corrupt cronyism.

Ah missed that

50% tax?! I very much doubt he’s Alan Sugar .

@Wheresmykimchi
Yep, it’s in the OP: “it’s a friend of a friend type thing”

He is doing something wrong though....

A. Taking a job that someone out of work and not being paid at all could have to possibly keep a roof over their head.

B. The whole point of furlough is to pay wages to keep so people can financially survive whilst unable to work due to the pandemic. Not to pay wages so people can work elsewhere.

Its not OK. Your friend is right. You would fanically benefit from furlough not what its for. Surely u know that??? Tbh I am surprised you didn't expect your friends reaction.

Your husband is allowed to work at the same time as receiving his furlough payments. He isn't doing anything wrong and it's nobody else's business.

@TerryHearn

This thread is an interesting insight into the psyche of the average person. No wonder we have a problem with tax avoidance, loopholes and generally playing the system. No common decency in the main. Anyone who calls it out is shot down. Welcome to modern Britain. Lol.

Do you think that about anybody who claims things they don’t ‘need’?

Rich pensioners? Disabled people who also work/ have money? Single parents who get huge amounts from their ex?

@MaryLeeOnHigh

Unless OPs DH is a Nobel prize winner, there is no way that his jobs could not be done by another person

But you still don't know whether anyone else with qualifications and experience at least as good even applied.

Unlikely it was even advertised for others to even have opportunity to apply because as OP said, the job was a “friend of a friend type thing” so he got the job because he’s mates with the hiring manager.

Unlikely it was even advertised for others to even have opportunity to apply because as OP said, the job was a “friend of a friend type thing” so he got the job because he’s mates with the hiring manager.

Terribly speculative. It could be he got the job because they couldn't find anyone else.