Schools could be closed until Feb half term!

[DfEisashambles]

Reported in the DM. I’m surprised at this and don’t think it’ll go ahead.

TAs as well as teachers vaccinated please!

And what angrys me is the fact the government are so disorganised. They should have a time and date for press conference.I think when we get the green light for new vacations they will say about schools being closed.

All school staff need to be vaccinated

@laudemio

All schools and nurseries should be closed in tier 4 until further notice. London healthcare is starting to resemble Lombardy in March. It is very very serious. We have vaccines, it won't be forever but I suspect reports of 6 weeks are accurate.

Unfortunately, I tend to agree.

I also can completely see why areas in lower tiers esp the north east and north west who have been under more restrictions than the south east for longer don't want schools to close.

However, if they don't the strain that is causing such high rates amongst children is going to take hold in these areas in the next few weeks. It's already there, but in much lower numbers than in London and the SE. About the same as early December in the SE. Opening these schools now will cause carnage in a few short weeks.

A rock and a hard place. Utterly shit.

• Kaliorphic

Social workers aren't being vaccinated to protect the individual social worker, but rather the client groups that they work with.*

Well, as there’s no evidence that the vaccine prevents transmission (only that it stops the vaccinated from getting as sick from Covid), that is a load of bollocks.

@Spongebobsquarefringe

Shouldn’t all school staff be vaccinated?

In the I work in school support staff, lunch staff, TAs etc, welfare are utilised to make up short falls all over

They should be but the priority list is this:

1. Older adults in care homes and their carers
2. Adults 80+ and frontline health and social care workers
3. Adults 75+
4. Adults 70+ who are CEV
5. Adults 65+
6. Aged 16-65 with underlying conditions putting them at risk
7. 60+
8. 55+
9. 50+

So no mention of school staff at all in phase 1 of vaccination.

Phase 2 might include teachers:

first responders
the military
those involved in the justice system
teachers
transport workers
public servants essential to the pandemic response.

but no mention of other school staff.

If schools do have to close, then come on folks, you need to lobby your MP about support for your family by your workplace.

Schools are adapting at short notice ( DfE I'm looking at you with your testing guidance sent at 18:28 on the last Thursday of term), to provide learning to children, to provide food and vouchers, to put systems in place to support contact with vulnerable families, to try and be flexible to offer (if at all possible and by no means in all cases) some flexibility for vulnerable staff or those with children. Head teachers are covering three hour lunch duties everyday, school staff are taking no breaks whatsoever, LA staff are working all hours including, with school staff volunteering to support vulnerable families.

Schools cannot do all of this alone and without any funding. Surely businesses can be more creative and flexible to support those of that work at home, split shifts, flexible working, weekends, financial support. Schools are taking the brunt of the expectation to be flexible, to learn new remote teaching skills, to redesign the curriculum, to put in testing and vouchers and... What are your workplaces doing to support?

Didn't the furlough scheme initially have a clause for furlough if you needed to be at home for child care. Does it still?
MP's need to be made aware of your issues and need to work with business to insist on them meeting family needs. Schools are doing their best, they can't do this alone.

@poppingpotatoes there is quite a lot of talk of the vaccine priority list being amended to include teachers (and presumably TAs).

As I said below the trade off by not doing the most vulnerable first is that death and hospital rates will be slower to fall. We have to accept that every action has consequences.

@DfEisashambles

Teachers should be vaccinated before children go back.

Unfortunately for primary and EY teachers and careers some parents and gov’t do view as childcare.

It is childcare. It’s only our very warped view that means this is somehow an insult. As a primary teacher part of my job absolutely is the privilege of caring for other people’s children. It’s not beneath me to help them with their coat, or comfort them when they fall over. It makes sense that teachers feel the need to distance themselves from nursery practitioners because they are so disrespected in society - poorly paid, often very young and often not well qualified. But anyone who has been fortunate to have their child cared for by someone with compassion as well as intelligence will know it makes a huge difference who is looking after your child. We facilitate learning, playing, teach, and yes care.

Anyway... back to the point at hand...

100% what @ByersRd said.

Businesses need to step up to the plate to allow for rotas to happen in schools for the good of the economy as a whole. If retail and hospitality is to have any chance of surviving this then other sectors are going to have to lend a hand by being more flexible with their workers.

@DBML yes exactly many have lost jobs myself included I have children but schools being closed wouldn't affect me as mine are older but I lost my job as it was in an industry that was shut down for months and never recovered and its been a struggle to get a new job as not many hiring and many applying
The thing is if schools go back and it spreads , kids will be off having to self isolate anyway , and this could happen multiple times
So surely a short extra few weeks off must be better than months of on /off , but we really need to roll out vaccines whilst shut so it can be as short as possible
Obviously they will have to open for keyworkers and vunerable
But again I agree with others we need to be doing more to get children out of abusive homes etc , we have school holidays and weekends and children shouldn't be suffering at any time
Free school meal vouchers could still be given for those in need as before
I don't think introducing masks alone when cases are this high will make a huge difference and in other european countries where masks are worn cases are also high

My bet is that after the meeting today - nothing will change and then after another week they will realise the cases are out of
Control and at the last minute they will change their mind .

Well, as there’s no evidence that the vaccine prevents transmission (only that it stops the vaccinated from getting as sick from Covid), that is a load of bollocks

Once you've built up antibodies you won't be transmitting anything. Yes there will be a lag time. But that's how vaccines work. So not bollocks at all. Seriously there would be no point in anyone having it if what you said was actually true.

There is evidence that the Oxford vax stops transmission. Limited evidence at the moment.

I think we should get down to at least priority 4 before adding occupational groups

Priority 5 is the one which straddles the state pension age.

Once you've built up antibodies you won't be transmitting anything. Yes there will be a lag time. But that's how vaccines work. So not bollocks at all. Seriously there would be no point in anyone having it if what you said was actually true

They don't yet know for sure that this is true of this vaccine.

So yes, until it is known, one way of the other, the point of the vaccine is to make it likely that the recipient has a mild or asymptomatic case. And that is very much worth it for the groups who are most vuonerabke and therefore most likely to need hospitalisation

Byers, totally agree and the pm needs to also ask for these business to be lenient and human...

@CallmeAngelGabriel

I've been spouting this analogy for ages now, but it still stands, in my opinion. If your house is flooding and you've put sandbags out the front, why on earth would you then leave the back door open "because fresh air is important?" Yes, fresh air is important, ordinarily, but in a flood, you get the water down first. Ventilation later.

I think it's more akin to being stuck in a house that's on fire. Some people want to keep the windows shut to stop the fire spreading, and some want to smash them because they're already choking on smoke and plastic fumes. We can't do both, and there's no time to do a detailed scientific analysis of which would ultimately cause less damage. So we're going to have to pick one, and either the people by the fire or the people on the smoke-filled upper floors will have to suffer the consequences.

@Sockbogies, I felt exactly the same. I distanced myself a bit from friends on furlough and with very part time jobs. It obviously wasn't their fault but their experience was so far from my own with my work, an 8 and 6 year to home school and a DH who works out of the home.

I had a WhatsApp group with two friends in the same situation as me and it was a lifeline to feel I wasn't alone in this. X

I'm predicting similar. 6 week lockdown and school closure, announced imminently.

I agree with @byersroad time to pull together, businesses, families and schools to get over this final hurdle. If we get infection rates right down and group 1 vaccinated asap we can get the economy going again fast. They are all interlinked.

I do not want to see people dying in hospital corridors or at home alone.
The death rate has gone down with appropriate medical care. It will climb very rapidly if hospitals are full. And not only from covid.

As

@laudemio agreed, life is the priority and being alive with your family safe right now is priority above all else.

[quote rookiemere]@poppingpotatoes there is quite a lot of talk of the vaccine priority list being amended to include teachers (and presumably TAs).

As I said below the trade off by not doing the most vulnerable first is that death and hospital rates will be slower to fall. We have to accept that every action has consequences.[/quote]
I'll believe it when I see it but I do hope that it's true.

Unfortunately for primary and EY teachers and careers some parents and gov’t do view as childcare.

But it is partly childcare. Society is set up in a way which often requires two incomes just to survive. Parents can plan around the fact that children go to school between certain ages and you generally know when school holidays are.

If you want parents to stop viewing early years and primary education as partly childcare then we need to make some fundamental changes to the structure of society - it needs to be possible for people to buy/rent on one income and we need to be mindful of how women will participate in the labour market.