Time to shield the shielded and let everyone else get on with it?

[GQKP]

I'll start by saying I am CEV. I also have Covid.

I do go out occasionally to medical appointments or for a drive. I sometimes see friends from at least 5m away in the front garden (as I'm unable to walk distance).

I've no idea how I've got this. I can not tell you how super careful I am with space, hand sanitiser / washing hands / PPE and basically not going out.

But I got Covid.

I'm not sure we can stop or contain Covid. I really have gotten to the the point where I believe that CEV are financially supported to stay isolated and everyone else gets on with it.

Sure! What shall I do with my working husband and my children? Are we going to pay his wage?!

By "muddle through", you mean just put up with further devastating blows to the economy, accept the increase in suicides and simply take the wave of extra, avoidable deaths from cancer etc on the chin?

We don't just have to 'muddle through' through.

Has there been an increase in suicides? Are extra deaths from cancer inevitable? I know that I've been for a smear test, and relatives have had operations, but I think that care would be less, not more likely if infection rates increased, both because of fear of transmission and lack of resources.

I took from op that they want to continue to shield with government funding but for everyone else to 'get on.with it' its that phrase that's slightly annoyed me- as if everyone else has just been lazing about!

We managed at the beginning for the Shielded not to go to work. They should be given the opportunity not to have to work again for the foreseeable - and be fully covered for that financially.
Does that mean if someone who is CEV is on a salary of £90k p.a.that the Govt should give them that money from our taxes? Don't be ridiculous.

I personally know 5 people who have had covid... all aged between 40-60yo, all previously outdoorsy. None of them are yet to their previous fitness / activity levels, 2 of them have now got long COVID symptoms. One of them wishes they had died.

So maybe only a few die old or sick people will die .... but a lot more will be ill for a very long time. It is not something I would wish on anyone.

For your plan to work then there would need to be at least 3 bands of people. You would also have to ignore the impact of the non vulnerable getting it. Lots of people with no reason to think they would be hit hard, are hit hard. Even if most of them get it and dont have symptoms, the impact of the sick would be huge. Taking just the nhs for example, Around winter there is huge pressure simply from staff being off with the flu, and if that was combined with increased admissions etc, add the removing of vulnerable staff etc the NHS would probably collapse

You would need bands of the below:

1. the clinically vulnerable. This virus makes a lot of people clinically vulnerable that arent just 80 year olds. That would be huge chunks of staff that are currently working that business rely on. The impact on these people would be massive if they were truly isolated. Would you expect people to live alone, not see others?

2. the go betweens.
   None of the vulnerable can be truly isolated. They would have the obvious people that interact with them eg. Carers, family etc. In the case of a vulnerable child would the whole family then need to isolate? When rates in the general population are high then these people would begin to withdraw. Think of those caring for elderly parents, but also people like delivery drivers passing out food. This group would need protecting (in order to protect the vulnerable) but would be massive and also agree to live with some restrictions.

3. the general population who could do what they want

If for example a vulnerable child (1), has a mum (2) who sits next to a high risk person (3) at work the system falls apart.

In my team for example we couldnt cope staff wise if we allowed the vulnerable to isolate, and also those caring for vulnerable parents, and children etc. We have to make our work place suitably secure for those people to come to work, but also for us to visit vulnerable people as a health service.

@Saltn

at being accused at being a narcissist just because I am questioning the covid restrictions. That is MN at it's best and most ridiculous.

Well there’s a point flying over your head.

You think most people in hospital are probably already classed as CEV therefore it’s should be business as usual. Based on actual reality your premise is false - feel free to disprove that.

what else do you call it to choose to believe your own conclusion over the reality? Do you prefer denial?

@frosted232 Some of us have been taking the risk since March and not had the luxury of staying home safe you think being CEV and staying at home is a luxury!! I hope you are a troll because if that’s your genuine opinion it’s vile.

Op I've been in several medical settings since lock down and non of them had a window open.

So maybe that's where you got it? In docs or even pharmacy with no fresh moving air?

Anyway at the moment I don't think we should do anything except try and surpress this we I simply do not know what this new virus can do esp to younger people.

Maybe by next autumn we will be in a stronger position for a more gung ho approach.

Lots of "shielded" are teachers, nurses, doctors, Uni lecturers, shop workers, restaurant/hotel/theatre workers, business owners, etc. Even more people live with those shielding (partners, children, parents etc) so have to shield themselves too. How can the rest of the country carry on as normal with so many people unable to work? How can we afford to pay all the shielding for their loss of incomes?

We managed at the beginning for the Shielded not to go to work. They should be given the opportunity not to have to work again for the foreseeable - and be fully covered for that financially.

At the beginning nearly everything was closed, including schools, building sites, factories, etc. Do you really want to go back there?

@merrymouse

By "muddle through", you mean just put up with further devastating blows to the economy, accept the increase in suicides and simply take the wave of extra, avoidable deaths from cancer etc on the chin?

We don't just have to 'muddle through' through.

Has there been an increase in suicides? Are extra deaths from cancer inevitable? I know that I've been for a smear test, and relatives have had operations, but I think that care would be less, not more likely if infection rates increased, both because of fear of transmission and lack of resources.

Yes, extra deaths from cancer ARE inevitable if scans etc take many times longer to happen, treatments are delayed, etc., which is the reality of the last 10 months. My OH had his cancer treatment stopped in March and only re-started in July, and has had to wait 3 months (and counting) for a scan to see the current state of his cancer (keeps getting cancelled at last minute due to staff shortages!). The entire oncology dept disappeared for two months (didn't reply to phone messages left, reception locked in darkness etc).

@AldiAisleofCrap I could be wrong but I read that as not all CEV can/could stay at home.

Lots of CEV people either can’t afford to not work and have jobs that simply can’t be done from home as well as children who are still of an age they require involved parenting. If you don’t have a support network (that has stamina given the length of time this has all gone on) you don’t get much choice in whether you can shield or not.

Aside from that allowing the virus to do its thing in the non-vulnerable population would still take years. That’s a long time for people to shield or have to live under the threat of it if they can’t (alongside a load of other issues economically and practically).

I'm shielding as much as I can but some parts of it are impossible
Had to go to hospital for urgent bloods, for treatment, doctors for routine bloods. Have to collect prescriptions as otherwise it's a 2 week wait for delivery which doesn't work if you have a UTI
Ran out of washing up liquid, online shop didn't sub and the helpful covid group over lockdown has now turned into a conspiracy group who think it's funny people are shielding. I ran into the local shop as it opened, grabbed a bottle and came back out
Apart from the above, I've only been to drive through places since March and yes, I'm fed up (WFH still)

I hope you recover well OP but this gas vern covered again and again. If it was do easy to shield the vulnerable and let everyone else cracking on than maybe they would have done it. After all ECV DH can and has pretty much shielded but our kids can't and neither can I. I am CV. We all have medical appointments, DH regularl blood tests, massive school bubbles for the kids.
No easy answer

@Cornettoninja I could be wrong but I read that as not all CEV can/could stay at home. oh , am really sensitive as shielding children that have barely left the house since March.
@frosted232 if that’s what you meant am really sorry. I though you were saying it was somehow a privilege to be CEV and to stay at home.

Really thrilled that I should just get on with it and, what, cross my fingers I'm not one of the 20% with long covid?

People need to start caring about everyone not just their own small group.

@AldiAisleofCrap - completely understandable I really feel for you and your family. It must be really frustrating to see people talking about it like it’s an easy option, or even an option at all.

Since roughly 30% ECV have children how can we protect them op?

My OH had his cancer treatment stopped in March and only re-started in July, and has had to wait 3 months (and counting) for a scan to see the current state of his cancer (keeps getting cancelled at last minute due to staff shortages!).

While sympathising with your situation, I wonder what you think the staff shortages are due to?