The north/south divide still alive and well

[Heatheronthehill]

So infections are dropping considerably where I live in the North West, we’ve had some sort of restrictions in place since July. Now that London and the South East have an increase in infections they are considering not allowing the mixing of households at Christmas time, my question is would they do the same if the situation was reversed?
I’m also angry that there’s an uproar over tier 3 and how dreadful it is, when we’ve been living with the same up here for months.

I suppose many will disagree, but I feel there’s a real bias towards the North unfortunately.

Yorkshire and Manchester are quite large.....

And wasn’t Leicester in full lockdown all summer. Not north, but still not all important London

Think Leicester has only had about 3 weeks bein able to do as others were. And I believe they aren't on the first 50 hospital to have the vaccination either

@UnseenDoreen

Was quite appalled to see an article in the Guardian featuring London restaurant owners and the impact Tier 3 will have on them. Not a mention of all those business owners up and down the country have had Tier 3 (or equivalent) for months and months. But the media is London centric, and so it will ever be thus.

Agreed. Media are as bad as the government

The tests in Liverpool were the trial. Can't see why saying that was in the north is relevant. The issue was that high rate tier 3 areas were promised mass testing after that bit it didn't materialise (although it had oddly appeared in our region waaay too late now as rates currently low)

I follow an account on Instagram about things to do in London. There was a post on there last week about what things were still open and available to do. The entire comment section below was full of "not for long" and "they'll get theirs soon" type comments. That's what makes me sad. You can say all you like that "no one is wishing ill on anyone", but it's simply not true. There were people all over the place publicly stating that they hope we get shut down. It's simply spiteful. What difference does it make to you that we're now locked down too? How was it different for you when we weren't? Everyone's always looking over the fence taking stock of what everyone else has got. It doesnt matter how bad things are, so long as no one's getting anything we aren't.

Fuck this government, fuck this disease and fuck this year. See how I managed to say that without cunting off anyone who's just trying to make their way through all this shit? I'm honestly on the edge at the moment, I can't take much more this year, but I swear, I've not lost empathy for everyone else in the same situation in the way I've seen over and over on here in the last few months. It's going to take us all a long time to heal after this is over.

I couldn't agree more. All the outrage this week that London is going into tier 3 when we've been living with it for months is making my blood boil.

MsPants
There were people all over the place publicly stating that they hope we get shut down. It's simply spiteful. What difference does it make to you that we're now locked down too? How was it different for you when we weren't? Everyone's always looking over the fence taking stock of what everyone else has got. It doesnt matter how bad things are, so long as no one's getting anything we aren't.

How was it different when we weren’t (closed down)?
It was unfair and unjust.
Those that were closed, getting more and more in debt, likely to fold had to watch in despair whilst others nearby are able to continue trading.
Here, restaurants at one end of the street are open and at the other end they are closed.
I can walk from one to the other. In the middle of the two is the border. Half in tier 2, half in tier 3.

At least now there is a level playing field.
I’ve said all along that the tier system is divisive.
People ARE happy that even if the situation is shit, at least everyone is being treated the same. London was put in tier 2 purely for economic reasons. It is a disgrace.

I am not a businessman so these things don’t affect me personally but I know that this situation has caused plenty of anger and frustration for those it has.

bigwoolyjumper in my part of Yorkshire other than a bit of July and August we have been in lockdown of one type or another since April.
So we have had much tighter restrictions than London for most of the year
I take no joy in the thought that London businesses will suffer like the ones found here have, I am just annoyed that the decision to put London into T3 came at a different point to the one to put us into T3. Our R rate now is below what London’s was when they were in T2 and yet there are no signs it will change here

@Whattimeisdinner

MsPants There were people all over the place publicly stating that they hope we get shut down. It's simply spiteful. What difference does it make to you that we're now locked down too? How was it different for you when we weren't? Everyone's always looking over the fence taking stock of what everyone else has got. It doesnt matter how bad things are, so long as no one's getting anything we aren't.

How was it different when we weren’t (closed down)?
It was unfair and unjust.
Those that were closed, getting more and more in debt, likely to fold had to watch in despair whilst others nearby are able to continue trading.
Here, restaurants at one end of the street are open and at the other end they are closed.
I can walk from one to the other. In the middle of the two is the border. Half in tier 2, half in tier 3.

At least now there is a level playing field.
I’ve said all along that the tier system is divisive.
People ARE happy that even if the situation is shit, at least everyone is being treated the same. London was put in tier 2 purely for economic reasons. It is a disgrace.

I am not a businessman so these things don’t affect me personally but I know that this situation has caused plenty of anger and frustration for those it has.

Yes, and putting London in tier 2 for economic reasons put the people of London at risk for the economic benefit oft he country.

I find it perplexing that people think that being treated as cannon fodder is a privelege that londoners have been given rather than a negative.

People don't need to be treated the same. That's not what fairness is. Most 6 year olds can understand that.

Yes, and putting London in tier 2 for economic reasons put the people of London at risk for the economic benefit oft he country.

I find it perplexing that people think that being treated as cannon fodder is a privelege that londoners have been given rather than a negative.

Oh wow... They are doing it for US?
That’s a great spin.
Do the places closed in other parts of the country get a share of their profits?
You know they didn’t have to open for little old me!

Colleague of DHs who lives in London said it just went nuts at the start of the month, people just letting off steam and going out loads. Which was entirely predictable and why London should never have been in Tier 2.

I agree EnPoinsettia

BUT...It was done selflessly.
For the benefit of the whole country.
Isn’t that true 2020out ?

I'm sure people in tier 2 areas can abide by tier 3 rules if they wish. I appreciate that may not prevent you getting covid from a work colleague who has been going to pubs, etc but I think it would help reduce your personal risk a lot. Nobody has to go to a restaurant, etc.

And I think London not being put in the appropriate level does affect non Londoners.

If my northern area has a lower covid rate than london and ok hospital capacity why should it be in tier 3 . Why can't we be in tier 3. Either we were in/are in tier 3 for no good reason or London should have been (I appreciate it is now).

But yes I'm glad that London is now in tier 3. If it hadn't been with such high rates when people I work with go and visit family in London, have family from London come here for xmas it could result in local rates increasing which I don't want.

@BigWoollyJumpers I’m in Kirklees, various restrictions came in here at the end of July, most notably that it became illegal to visit another persons home or garden or interact with anyone from another household when indoors. Nobody could visit from outside of Kirklees. In Bradford gyms and pools had to close.
These new restrictions were announced by Matt Hancock.on Twitter at gone 9pm when the restrictions were to come into place at midnight that night. it also happened to be Eid, there are various large Muslim communities in this area that this would have impacted on.

My town never came out of these restrictions we just changed to tiers when they came in although at some point when the tiers came into play we were told we could visit people’s private gardens again.

I’m also angry that there’s an uproar over tier 3 and how dreadful it is

I see to remember a massive uproar when the cities in the north-west were put into tier three.

Anyone who DOESNT see the north/south divide is obtuse In March they considered only putting London into lockdown but decided that it wasn't workable.

I grew up well away from the south-east and used to get annoyed about the London being the centre of the world thing but I think it is being massively overblown in this context.

Link www.itv.com/news/calendar/2020-07-30/coronavirus-tightening-of-lockdown-in-parts-of-west-yorkshire

Can you imagine if they had announced that London was going into tighter restrictions that night at gone 9pm, where it would become an offence to visit your parents in their garden! Imagine the media meltdowns and that’s without throwing in a major religious holiday.

@Whattimeisdinner

Yes, and putting London in tier 2 for economic reasons put the people of London at risk for the economic benefit oft he country.

I find it perplexing that people think that being treated as cannon fodder is a privelege that londoners have been given rather than a negative.

Oh wow... They are doing it for US?
That’s a great spin.
Do the places closed in other parts of the country get a share of their profits?
You know they didn’t have to open for little old me!

Not for you, no. Not for me either.

For the economy as a whole, I presume.

I don't claim to have made the decision or to understand it. But I live in London and currently have covid, probably because other people were off having their tier 2 jollies and spreading the virus.

Tier 2 meant fuck all for me. Didn't go shopping, to restaurants or whatever the fuck else you think I've been doing. Went to work. Caught covid. Might not have happened if I worked in a tier 3 area.

@Whattimeisdinner

How was it different when we weren’t (closed down)?
It was unfair and unjust.
Those that were closed, getting more and more in debt, likely to fold had to watch in despair whilst others nearby are able to continue trading.

But those people and businesses are not going to be less in debt or closed simply because others are having the same trouble. This week my son and I are self isolating because we have been in contact with someone with covid. Would you think me a decent human being if I started demanding you have to self isolate too, just so I'm not missing out on something you have?

My point is not that the North has been treated well, or that there isn't inequality, my point is simply that the vast majority of ordinary people in the South agree with you that things should be fairer and wish you well, while you just seem to be taking the attitude that you don't mind going down as long as you take us with you. Gloating while other people face hardship is really unpleasant, no matter what your own situation.

Tier 2 meant fuck all for me. Didn't go shopping, to restaurants or whatever the fuck else you think I've been doing. Went to work. Caught covid. Might not have happened if I worked in a tier 3 area.

You’ve been doing the same as me.
I’m in tier 3 but would have been doing the same in tier1/2/3. Work sleep, work sleep. Not seen a soul apart from the family I live with and the 1000s of children at school.

Many Tier 1/2 people have been behaving as if everything is normal. I’m glad London is in tier 3. They (not you) will now be forced to behave more responsibly.

MsPants
But those people and businesses are not going to be less in debt or closed simply because others are having the same trouble. This week my son and I are self isolating because we have been in contact with someone with covid. Would you think me a decent human being if I started demanding you have to self isolate too, just so I'm not missing out on something you have?

I do understand what you are saying but you can’t compare £1000s debt, a bankrupt business, redundant workforce, loss of homes, unemployment to 10 days isolation.

my point is simply that the vast majority of ordinary people in the South agree with you that things should be fairer and wish you well, while you just seem to be taking the attitude that you don't mind going down as long as you take us with you. Gloating while other people face hardship is really unpleasant, no matter what your own situation.

I don’t want anyone to be in this situation.
I am not gloating but am relieved that the same reasons that put many parts of the country into tier 3 at the start of Dec.now apply to London as well. It is rubbish for everyone but you can’t have one rule for one place and another rule for everywhere else.
I will be glad when everyone is back to normal.

I agree the north have been treated appallingly by this Tory scum government, but perhaps the country should aim it’s vitriol at the government large parts of it elected rather than at the, predominately Labour voting, people of London who have no direct control over which tier their city is placed in?

The failure of mainstream media to report equally on the impact across all of the country is also again not under the control of the average Londoner.

Relapsed

The anger, frustration IS directed at our shit show of a government. THEY have created divisive rules. THEY are solely to blame for this.

I don't know how they can justify Manchester in tier 3 with these figures and the fact London had higher rates being put in tier 2.
I'm in Tameside which has the lowest rates and is 281 out of 315 local authorities for cases.

I guess because some of those areas numbers are going up not down? Trafford up 28% for example. Also it’s about hospital space - London with those numbers might have had far more hospital beds available.