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Cummings may not be as bad as we thought...

28 replies

wondersun · 14/12/2020 15:29

Well I thought anyway. I blamed him for so much. An interesting read so thought I’d put it here.

archive.vn/UWnAm

One thing that hasn’t changed me - gutted we didn’t aim for zero covid. I know we’d never have achieved it but that’s not what aiming for it is about.

OP posts:
sashagabadon · 14/12/2020 15:38

As I understand it, Cummings was also pushing for lockdown 1. I think the scientists were trying to hold off on the assumption that timing is everything and people will only agree to one hard lockdown. Like everything in life you could argue this either way.
Manchester / Andy Burnham certainly felt in the Autumn that we had locked down in Spring to London’s timetable but realistically I am not sure that we could have lockdowned only the south of the country in the Spring.
All the other rule breakers since Cummings have also put what he did in perspective. At least he was trying to protect his 4 year old son, not celebrating his birthday or travelling from Scotland to London like some of his hypocritical critics Hmm

Feedingthebirds1 · 14/12/2020 16:32

My thoughts are, and have been since the start, that hindsight is a wonderful thing. I started a thread yesterday about the new German lockdown, and there were comments then about how earlier we all thought Germany, France, Italy... had got it right when we'd gone to shit, but now maybe not.

The decision was taken not to go into lockdown earlier to try to protect the economy from even deeper ravages. Because cases soared, that's now seen as the wrong decision. But if they'd done lockdown instead, and more businesses had gone under, then there would have been a lot of people saying that the government was sacrificing jobs, not thinking about the economic impact of lockdown on ordinary people's lives. So I don't think it makes Dominic Cummings suddenly some sort of knight in shining armour.

Many people were criticising this government for the mistakes they made right from the beginning, and they did make mistakes. I carry no torch for Boris. But I can't convince myself that any other leader, from any party, would have had the objectively right solutions. Their mistakes might well have been different ones, but there would still have been mistakes. The evidence globally is that only the most totalitarian countries, those prepared to nail people into their homes, have had much success at containing the virus. And nobody in the west would have countenanced that, politicians or public.

noblegiraffe · 14/12/2020 16:34

Is New Zealand a totalitarian country that nailed people into their homes?

cologne4711 · 14/12/2020 16:35

Hmm interesting. At the time everyone was blaming Cummings for not going into lockdown and saying he wanted to kill all the old people etc.

He's not my cup of tea but I didn't really see what all the hysteria about his child was about. Having had flu at the same time as DH when ds was small, I can well imagine that you'd want to make sure a small child would be looked after if you thought you were ill. I don't know what the driving and eyesight thing was about though, that just made him look like a massive twit with an a.

MrsLebowski · 14/12/2020 16:39

Q.What is Dominic Cummings favourite Christmas song?
A. Driving home for Christmas.

sashagabadon · 14/12/2020 16:42

@noblegiraffe

Is New Zealand a totalitarian country that nailed people into their homes?
In effect what NZ has done though is nail people into their island country. They can leave but only with an expensive forced quarantine in return. That’s the price of zero Covid. I think they did the right thing for them but closed borders for a year or longer and forced hotel quarantined here is not sustainable imo. Plus they cannot produce their own vaccines and have to sit and wait for others to supply them over 2021. Theirs pros and cons to every scenario and most countries have made mistakes. It has certainly been a steep learning curve for us all!
Feedingthebirds1 · 14/12/2020 16:46

@noblegiraffe

Is New Zealand a totalitarian country that nailed people into their homes?
Apologies, I did forget about New Zealand and I shouldn't have done.

This article really praises the NZ response www.theguardian.com/world/2020/oct/08/new-zealands-covid-19-response-the-best-in-the-world-say-global-business-leaders. One slight caveat, they did close their borders which undoubtedly had a significant impact, and again I suspect that if the UK had done that, there would also have been outcries as there were when Australia implemented the same policy.

sashagabadon · 14/12/2020 16:47

@cologne4711

Hmm interesting. At the time everyone was blaming Cummings for not going into lockdown and saying he wanted to kill all the old people etc.

He's not my cup of tea but I didn't really see what all the hysteria about his child was about. Having had flu at the same time as DH when ds was small, I can well imagine that you'd want to make sure a small child would be looked after if you thought you were ill. I don't know what the driving and eyesight thing was about though, that just made him look like a massive twit with an a.

Totally agree with that. The constant police investigations were utterly ridiculous then and for some people to still be talking about “what Cummings did” as their excuse for anything they do now is silly.
SillyOldMummy · 14/12/2020 16:49

Boring. Nothing will my mind about Scummings.

cyclingmad · 14/12/2020 16:54

I'd rather we shut our borders, we can holiday in the uk which would help thise business that would struggle and we could have near normal life at least instead of this rubbish limbo land we have

LimaFoxtrotCharlie · 14/12/2020 17:08

@cyclingmad

I'd rather we shut our borders, we can holiday in the uk which would help thise business that would struggle and we could have near normal life at least instead of this rubbish limbo land we have
If we shut the borders, we won’t have enough food - or would you make an exception for freight and for lorry drivers? What about Brits returning from abroad who would have to go into quarantine? Where would they go, and who would enforce it? Don’t forget that there are thousands of Australians who still can’t get home due to quarantine rules/cost of quarantine/lack of flights.
Mustbe3ormorecharacters · 14/12/2020 17:09

Hold on, you are telling me all of the posts ranting and complaining from random people on mumsnet may actually be wrong about something?

Sobeyondthehills · 14/12/2020 17:11

At least he was trying to protect his 4 year old son,

He protected his son by testing his eyesight by driving 30 miles?

He could have protected his son by a number of different ways, none of which involved driving 250 miles.

The reason I believe most people were pissed at Cummings is all the other people who broke the rules resigned, he held a press conference in a fucking garden

RaspberryCoulis · 14/12/2020 17:14

What Margaret Ferrier did was 100 times worse.

But the Scottish media were too weak to go after the selfish, stupid woman.

timeforanewstart · 14/12/2020 17:24

Stop comparing Nz to the uk they are not comparable

Unsure33 · 14/12/2020 17:29

He had a special needs son. So I considered a lot of it bullying . And technically he did not break the rules . Except the drive and even then he did not break social distancing rules.

The attacks on him were just and excuse for breaking rules.

Unsure33 · 14/12/2020 17:30

New Zealand has a totally different demographic.

HazeyJaneII · 14/12/2020 17:41

He had a special needs son
I know there was a lot of speculation at the time, but it never seemed to be confirmed...was it since?

TheCountessofFitzdotterel · 14/12/2020 17:47

‘He could have protected his son by a number of different ways, none of which involved driving 250 miles.‘

Nobody has ever explained what he could have done other than used some mythical local childcare that he clearly didn’t have.

Barnard Castle was inexcusable and he should have said sorry but the initial drive up the motorway looked like nothing other than a sincere attempt to get his son looked after by someone he trusted without putting anyone at risk.

PicsInRed · 14/12/2020 18:03

We should have closed the borders (as much as possible, trade not withstanding) in January. Then lockdown could have had an effect. With open borders, we're playing whack-a-mole.

However, closing borders is extremely highly political here in the UK, and wasn't going to be palatable to some. In NZ, we were taught in school (with pride) how we were able to slow pandemic flu with closed borders in 1918, so border closure seems more "natural" of an action to take to Kiwis born and raised. I remember heavy criticism of the NZ government of the time for failing to close the borders at the outset of Swine Flu. Jacinda would have remembered both in making her own decision.

CarrieBlue · 14/12/2020 18:08

At least he was trying to protect his 4 year old son, not celebrating his birthday or travelling from Scotland to London like some of his hypocritical critics

But celebrating his wife’s birthday was OK?

Sobeyondthehills · 14/12/2020 18:11

Barnard Castle was inexcusable and he should have said sorry but the initial drive up the motorway looked like nothing other than a sincere attempt to get his son looked after by someone he trusted without putting anyone at risk.

He just so happened to have a full tank of petrol and a four year old in the car that didn't need the toilet?

His claim that he might need childcare was also bullshit, so might hundreds of other families in the same position but most of them have had to lump it and deal with it proving once again, the whole "we are all in this together" was bullshit.

herecomesthsun · 14/12/2020 18:13

So what about the people he could have infected as he drove all those miles up to Durham?

When we weren't supposed to go anywhere as if we infected 1 person then it turned exponentially into killing a thousand?

When people couldn't sit with their loved ones when they died? When a 13-year-old died alone?

When people couldn't go to their loved ones' funerals?

And this pillock was gallivanting all over the country because he thought he was so clever?

Really, can't stand him, good bloody riddance.

ExpulsoCorona · 14/12/2020 18:14

Lol, has Cummings set up a Mumsnet account?

TheCountessofFitzdotterel · 14/12/2020 18:18

A child that goes to sleep in the car when you pop them in it at bedtime and thus doesn’t need the toilet for a long drive, yes, pretty normal. Lots of people deliberately do long drives with small children by setting off at bedtime precisely because they can end up sleeping all the way, we certainly used to.
I am not sure what is implausible about somebody rich who often has to do stuff at short notice keeping his petrol tank full.

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