A plea to those who have/will stop sticking to the restrictions

[PuzzledObserver]

Loads of people on various threads have said things like I’ve had enough, I’m seeing my friends, once the vulnerable are vaccinated I’m not wearing a mask etc.

This has been going on a long time, the idea of it going on much longer is unbearable, I get it. But, I want to make an appeal to you on behalf of those who are more vulnerable and are not willing to throw caution to the wind.

If you, and your friends/family, want to get together in private, or in the open air, in defiance of whatever rules are in place at the time - well, as long as you’re all consenting adults, that’s your business. Actually, it’s not solely your business, because one or more of you could then go on to pass the virus to someone vulnerable, but that’s not my main point here.

My point is, whatever you decide to do amongst your friends - when you are out in public, please respect the wishes of other people who have made a different decision to you.

Please carry on wearing your mask in the supermarket and on the bus. Please keep your distance from people who are clearly trying to keep theirs from you.

You want to make your own decisions about risk? Fine. You don’t get to make that decision for others, and that means you have to keep away from anyone who is not choosing to be close to you.

Calledyoulastnightfromglasgow - totally agreed, it feels like people are forgetting that they can only lock down because other people aren't, but those people are working class or immigrants so they don't figure in their imagination at all.

Well I guess it has been an entire day since I've seen a mask thread, so ...

@Calledyoulastnightfromglasgow

I have used bad language on this thread however I have not used lazy or scruffy. I absolutely don’t want to turn this into a class fight.

My job will be badly affected if the economy does not pick up so personally I want this horrific situation to be sorted as soon as possible (especially as Brexit is going to screw is more than ever, but that’s another fight). I want people to get back to work, I want my kids to be able to see their friends outside school amd I really, really want to see my family who are many miles away and my Dad is alone.

So I yes I’ve preached- in fact ranted - and I found it quite cathartic as I’m so upset with this whole situation. So I just wish that everyone would make the hard but doable sacrifices (wearing masks, not meeting indoors, not having big Christmas parties etc) so that the huge sacrifices that others are having to make can be stopped (ie losing their jobs and businesses). If all those who were able to made these sacrifices then this would help make the situation get better sooner. Of course other things need to
happen too - particularly vaccination.

So when people say “I’m fed up with masks”
or “you only live once” and even “we’re going to die anyway” I think that’s so so selfish because so many people have suffered so much so far and I feel it’s pathetic if we (especially me who is in an undoubtedly privileged position work wise) cannot make these “sacrifices”.

So I don’t mean to preach, I just think of you are in a position to help, you should.

....... No.

You do you, I’ll do me

Your sanctimonious attitude will put people off OP. It’s really not your place to ask people to follow the rules. There is various legislation in place, people are more than aware of this.

Sadly but rightly, you can’t control other people. The vast majority of people are doing their best and I hate that the government are positioning their messaging so heavily towards it being our fault, our responsibility.

When really, large aspects of this are not because a handful of people are not wearing masks in shops when they could. But because there isn’t adequate support for those on low incomes who may need to isolate, no logical way of working for schools, no decent track and trace system etc etc.

I mean this kindly, but focus on what you can control. This is all so polarising but I do think most people are extremely sympathetic to the situation those who are ECV are in.

However everyone has their own path to walk through this and it’s been a tough road for most, societal responsibility is important but so is looking after yourself, your mental health and your family. It’s a balancing act. I’m unashamedly desperate for things to be back to ‘normal’ or more normal and I don’t think that makes me a cunt.

“ So I just wish that everyone would make the hard but doable sacrifices (wearing masks, not meeting indoors, not having big Christmas parties etc) so that the huge sacrifices that others are having to make can be stopped (ie losing their jobs and businesses). If all those who were able to made these sacrifices then this would help make the situation get better sooner. Of course other things need to
happen too - particularly vaccination. ”

This just isn’t reality though. We could all be locked down over Christmas and wear masks with a 100% compliance but it wouldn’t stop the spread of the virus.

People still need to work, attend hospital, use childcare, go to school and uni etc.

The minority who aren’t wearing masks in shops and who will go above the Christmas allocation we’ve been given are not having the huge impact you think they are / will.

Getting the economy going again, returning to school and work plus the change in seasons are to ‘blame’. I use the word blame lightly because this is really a virus behaving as a virus does. A second wave was likely without a proper track and trace system or virus.

Why not direct some of this energy at the government who have failed to use those summer months to come up with plans for returning to university, track and trace, payments and conditions for self isolating, safer schools etc?

Or vaccination *

*Just so you know, death comes to us all. It catches up to us sooner or later. No one is immortal. When your times up your times up.

This isn't seriously your attitude is it? I'm not sure if you meant it this way, but it's coming across as not giving a shit about being careful around others, because y'know, if they die, they die.

I'm not sure why this is being considered such an outlandish view, it is a fairly common held belief. You don't have to subscribe to it, and I think it is a bit too black and white, but the poster did not imply that she wished everyone dead.*

It's not a question of WISHING everyone dead. It's using the fact that we all die as an apparent excuse for not taking any precautions.

The drunk driver doesn't wish everyone dead either. They may even prefer on the whole that others don't die. But not to the extent of being willing to adapt their behaviour..

To make it clear: I am not talking about people who take risks because it's the only way to survive economically, or about people who take more (or fewer) risks that I would, but keep within the basic rules and guidelines. I am talking about people who won't follow any guidelines; who refuse to wear masks; who go partying without any social distancing; who get in the faces of shop workers, bus drivers and the general public, and respond to any request with swearing,abuse, and worse, deliberately coughing on people. I am especially talking about people who defy rules and guidelines just BECAUSE they wish to show the government/ the 'do-gooders'; the cowardly 'sheep' that 'no one is going to boss them around'.

Yawn

I absolutely don’t want to turn this into a class fight

Nor do I. In fact. some of the worst offenders are certain middle-class students, who are happy to party in an unrestrained way and put the communities, in which they are living, at increased risk. (I am aware that most students do not act in this way.)

I think it's more an age fight than a class one. Some younger people think (wrongly) that they are at no risk whatsoever from Covid, and aren't prepared to sacrifice themselves in any way for older people.

Rules need enforcing - like 'no mask no entry no excuse' not some self certification rubbish. Until they actually enforce any rules, or make people pay the fines, then its never going to happen.

A lot of people aren't isolating properly, not because they're thick, selfish, or evil, but because they're afraid of losing their income. People going to work with the virus has undoubtedly driven infections, and they aren't doing it for the hell of it but because of real economic pressure that could have been alleviated by giving people enough to actually live on while they isolate.

Exactly.

Why not direct some of this energy at the government who have failed to use those summer months to come up with plans for returning to university, track and trace, payments and conditions for self isolating, safer schools etc?

Exactly.

Though we must admit that the phrases 'this government' and 'come up with plans' very rarely belong in the same sentence!

I remember reading somewhere that at least 1% of people are sociopaths (more men than women), so they just don't give a shit about anyone else. And so whenever I see people (adults) blatantly breaking the rules I think to myself - there's another sociopath. They're probably the same people who chuck rubbish out their car windows.

Unfortunately, appealing to their better judgement won't do any good, they just don't care.

[quote Doublebubblebubble]@Bewareoftheblob again, i have had 4 people die from this.

One was 36, and a gym bunny.

Yes the others were older (mid 50s to late 60s) but that doesnt just mean their lives were worthless.

Just because it hasnt affected you yet doesnt mean it wont. Especially if youre being careless.[/quote]
Last time I checked death wasn't a big respecter of worth.

Young people sometimes die of flu but we don't shut everything down because of it.

The reason this 'pandemic' is a thing is because technology has improved. If this had happened ten or fifteen years ago, it would just have been a bad flu year.

Also, you have no idea whether or not this has affected me personally.

@BethlehemIsInTier1

I have been shielding since March, the dramatics on here are getting boring now. If it concerns you that much what others do *@PuzzledObserver* I suggest you stay in like I have.

Not that easy tho is it? What about those who have children, single parents on limited income, those who have to go out of the home to work? Hope it's nice in the little bubble in which you live but many are not able to "stay in like you have".

No, I won’t be wearing a mask to respect the decision of people who have chosen not to have the vaccine.

If you saw what it's like day to day in schools you'd realise why anyone with DC in school, school age kids and their families are just not going to get on board with this. Sometimes there are 34 teenagers and 2 ladults in a classroom, windows open and hand gel used on arrival. That's it.
No wonder teenagers are still having sleepovers, meeting up in groups etc. As staff its very hard to socially distance from each other. E.g. we had a 'situation'with a teen the other day and I needed to know what had triggered it. The masked member if staff could hardly shout 'his Dad has just been arrested' through a mask so she had to get close.
The mixed messages from govt are not helping spread.

To be clear, I’ll keep wearing a mask into the vaccine has rolled out and everyone who wants to have it and those vulnerable who are able to have it have all had it. Beyond that, no, I won’t be. I don’t see why I should be expected to be considerate of the selfish who aren’t prepared to do their bit and have the vaccine. If everyone who was able to have it did, the vulnerable will be protected by herd immunity as happens with other vaccines. The vulnerable who can’t have it still being at risk of the virus will be put in that position due to selfish anti vaxxers. Not by people who have had the vaccine not wearing a mask.

It’s really not your place to ask people to follow the rules. There is various legislation in place, people are more than aware of this.

If they are aware of it, why are some of them not following it? A minority, obviously.

If I’m in the supermarket and someone comes right up next to me, without a mask, I have no business being upset with them or asking them to stop, is that what you mean?

FWIW, I am not mixing socially with anybody. I am working from home as much as possible, only meeting people directly when there is no alternative. I go out for walks and stay away from people, I go to the supermarket, because we need to eat. And most people are fine, but there are some who don’t make space.

So my thread was addressed to people on MN who are saying they’re not following the rules any more. What you do at home is your business. Please be considerate in public. That’s all.

@MadameBlobby

Technology has improved but people are getting sick?

What youre saying is utter nonsense

you have no idea whether this has affected me personally.

No, I dont.

But if it has - you're unbelievably naive to continue your beliefs and frankly disrespectful to the potential person who has died.

If it hasn't (yet) - you're still being unbelievably naive.

Just because you think you're right about this, doesn't mean you are.

Like, the chances of you dying of a car accident are pretty low but EVERYONE who gets in a car wears a seatbelt. Without question.

[quote FearlessGreatExpanse]@BethlehemIsInTier1

I am concerned with what others do because it affects me. And my family. My widowed dad is spending Christmas on his own. He is in tears. He wants to see us but is too stressed about us coming and the risk to him, but is also terrified that I’ll be angry with him for not wanting me to visit. I’m not - I’m just unbelievably sad and hate the idea of him being alone.

I’m not chastising those choosing to bubble with those in vulnerable positions - especially those who are unlikely to see next Christmas, but I am ranting, foul language and all, at those who are carrying on as if nothing can be done. And plenty are. Pricks.[/quote]
But is your dad doing that over an actual known risk? Or is it because of the hysteria created in the media and by the govt to suit their own needs (ie a severely underfunded NHS!)

I have yet to see anyone saying they will no longer wear a mask when required, nor stop distancing. I have seen a lot saying they will see family and such though, and I cannot blame them really after so long. It seems a bit daft for people to randomly stop wearing masks and distancing?! Anyone advertising this seems a bit of a twat also.

I find it odd, how many posters on here reckon they have had multiple fit young family members/friends die of covid though, I have to say. Not really about the topic of the thread, but from a quick look over the replies. Saw someone a few days back claim 4 family members under 60 had died, along with 3 friends under 50, only 2 f the 7 apparently had any health issues. But, the amount of people overall in the country who have died at that age with no health problems is so small, that one wuld be extremely unlucky, and indeed a total anomaly, to have so many in their close circle who have died. Weird MN phenomenom seemingly.

@Pootle40

www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-02483-2

It’s not hysteria FFS. It’s nature, and as woeful as this government are on many, many accounts, my Dad’s risk assessment is grounded in scientific fact, and certainly not hysteria.

Further stats here www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsduetocoronaviruscovid19comparedwithdeathsfrominfluenzaandpneumoniaenglandandwales/deathsoccurringbetween1januaryand31august2020#death-occurrences-in-2020-and-five-year-averages-for-influenza-and-pneumonia

But of course you won’t believe this - it’s all
Part of the “conspiracy” and I’m just a sheeple (along with most of the scientific community) who can’t think and see the big picture.

I’m out. Too much scientific illiteracy and selfishness here. Maybe I’m one of the covid police, but I’m not a lockdown-extender.