Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Covid

Mumsnet doesn't verify the qualifications of users. If you have medical concerns, please consult a healthcare professional.

Original poster

Child contact over Christmas-I just need to be armed with the facts

50 replies

MollyBloomYes · 11/12/2020 00:47

Tonight my exh dropped 'casually' into conversation that he is disappointed about Christmas arrangements as it means his mum won't be able to see our children. This year is my year to have them Christmas Day, we swap on the 27th. His Mum lives about 2.5 hours away, in a tier 3 area (we are currently tier 1). These arrangements have been in place for ages, have been the pattern for years and this is the first they have been mentioned.

I can predict that this will be leading up to wanting to swap or move the handover to Boxing Day or something. I don't want to. I don't think they should be going to a tier 3 area anyway, especially as their flu vaccine has had to be cancelled at school this week and probably won't be rescheduled before the end of term (the whole school, not just my children). Added to which, his mum works in elderly care. He mentioned forming a support bubble with his mum as he will be a single parent family which I suppose technically he could but I don't know if support bubbles really count if moving across tiers or counties, including a long journey which will include a stop at a service station.

I'd rather not get into a debate about likelihood of catching covid, severity of it, morals of swapping etc etc on here. I of course have sympathy for his mum wanting to see her grandchildren however, perhaps because I work in healthcare, I see no reason why they couldn't 'do' Christmas at a later date when there is a reduced risk both for the children and for the people she works with. It's one day and it doesn't generally matter when that day is technically celebrated as far as I'm concerned (and my kids don't care, they are delighted to get two Christmases whenever they occur!) I've tried to look at gov guidance and as usual am completely confused (my single parent support bubble live 10 mins away and wfh so none of the same issues!)

Please can anyone direct me to clear, reliable guidance? There's a history of emotional abuse so I find that arming myself with concise information helps in debates with him. In the rest of my life I'm pretty good at defending my point....Hmm Thank you.

OP posts:
Mindymomo · 11/12/2020 07:09

Tiers don’t count over the Christmas break from 23 Dec to 27 Dec, you can meet indoors with up to 3 different families. Also if MIL is single, she can form a bubble with you, so you will be one family.

It is hard to decide what to do over Christmas, we don’t have any parents now, but what family we do have, we have all decided that we won’t be seeing them this year.

Hapixmas · 11/12/2020 07:15

He can make a support bubble with her and these don't make a difference in tiers. Support bubbles can be miles apart.
Why don't you want her to see her grandmother?
You say it is just one day but don't want to swap yourself (nor should you have to either) but what your ex is suggesting is legal and if you have joint responsibility? (That is an assumption of course) then he can make these decisions.
In my opinion, spread is happening in schools, workplaces etc... I wouldn't be worried about visiting a tier 3 area so long as activities are limited with wider community.

ProfessorInkling · 11/12/2020 07:20

Tiers are being reviewed next week, but also suspended over Christmas. You don’t have grounds to object and honestly as someone in a similar position, it’s not your judgment call when they’re with their dad.

Hardbackwriter · 11/12/2020 07:29

If it's just one day and it doesn't matter when you celebrate why not let him have Christmas this year and then he could go to his mum's for longer?

smartiecake · 11/12/2020 07:32

But he can form a support bubble with his mum and she can see the kids on the 27th if you hand over early in the morning. So she can get to see them. So he doesnt need to ask for different arrangements as the current ones will be fine

CeeceeBloomingdale · 11/12/2020 07:33

What he is suggesting is all within the guidelines, except it's not his contact days. I would try and accommodate somehow

unicornparty · 11/12/2020 07:34

What he wants to do is allowed.

CeeceeBloomingdale · 11/12/2020 07:34

Actually, come to think of it, if they are bubbling they can stay overnight at any time, not just the 5 days at Christmas. He could go on 27th and stay for a few days then.

Nonamesavail · 11/12/2020 07:36

Mine will see extended family when they see their dad over the holidays. I can't really do much about it tbh so just not bothered bringing it up.

Hotpinkangel19 · 11/12/2020 07:37

Can you not come to some sort of arrangement? It's not a normal year is it? I'm sure it would be nice for her to see her grandmother anyway?

CodenameVillanelle · 11/12/2020 07:38

Why can't he take them to see his mum on the 27th? That's allowed

slipperywhensparticus · 11/12/2020 07:42

I don't see why his wishes and feelings take precedence over yours if you wanted to swap Christmas would he accommodate you?

Just say you have made plans his mum can see them on the 27th which is allowed

MzHz · 11/12/2020 07:59

It’s your year to have them, he can still have them on the day he is supposed to.

Why should you miss out when you’ve been the one doing the heavy lifting

I think your corona concerns are fair too.

The stupid arse govt seems to be saying that the virus is taking Christmas off and it’s all good to go.

It isn’t and it’s not.

There is nothing to stop him seeing the kids as he would ordinarily do. These are the plans and he’s had all year to work with them.

DunravenBadger · 11/12/2020 08:05

I think you're being unfair. This isn't a normal year. He's not doing anything against guidance.Wrt Christmas 3 households can form a bubble regardless of tears. If Christmas can be celebrated any time, what's the harm in him having her on boxing day - or even Christmas day? Can't you celebrate at a later date instead of expecting him to?

DunravenBadger · 11/12/2020 08:05

Regardless of tiers

muddledmidget · 11/12/2020 08:07

As the child of divorced parents, I think you need to work out why you're so against it. If it's because of covid and genuine concerns that's one thing, but to me it comes across as almost pettiness, you're not willing to change contact arrangements to allow your children to see their grandma over the Christmas relaxation of covid rules, for no other reason than you don't think you should have to. Would it be so bad if he collected them boxing evening, drove up and arrived at 8pm and they got to spend 27th with granny? In whose interest are you refusing to change the contact? And what would your children like to do? I might be projecting, but with my parents it was always to do with them being 'fair' and never about us.

SD1978 · 11/12/2020 08:12

Because it's different this year, him having the children fir one extra day, from Boxing Day, means they can see their grandmother. If you've always had Christmas, and still will be, I don't see why this would be an issue as a one off?

bathsh3ba · 11/12/2020 08:18

In terms of the guidance, if he has formed a bubble with his mum, then, assuming he doesn't have any other bubbles (a girlfriend he doesn't live with, for example) he can take the kids to see her and stay overnight any time.

In terms of the law, you have no say over what he does with the kids when they are in his care unless there are safeguarding concerns, which travel to a Tier 3 area would not count as.

You don't say if the Christmas arrangements are court ordered or a family arrangement, but either way what he wants to do with them is allowed, but it's up to you if you alter your plans so he sees them on a different day.

Hardbackwriter · 11/12/2020 08:19

Why should you miss out when you’ve been the one doing the heavy lifting

Surely the important question is whether or not the children miss out by not seeing their grandmother?

slipperywhensparticus · 11/12/2020 08:32

@Hardbackwriter

Why should you miss out when you’ve been the one doing the heavy lifting

Surely the important question is whether or not the children miss out by not seeing their grandmother?

They can still see her he just wishes her to change her plans to suit him I wonder if he would be so accommodating?

And why should she prioritise his wants over hers? Christmas is one day! If my daughter was unable to make it home for Christmas we were planning on Christmas #2 in July complete with a barbecue and gifts because it is just one day and health is more important

Waxonwaxoff0 · 11/12/2020 08:33

What he's proposing is allowed but if you don't want to swap contact days that's your choice.

frazzledasarock · 11/12/2020 08:41

Stick to the one lane. Wild he swap his isn’t Christmas Day for you if it were his turn this year?

To PP who asked OP does not have the DC. On Christmas every year they alternate.

Your ex can have his mother stay with him or drive over when the DC are with him.

Surely your side want to see you and your DC too.

Ignore him. If he casually mentions it again, tell him his mother can see the DC when they’re with him.

MRex · 11/12/2020 08:44

He probably hasn't realised yet that he can take the kids anytime if he's in a support bubble with his mum (as long as neither of them have been in any other bubble since September). So let him know he can take them on 27th and you don't need to change arrangements at all. It must be very hard sharing your precious children with somebody who you no longer even like, but that's no different now than any other time, you'll need to try to emotionally disconnect your past from what's best for your children now.

DunravenBadger · 11/12/2020 08:44

Surely your side want to see you and your DC too

So then surely 26th swap is more than fair? OP's family can currently see DC 23rd - 26th. That's 4 days out of the 5. Swapping on the 26th would mean his Mum can at least seem them on the 27th.

frazzledasarock · 11/12/2020 08:49

@DunravenBadger

Surely your side want to see you and your DC too

So then surely 26th swap is more than fair? OP's family can currently see DC 23rd - 26th. That's 4 days out of the 5. Swapping on the 26th would mean his Mum can at least seem them on the 27th.

Why?

His mother is in his bubble, she can see the DC during the ex’s contact time.

Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.

Join Mumsnet Log In

This thread is closed and is no longer accepting replies. Click here to start a new thread.