why Brexit now???

[Figmentofmyimagination]

As the chancellor has said today, we are in huge trouble thanks to this pandemic - worst downturn in 300 years. Surely now is the time to revisit Brexit, especially as there is no longer any requirement to honour manifesto commitments?

Brexit is to cost 4% of national income each year long term, even with a deal, or at least 6% without a deal.

Can we not at least agree to stay in the single market?

Why are we still doing this?

Will our children forgive us?

Brexit isn't now. We left the EU at the end of January due to the majority of those voting in the referendum voting to leave.

Yes, unfortunately we have already left. People who supported this shitshow will be frantically finding ways to blame the pandemic alone for all the problems the country now faces.

@TheSultanofPingu

Yes, unfortunately we have already left. People who supported this shitshow will be frantically finding ways to blame the pandemic alone for all the problems the country now faces.

But at least there will be all those spare millions every day for the NHS as promised by Boris on a bus.

Seriously, he might have been lying and not taking it seriously, but I know people who genuinely believe they were helping the NHS by voting for Brexit and still don't know that Brexit is actually economic self-harm.

Plus there was no Brexit department or staff, so they used the pandemic planning resources. That turned out great in the subsequent pandemic.

Brexit actually makes most sense whilst the EU is weakened as it is. Their promised punishments will be difficult to follow through and the mutual need will make other economies (including the EU) more likely to trade and deal. A friend in need is a friend indeed.

We also won't have to fund the EU's recovery as Germany will need to (and France too, assuming they're willing to embrace austerity and dig deep).

Frankly, that's an impending wreck we should stay well clear of (and if they think the same of us, fine with me).

Years down the line economists will be able to separate the effects of the pandemic and Brexit by comparing different countries economies. Will make an interesting case study in the future.

I don’t think we’re going to be able to judge this anytime soon that’s for sure. I have this idea that in the future it might end up with the UK, France and Germany teaming up to be a EU force. Now that would be powerful!

The UK economy is up shit creek, but so is the EU and most of the rest of the world. Delaying the inevitable will do no good at all.

I will be able to judge them when I can’t buy the fresh food my DD with ASD needs due to limited diet/sensory issues in January because of chaos at the ports.

To avoid this chaos, we didn’t need to remain in the EU, we could have simply had a soft Brexit remaining in CU and SM which was what was promised before the referendum anyway.

Our economy is weakened by COVID, but pretty much all forecasts shows the economy will be damaged more by no- deal than COVID in the medium to long term.

What promised punishments are those picsinred? Is it that they will apply tariffs and complete customs checks, I suggest you have a read of WTO article 1. They would be in breach of law to make an exception for the U.K.

Agreed that Johnson will blame the fallout on Covid then when he's left, the next guy will blame Johnson. Leavers will blame Remainers rather than themselves and other people who voted Leave.

We are already out, we left last year. It is a good idea to leave because that is what the country voted to do. To do otherwise would cause anarchy and diminish democracy. Once we have been out for 40 years we could have another vote on it and maybe the country would vote to go back in. Governments cannot just ignore legitimate votes or else they are corrupt.

This thread isn’t about leaving, it’s about the governments decision not to extend transition therefore causing disruption during a pandemic and also when we are likely to see a third wave after all the Christmas mixing.

What is corruption is getting to people to support one policy decision (leave EU but remain in SM and CU) and then delivering something different.

You do realise the EU has a.masively shrinking economy. By being out we won't have to pay into their enormous budgets anymore. Last week the auditors found massive holes in the EU spending that they could not account for.

Again, we didn’t need to remain in the EU to remain in the SM and CU.

The administrative burden of not being in the SM and CU is larger per annum than our contributions to the EU budget, according to forecasts.

If people don't know by now the econonic damage that Brexit will entil it's because they've been stuffing their fingers in their ears. Hope it makes the Tories unelectable for generations. We will all be a lot poorer soon.

To do otherwise would cause anarchy and diminish democracy.

You know as well as I do that this is utter tosh. Talk about the real 'Project Fear'!

Anyway. it's happening. And to answer the OP the reason that we're ploughing on without an extension and without negotiating a soft exit is because this is about ideology and enriching a chosen few. It has nothing to do with 'the good of the country'.

Covid is the best thing that could have happened to Johnson and his bunch of cronies. It will allow them to cover their tracks for a while and then sprint off into the sunset counting their cash. While the rest of us are left poorer, less influential, more isolated, to pick up the pieces of the country they've comprehensively fucked.

Brexit is well over by now. UK has already left the EU.
They could sign a deal, May's famous deal? But I think it unlikely, as they are just leaving it till past the last second, time after time! Not sure the deal is equivalent to staying in the single market? Possibly close enough, but they do not show any signs of wanting to sign it.....
The question is that they would have to follow all the EU rules, or at least a wide majority, without having even a single vote in said rules. The whole Brexit makes zero sense to me. And nobody seems to have other trading deals ready yet, it is like walking to the edge of the cliff and keep going!
All this should have been made clear before the vote to be honest. They should have come up with actual plans of what they wanted to replace the single market with, whole planning! Deals ready to sign. Not just an apparent empty space?

@BigGreen

If people don't know by now the econonic damage that Brexit will entil it's because they've been stuffing their fingers in their ears. Hope it makes the Tories unelectable for generations. We will all be a lot poorer soon.

Unfortunately, that would require those who voted Brexit accepting some personal responsibility for the mess, but they just won't. E.g. a trivial example if loo rolls run out due to Brexit, Brexiteers will be first in line to stockpile them. They won't ever admit they are wrong (plus many have protected income in the form of benefits or pensions). The young people will seek to rejoin the EU in a couple of decades' time perhaps, but the terms will be very much less favourable than the privileged terms we enjoyed as a founder member that we have thrown away.

Will our children forgive us?
Mine know me and their dad voted Remain and then voted to stop it the General Election. They also know my parents voted Leave then voted to continue it in the GE by voting Tory. So they can direct any anger at my parents

The end of Transition will be VERY BAD for the UK.
NO trade deal with the EU will ever be as good as what the UK had.
Anybody who thinks that the impacts of Brexit will be minor has not been reading the Government documents.
The combination of COVID and Brexit in January will be a shitstorm.

France is already MUCH more organised than the UK for what will happen in 40 days time.

I and my children will NEVER forgive those responsible
Nigel Farage
David Cameron
Theresa May
Boris Johnson
Dominic Cummings

its at their door

@CatMuffin

Will our children forgive us? Mine know me and their dad voted Remain and then voted to stop it the General Election. They also know my parents voted Leave then voted to continue it in the GE by voting Tory. So they can direct any anger at my parents

My DS won't ever forgive the Brexiteers. The resentment and political divide over Brexit will continue for decades and has been very harmful to the country. People weren't voting for anything, they were voting to remove something that has been in place for decades and that will remove many rights and freedoms for all our citizens, and will be felt most by the young people of today.

I and my children will NEVER forgive those responsible
Nigel Farage
David Cameron
Theresa May
Boris Johnson
Dominic Cummings

Don't forget Michael Gove, David Davies, Steven Barclay, all those MPs whose constituencies voted Remain but who voted for Leave in the Parliamentary votes...

because this is about ideology and enriching a chosen few. It has nothing to do with 'the good of the country'

This x a million. When the shit hits the fan in a few weeks, BJ will simply quit, just like Cameron the coward. Farridge et al will fuck off into the sunset, pockets bulging and all you’ll have to look forward to is gridlocked roads, losing your job and fights breaking out in your local Tesco over what’s left on the barren shelves.

Still, will of the people n all that.

Sorry, forget to bold the quote (the first bit is not mine!)