Furloughed but ineligible for pay HELP!!!

[100percentpeachynessa]

So basically I started my new job on the 30th of October at a restaurant, before lockdown 2 was even announced. Between then and lockdown 2 I worked 18.5 hours.

On Friday evening I got an email from the person who is in charge of our pay to let me know that although I have obviously been furloughed as my workplace has closed, I am ineligible for the Job Retention Scheme because even though I started on the 30th it basically requires you to have been paid on or before the 30th

My works ‘month’ runs from the 21st to the 20th and then pay day is on the 1st so in order to be eligible I would have had to have started working before September the 20th to have been paid on the 1st of October.

I don’t know what to do, I can’t be the only person in this situation but when I try and google it nothing comes up. I have applied for universal credit but I am employed so surely I won’t get it I just put ‘other’ when it asked whether I was employed although it said to put ‘employed’ if you are being furloughed, well I am being furloughed but not paid for it so I don’t know where that leaves me.

It’s not like I could have even found work elsewhere during lockdown 2 as it’s so short I will be needed back at work in a couple of weeks.

Someone HELPPP

UC use your income as reported on an RTI to calculate what you will receive.

As you aren't eligible for the job retention scheme but remain employed you will be processed at zero while your work is closed & this will be reported to HMRC.

You should have selected employed - by selecting other you may have delayed your claim while they check this.

As I understand it, if you were working elsewhere on the eligible date, you can approach them to re-employ you, furlough you immediately and claim furlough through that company.
It is their decision if they are happy to do this, as it may have other implications to them involving sickness and redundancy pay. Good luck

I have applied for universal credit but I am employed so surely I won’t get itconfused I just put ‘other’ when it asked whether I was employed although it said to put ‘employed’ if you are being furloughed, well I am being furloughed but not paid for it so I don’t know where that leaves me.

Most people who get universal credit are employed. It’s based in the wages you are actually paid.

Add a note to your journal explaining the full circumstances as clearly as you can. You will get UC.

I’m not an employment lawyer, but unless you are on a zero hours contract, I don’t think your new employer is actually allowed to furlough you.

Instead they will have to pay you as usual for your “normal” hours. If you imagine a situation where the JRS didn’t exist and the business had to close for a period another reason (necessary building work, or norovirus, or whatever), they wouldn’t be allowed to just not pay their staff.

I think your employer would need to formally make you redundant or dismiss you in order not to pay you, which would involve at least paying your notice period.

Hopefully someone with more knowledge of employment law will comment.

@NeedingCoffee as with most hospitality jobs it is a zero hours contract so I don’t know where that leaves me, everyone else there is eligible for the JRS though and basically I would have had to have worked there from the 21st of August to actually have a full months pay before the 30th of October for them to calculate 80%

@NatashaAlianovaRomanova Oh god I should have put employed, the only reason I put other was because when I tried the UC calculator it came out as £0.00 when I put employed

@Allycat Thank you, unfortunately I wasn’t working right up until the date I started as you can imagine the hospitality industry jobs are hard to come by at the moment with businesses closing or cutting staff I was lucky to get the job I did but I’m now just as worse off as if I hadn’t even got a job

@GroundAlmonds Thank you, I should have put employed on my application but stupidly I put other as when I tried the UC calculator it came up as 0 when I put employed and so I just assumed I should put other as while I am employed I will be receiving 0 pay for this month, it’s all very new to me and when I looked it up online there was really nothing to help me As I’ve only been working there since the 30th I’m wondering how they’d even calculate it though? And the fact it’s a zero hours contract. The thing is if I had just lost my job I could at least be trying to find work elsewhere to cover my bills but considering I’ve basically been given a month of unpaid leave with no other option I’m probably worse off

They’re right, you do have to have been paid by the 30th. Or at least on the RTI, which I believe essentially means paid.

Can you update your UC journal to change your answer from “other” back to “employed”? That might help with not slowing down your claim... I am sorry Are you in an area where you might be able to go back to work next week?

UC works on what you are paid between the month after you applied (assessment period). It doesn't matter if your considered employed. Most people are in employment on UC.

Just update your journal with that your employments closed but your ineligible for furlough pay.

I'm a benefit officer I deal with applications with confusing or incorrect info all the time. People usually fill them out in a flurry after finding out their jobs ended. As long as you correct the claim it'll be fine.

@GroundAlmonds The journal thing, do you just write your circumstances in it? I didn’t realise you could add to it yourself. I’m now worried my application is going to take even longer to process because I stupidly put other instead of employed. I tried to look up whether I’d be eligible for UC but it was so hard to work out considering the circumstances are so abnormal

@HopeAndDriftWood Hopefully I can change my application and just explain the circumstances in the journal part, because a ‘month’ at my work runs from the 21st to the 20th to then be paid on the 1st I would have had to have worked there from the 21st of August to have been paid on Oct 1st to actually have a full months pay packet for them to calculate it

Yes thank god I will be able to return to work next Thursday when it reopens, but that still leaves me with a months less earnings to pay my bills with and with Christmas coming up I really don’t know what’s going to happen to me

[quote 100percentpeachynessa]@GroundAlmonds The journal thing, do you just write your circumstances in it? I didn’t realise you could add to it yourself. I’m now worried my application is going to take even longer to process because I stupidly put other instead of employed. I tried to look up whether I’d be eligible for UC but it was so hard to work out considering the circumstances are so abnormal[/quote]
Yes, you can just chat back and forth there with the DWP staff there in free text. It gives you a handy record of what’s happened, and they should iron out any niggles for you.

@Hwory Phew at least I can change it. My only issue is obviously I won’t have any earnings for around 2 weeks after my application because I applied on Saturday and my workplace doesn’t reopen until the 3rd. My mum said if I do get UC I should be able to backdate it so I receive payments for the period from the last time I worked as that was on the night before lockdown 2.

@GroundAlmonds Thank you thank you thank you I am so clueless and it’s so daunting to be in this position when Christmas is coming up and with having bills to pay, although I know there are people who have had it so much worse

[quote 100percentpeachynessa]@GroundAlmonds Thank you, I should have put employed on my application but stupidly I put other as when I tried the UC calculator it came up as 0 when I put employed and so I just assumed I should put other as while I am employed I will be receiving 0 pay for this month, it’s all very new to me and when I looked it up online there was really nothing to help me As I’ve only been working there since the 30th I’m wondering how they’d even calculate it though? And the fact it’s a zero hours contract. The thing is if I had just lost my job I could at least be trying to find work elsewhere to cover my bills but considering I’ve basically been given a month of unpaid leave with no other option I’m probably worse off[/quote]
Calm down. It’ll be okay.

They can easily change “other” to “employed“ if they need to.

They will calculate it in what you have actually received through payroll during your assessment period. The assessment period starts on the day you claim and runs for a calendar month. Your payment date will be six days after the end of the assessment period.

Sorry my autocorrect keeps changing “on” to “in”. Annoying.

It is a horrible time of year for this, definitely. When did you actually claim? At some point in the first fortnight of your claim, you will be able to apply for a payment advance through your UC login. It’s interest free and repaid through deductions to your monthly UC payment over a year. Take that if you need it and can manage the repayments.

@GroundAlmonds Thank you what I’m worried about now in terms of the assessment period is the date I claimed was on Saturday and obviously my workplace doesn’t reopen until the end of lockdown so do you think that will be taken into account? As half of the assessment period I will still be in lockdown. Perhaps I should have started my claim right at the end of lockdown just before I go back to work so that I could still backdate my payments to cover the period from when I last worked the night before lockdown right up until the day I can go back to work. It’s so confusing hopefully I can just get it all down on my application and maybe the assessment period can start when I’m actually able to go back to work

@GroundAlmonds Thank you for letting me know that too, without MN I’d really have no clue

It’s fine. Forget lockdown or not lockdown. They will calculate it on what you actually earn this assessment period and the following month will be calculated on what you earn in the second assessment period, and so on.

One of the better things about the UC system is how responsive it is to fluctuating incomes, zero hours contracts etc.

@GroundAlmonds that is such a relief to hear I was so worried I’d messed up the application and made it even worse for myself

I’m not an employment lawyer, but unless you are on a zero hours contract, I don’t think your new employer is actually allowed to furlough you. You can be "laid off" - this was what happened before Covid. It had to be specified in your contract, but the big hospitality firms do have it in their contract, which meant, before the furlough scheme started, the minimum the employer could pay you during lay-off was £27 per day for 5 days, then nothing more till you'd been laid off 6 months. I found this out because someone I know was laid off before the furlough scheme was announced - a shit few days.

I dont think they backdate anything its based on the assessment period which will start the day you applied.
The assessment period is the same every month and they get the information directly from hmrc.

@MereDintofPandiculation I’m on a zero hours contract do you think that makes a difference? They didn’t really say ‘we’re furloughing you’ they just mentioned ‘you might get furlough’ (as on furlough pay) but then I didn’t hear anything up until Friday when I got that email from the person who sorts out pay

@MoonPomme Now I’m thinking I should have started the claim the day before I go back to work, that way it will have been just under a month since I last worked so still enough to backdate payments, and the assessment would cover a month I was actually working compared to me now where my assessment period will have started on Saturday but I can’t actually return to work until it reopens in nearly two weeks

@MoonPomme sorry by backdate I meant you can claim for the period you haven’t worked which can be up to a month before you started your claim

My understanding is they dont backdate and your entitlement starts from the day you open a claim.
So you should have claimed earlier not later.
Your contract is irrelevant they calculate to what you earn in the assesment period.
You start with a base entitlement depending on age, relationship status, housing costs, children, and they deduct from that at 63p per £1 of reported earnings.
Go to univeral credit essentials on facebook with any questions they are great and will help you.