Are you a good citizen?

[littlebillie]

I am so sick of the naysayers for the vaccine. All the rigorous testing is being completed at top speed no CHM or FDA would allow a vaccine to pass through without it.

         People are dying. 

I applied for the vaccine trial but due to health reasons will be some time before I am allowed it.

I will one of the many will be relying on others to get vaccinated to help it being less virulent in general society.

When I ask if you are a good citizen? I'm asking do you care about your friend with auto immune disorder, your scared elderly neighbour and your mate with asthma who is worried?

There is purposeful misinformation on the internet to disrupt the vaccine distribution

I would rather read the CHM information and WHO if you are worried.

The sooner we see this go from society the sooner life and business will return.

@OhamIreally

Yes I will have the vaccine. I was offered the Swine Flu vaccine when that came out as I was pregnant. I decided against it as I felt it wasn't just me, and as I was two weeks away from giving birth I decided to not use public transport or go out much instead (we would call it self-isolating now). Interestingly I haven't seen pregnant women on the priority list for this vaccine.

Pregnant women won't be in the list because you can't test medications or vaccines on pregnant women or children. Therefore I would imagine they can't actually have it (although happy to be corrected)

I have asthma and will definitely be having the vaccine as soon as I can.

But I'd argue that if people genuinely cared about those with asthma they'd do things like: drive less, not leave engines idling (outside schools it is a terrible trigger for me), use home fires and wood burners less/not at all. Those things would be very beneficial if people really cared!

I more than likely won't be offered the vaccine anytime soon. However if I was I don't know if I'd have it or not, I would need to do research into it. If I chose to have it, I wouldn't judge Margaret who decided not to because she wasn't comfortable with the risks of potential damaging side effects in the future.

I really don't care if someone decides not to have the vaccine.

People have the right to choose NOT to have anything injected into them as long as they are at an age to decide for themselves (I think childhood vaccines are more complicated as effectively you are deciding for someone else but that isn't what this thread is about).

I certainly won't be getting the vaccine for anyone else and am happy to admit I will choose to get the vaccine based on whether it is beneficial to me. However, I think I am way down the list on who gets it so again if I could purchase it privately to jump the queue it would be entirely dependant on whether it benefits me (e.g. if you needed it to fly or take a cruise then yes I would).

And I really hate this thing about being a 'good citizen'. People are not 'good' and 'bad' by one action. It is far more than that and labelling someone as good because they have a vaccine is stupid far to simplistic.

I'm bad then because I don't want it. I have an autoimmune condition I never have the flu shot either.

@JamSarnie

And I really hate this thing about being a 'good citizen'. People are not 'good' and 'bad' by one action. It is far more than that and labelling someone as good because they have a vaccine is stupid far to simplistic.

Something about this makes you feel uncomfortable, "good" refers to making decision that benefit your community and society in general.

The interesting thing about the vaccine is that we won't wear a badge to say well done. We will know our contribution however small has helped society. I'm sorry if "good" makes you feel uncomfortable

Well, I'm not a citizen at all (and have been called a bad/traitorous citizen of my birth country numerous times) and won't be a citizen here until we get through the current backlog of ceremonies for us to swear/affirm allegiance to the Queen and her heirs and pledge loyalty to the UK because a couple of decades ago, it was decided that needed to happen for people to become good citizens here. Not sure whether or not getting a vaccine can come under the umbrella of 'fulfil my duties and obligations as a British citizen,' but there are tons of other things people could be concerned about for those and other groups that barely gets a mention, as already mentioned about the asthma.

Yes, there is a lot of nonsense out there which is concerning, but there is about everything. That issue is going to take more the finger-wagging at people to be a good citizen. As someone who is low risk of infecting others due to pretty much being a hermit, I'm not rushing to get a vaccine. I'd rather those who need to get out there have access first. Mostly housebound me can wait. If I'm put as a priority due to my spouse's job or one of the health issues of the people in my house, I will, but I'm not jumping to do so.

And plenty of people during WW2 were out for themselves. Don't buy into the nonsense that they were somehow saints. They wouldn't have needed patrols for compliance with blackout curtains if everyone was sticking to the rules cheerfully, before getting into some of the worse illegal behaviour that went on (looting during bombings coming to mind).

It doesn't make me uncomfortable. I just don't look down on anyone who chooses not to have ANY vaccine (assuming they are an adult choosing for themselves) for whatever reason that is personal to them. I certainly won't be labelling them 'bad' but I would judge others that do label them so.

"good" refers to making decision that benefit your community and society in general.

No it doesn't. 'Good' is to be desired or approved of. It's a value judgement that depends on context and situation.

I'm not sure there is anything good about tying good citizenship with this specific vaccine rather than what I think is more the core of the issue being concerned about media literacy and the spread of misinformation.

I could see an argument for good citizens being careful not to spread lies, especially ones that could harm the community, and taking caution is asses information, not so much about narrowing this down to whether or not someone wants to get a vaccine as quickly as possible.

Im fairly selfish and would generally choose what's best for myself and my family over the bigger picture. I've always been the same. I get sick of situations where risk is massively overestimated as is personal responsibility & it just becomes another stick to whip people with.

The environment - there's a handful of companies responsible for the majority of the catastrophe that is climate change. No amount of me recycling and composting will change that. Legislation would change things, as we saw with cfcs in the 80s, but I have no faith that it will happen.
Covid - the country is in a state because the government paid billions to private companies to oversee different areas of the nation's response and they weren't fit for purpose. Me freezing at work because I've got to keep the windows open and stopping the kids from seeing my mum won't undo the fallout of a catastrophic track and trace system.

So no I'm not a good citizen because it's ineffective and just creates extra work for myself. Maybe if I felt like I was being governed by good citizens though I might feel differently (I doubt it though.)

@OhamIreally

Yes I will have the vaccine. I was offered the Swine Flu vaccine when that came out as I was pregnant. I decided against it as I felt it wasn't just me, and as I was two weeks away from giving birth I decided to not use public transport or go out much instead (we would call it self-isolating now). Interestingly I haven't seen pregnant women on the priority list for this vaccine.

I'm assuming that, as with children, they haven't tested it on pregnant women and therefore they won't generally be offering it to them (yet, at least).

I might have it a few months down the line, after I've seen that there are no side effects.
I don't care if I'm judged to be good or bad. I and my family recently spent 5 unnecessary days indoors, off work and school, waiting for the results of DH's COVID test. Which was negative. We obeyed guidelines to the letter and now I want my bodily autonomy.
I'll decide what is best for me, no one else, and I will not be explaining or justifying myself either. People can mind their own fucking business unless, of course, they are 100% perfect and COVID rule abiding themselves.
That rules Dominic Cummings out, Johnson said that his behaviour was ok, so I feel no pressure to have a vaccine recommended by a government I do not trust or members of the public who wouldn't be out of place in Nazi Germany.

I'm a good citizen, in that I do stuff like give blood, I support my local community in various ways and I always vote. I will be having the vaccine as soon as I can so that I get my life back and whilst I don't trust the government I do trust a lot of smart scientists. I don't mind if others come to a different decision and would be entirely against anything that coerced people to participate. But, if those who don't participate for reasons of principle expect the rest of us to continue to practice social distancing and other measures to protect them, then that might be a problem.

You ask whether we're good citizens .. and follow that by heavily implying that if we choose not to get a vaccine, we don't give a shit about our 'scared elderly neighbours'.

What disgusting emotional blackmail this is.

Everyone needs to make a decision that suits them, weighing up personal pros and cons, and then pros and cons for the population at large.

Personally, I won't just be getting in the queue for the vaccine without reading up on it. But by 'reading up', I mean trusted sources rather than tabloid crap. And then, if I decide that it in my best interests, and the best interests of those around me, I will get it.

Jesus its gone all starship troopers...

Are you a good citizen OP?

Like you know, in general? I guess you must be because how else could you so readily lay judgement on others without being perfect yourself ?

I won’t be having the vaccine, I won’t explain myself and I don’t care what randoms on the internet think about me.

@OpheliasCrayon

Are you a good citizen OP?

Like you know, in general? I guess you must be because how else could you so readily lay judgement on others without being perfect yourself ?

Judgement comes from within, as I said there is no badge

@RufustheSniggeringReindeer

Jesus its gone all starship troopers...

It's is a great film though

Can’t argue with that littlebillie

When do you think the Covid police will retire from Mumsnet? This time next year? 2022? Or later?

I care about no one but myself. Is that what you want people to say OP?

My decision to have it or not will probably be based on what is happening at the time I am offered it, the guilt tripping and shaming that is currently going on won't be a factor.

So you're judging everyone else from within. That's lovely. You sound delightful, that's my judgement

I'm not. I've broken lockdown rules. I have a small baby and have had friends over to meet him and stop my mental health rapidly deteriorating. Not parties, but a friend over for a couple of hours to have a glass of wine and a proper chat. I'm not sorry.