Breaking rules to pay the bills...

[wheresmymojo]

We've stuck to the rules all the way through however we're going to have to break the rules in this lockdown because the alternative is that we can't pay our mortgage/bills/for food.

Just wondering if anyone else is in the same position?

[2kool4skool]

Can you look to sell the house? £1600 mortgage seems high?

[Umbridge34]

No judgment but honestly the risk of being found out and therefore fined seems pretty big, especially if he's doing it out of your garage whilst its open.

And how many clients will he even get at the moment?

Not sure what the answer is really. It must be incredibly stressful.

[NeverForgetYourDreams]

I do feel sorry for the OP but was pointing out the issue isn't with being a limited company but how OP Paid themselves. Others may not know the loophole and just assume a limited company means low wages. It doesn't. It may serve to stop others playing the system when this is all over.

If you do the training in your garage you run the risk of being further in debt OP by getting a fine. You need to find an alternative way.

Hope it works out. Let's all stick to the rules and hope that restrictions ease in four weeks time.

[Emelene]

This sounds like a really hard situation.

Is there not a risk of a large fine if found out though? How do you think the clients would respond to being asked if they want to break the lockdown rules?

[Lostinacloud]

Definitely do what you need to.

Also, whilst not 100% guaranteed, if a neighbour was so heartless as to report your DH then fight the fine at magistrate court level. One of my relatives is a magistrate and whenever possible tries to give the benefit of doubt based on the circumstances as far as the law allows. I know for sure that if they’d do their best to overturn any fine given in your circumstances if the law allowed of course.

[caringcarer]

If he is planning on uses garage with door open in full view of neighbours people are do worried about Covid so you are likely to be grassed up. You would be effectively breaking the law and as.you know a fine of £10k would mean you lost your house.

I read in paper today mortgage holiday scheme is to be extended until Xmas.

Why can't your DH claim 80 per cent on furlough and also find a temporary.job through a job agency if necessary? There is still agency work going where I live in West Midlands.

As well as claiming 80 per cent furlough why can't you get another temporary job?

This new lockdown is only for one month. Your dh should be able to work.again soon. Can't you use your credit card for one month. Could you sell stuff on eBay? You must have some stuff you could sell, books you have finished with etc.

I am not judging you but worry for the sake of one month you are risking your future and if there was an accident your DH insurance would be invalidated.

Try talking to the council as they have been given additional funding and my nephew was allowed to defer his council tax payments until the New Year.

Good luck.

[wheresmymojo]

@Emelene

This sounds like a really hard situation.

Is there not a risk of a large fine if found out though? How do you think the clients would respond to being asked if they want to break the lockdown rules?

We will of course completely give them the option with zero pressure from us to carry over their sessions until lockdown is over.

There are 2 who may decide to do this. We'll also offer online training during lockdown as an alternative though it's unlikely (because this type of training doesn't convert well to online) that they'll take this up.

We've had 2 people who want to become new clients next week and very much want us to stay open and I suspect the 3rd existing client will be the same.

[caringcarer]

I forgot to add don't be too proud to use a good bank. People donate do others in your position don't go hungry.

Have you family who could help you out with.a loan?

[userxx]

@NeverForgetYourDreams You really are quite sneery and nasty aren't you.

[wheresmymojo]

@caringcarer

If he is planning on uses garage with door open in full view of neighbours people are do worried about Covid so you are likely to be grassed up. You would be effectively breaking the law and as.you know a fine of £10k would mean you lost your house.

I read in paper today mortgage holiday scheme is to be extended until Xmas.

Why can't your DH claim 80 per cent on furlough and also find a temporary.job through a job agency if necessary? There is still agency work going where I live in West Midlands.

As well as claiming 80 per cent furlough why can't you get another temporary job?

This new lockdown is only for one month. Your dh should be able to work.again soon. Can't you use your credit card for one month. Could you sell stuff on eBay? You must have some stuff you could sell, books you have finished with etc.

I am not judging you but worry for the sake of one month you are risking your future and if there was an accident your DH insurance would be invalidated.

Try talking to the council as they have been given additional funding and my nephew was allowed to defer his council tax payments until the New Year.

Good luck.

I'm already working full time (and then some!) on my business so can't furlough.

The work I'm doing is related to income we had come in back in July. If I stopped working on it we'd have to give full refunds of £5k (which we don't have).

[Lifeisabeach09]

@StatisticalSense

I would hope that this would be a £10,000 fine type of thing as it is essentially a business refusing to shut. You cannot expect customers (who will look at the service provider for advice) to continue to receive a service that is against the law and puts them at risk of being personally fined. He will have to look at either training outside or over zoom as every other personal trainer has done.

Fuck me, really??!!
Talk about kick a dog when it's down!

[NeverForgetYourDreams]

No not sneery and nasty at all. Just honest. I have a family member whose work has all but dried up and earning peanuts and I'm helping where I can. I'm not in a brilliant position myself because although I can carry on working the income has dropped so I can't pay myself properly so that I can pay my staff instead. We've eaten our savings up so they keep a job and pay mortgages. Can't see how I'm nasty .....

[Umbridge34]

@Lostinacloud

Definitely do what you need to.

Also, whilst not 100% guaranteed, if a neighbour was so heartless as to report your DH then fight the fine at magistrate court level. One of my relatives is a magistrate and whenever possible tries to give the benefit of doubt based on the circumstances as far as the law allows. I know for sure that if they’d do their best to overturn any fine given in your circumstances if the law allowed of course.

It isn't about a neighbour being heartless. They don't necessarily know the OPs financial situation and seeing regular visitors to a garage may just think its someone ignoring the law to maintain profit.

[Cherrysherbet]

No judgement from me. My dh is self employed, and he’s had to look after himself., and his family. The government won’t. Luckily he could work for some of the summer, but now this has happened there is no work. The payments we’ve been given won’t pay our bills. Not a good time to own a business. Thank goodness for my supermarket job. Best of luck to you both.

[BunsyGirl]

@StatisticalSense You are pathetic. Many self-employed people pay themselves in this way. There is nothing illegitimate about it. When you are self employed, your income often fluctuates dramatically so paying as dividends allows flexibility to take out amounts that reflect the company’s profits. Furthermore, self-employed people don’t get sick pay or paid holidays. Most of them are not even asking for handouts now.
They just want the right to work and that right has been taken away for so many. Imagine, you spend years building up a business and then, one day, you get told close it down and there’s nothing you can do about it. Think about how you would feel.

[wheresmymojo]

We've sold a lot on eBay already at the beginning of lockdown.

Our problem is that we have high outgoings (£5k per month) because I was a very high earner.

So we had 4 months saved (£20k). We were able to take a 6 month holiday on the mortgage but that is the maximum you can have, the new extension is for people who haven't used up six months yet.

Our other debts/car finance we only had a 3 month holiday on from March - May. They weren't offering 6 months.

We've also had to use some of the money to start up our new businesses (not a lot but some).

I'm clinically vulnerable also so don't really want to work out of the home (added to the fact I'm already working 6 days a week to deliver on the £5k of income we got in July).

[nancy75]

Op, what’s the bounce back loan situation? Is it still open to apply for? Did you get a loan for each business & the max amount?

[wheresmymojo]

@caringcarer

I forgot to add don't be too proud to use a good bank. People donate do others in your position don't go hungry.

Have you family who could help you out with.a loan?

Our village started a 'community cupboard' a couple of weeks ago to get food used that is close to it's best before date. We're planning to use that (it's open to anyone irrespective of income).

I feel weird about using a foodbank as even though we're up shit creek we still earn more than most people who need to use a foodbank so it seems quite wrong to take food from there.

Plus driving up in a 2 year old Mercedes - people would think we're taking the piss (it's on finance, I'd happily give it back but even if we do we still have to pay so there's no point giving it back until they demand it back).

[SunInTheSkyYouKnowHowIFeel]

Did you apply for a business bounce back type loan? Not sure if they are taking new applications but may be something to think about?

Or any family who could help out financially and pay them back later?

[studychick81]

Can't he go to their houses and do it in their garden provided they have access without going through the house.

[2kool4skool]

Does sound like you need to reduce your (very high) monthly outgoings one way or another

[wheresmymojo]

@nancy75

Op, what’s the bounce back loan situation? Is it still open to apply for? Did you get a loan for each business & the max amount?

Yes we did.

DH used his to convert our garage to a 121 personal training facility which opened 2 weeks ago (before that he was pushing online PT but it's so competitive he really couldn't make a lot of traction).

My BBL is in the company account to pay HMRC corporation tax as we drew out a Directors loan to pay towards food, bills, personal tax bill.

Honestly I think we're kind of screwed but Citizens Advice / Step Change may be able to help us keep the wolves from the door.

[userxx]

Can't see how I'm nasty .....

Have a read through your posts.

[Pixxie7]

There are thousands of people in the same boat if everyone broke the rules to pay their bills the lockdown won’t work.

[nancy75]

To be fair the outgoings are not ridiculous during normal times (rent for a 2 bed flat where I live is more than ops mortgage) there is only so much you can cut back.