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Ways to make schools safer without closing them

504 replies

noblegiraffe · 24/10/2020 13:05

Because I am so bored of the misrepresentation and lies going on on this site by people who shout down anyone who raises concerns about the current situation in schools as 'wanting schools to close indefinitely'. The people lacking in imagination who seem to insist that either things carry on as they are (with hundreds of thousands of kids not in school due to the spread in infection), or that schools close and there's nothing in between that can possibly be done to make things safer.

So here's my list, mostly copied from another thread:

We could start with an effective test and trace system, which we were told was essential for the safe re-opening of schools, but we opened without.

We could move onto making sure that all classrooms have windows. And then that those windows open. A national WEAR A VEST campaign to stop parents and kid complaining that it's cold. Germany have just invested a large amount of money in improving ventilation in schools, the UK should follow them.

Masks. Why do the government keep insisting they're not needed in corridors (from the comfort of a socially distanced parliament) and that it's impossible to use them in classrooms when the rest of the world seem to manage? What lessons can we learn from the international experience?

Marquees/covers on the playgrounds so that kids aren't inside for wet break. I know that wet break caused a whole year group to be sent home in a local school as it was uncontrolled indoor close contact.

For it to be mandatory (not simply 'where possible') that classrooms are arranged so that teachers are 2m from the kids when teaching. If smaller class sizes are needed to facilitate this, then solutions must be found even if the government needs to pay money for bigger spaces.

Parents to be supported/sanctioned to avoid kids being sent into school with symptoms or when they're supposed to be isolating.

The government to update its list of symptoms for children requiring a test to include the main ones that children experience, instead of the adult symptoms which they mainly don't.

Regular testing in schools, particularly when there are outbreaks, to enable more effective isolation.

Vulnerable kids to be allowed the option of staying at home. Schooling could be provided by Oak Academy (why spend millions on it and not use it?) and the army of 'catch-up tutors' to provide feedback on work (or ECV teachers also permitted to stay at home)

Any other suggestions?

OP posts:
WhyNotMe40 · 24/10/2020 15:59

Heads need discretion to decide which community spaces and staff they could utilise.
To decide how to spend all the additional Covid emergency funding they should be provided with.
Etc
Not to decide which mitigations are.most effective.... That is a public health issue ffs

OpheliasCrayon · 24/10/2020 16:00

@noblegiraffe

We get each child to wipe the desk with a paper towel and a spray of plague killing spray at the end of each lesson.

I'm really concerned about the use of plague killing spray in poorly ventilated classrooms around children, tbh.

I'm struggling to see what you are happy with or what you would think would be acceptable to be honest!
headstrong27 · 24/10/2020 16:00

@SmileEachDay why? will it make my opinion more relevant?

headstrong27 · 24/10/2020 16:01

I'm struggling to see what you are happy with or what you would think would be acceptable to be honest!

I think @noblegiraffe has to be the one to suggest it 🤷‍♀️

WhyNotMe40 · 24/10/2020 16:02

It's mad because these sort of mitigations should be mandatory and universal! Not a wishy washy oh if you think you need them then go on....

To be honest, unless you are working in school at the not who have no fucking idea what we are currently dealing with.

WhyNotMe40 · 24/10/2020 16:02

At the moment

headstrong27 · 24/10/2020 16:02

@WhyNotMe40 so you want masks worn at all times? I just don't agree with that & Im not sure how it's enforceable as we can't do manage it on public transport etc.

OpheliasCrayon · 24/10/2020 16:04

@headstrong27

I'm struggling to see what you are happy with or what you would think would be acceptable to be honest!

I think @noblegiraffe has to be the one to suggest it 🤷‍♀️

I reckon so.

This has just got a bit ridiculous to be fair.

I don't know what people want us to do. We go to work. We teach kids. We are health and safety experts. We aren't in charge of public health. We teach. We need kids to be in school for their wellbeing and we've done the best we can.

I just kinda want to be left alone to be honest.

WhyNotMe40 · 24/10/2020 16:05

I don't care whether you agree with it or not tbh. Other countries manage it. Yes, masks should be worn whenever possible and by whoever possible. Windows need money spending on them so they actually bloody open. Air purifiers need funding. And class sizes need reducing to stop the atrocious over crowding that is bad enough in non Covid times. No other country puts up with such large classes in such small rooms.

WhyNotMe40 · 24/10/2020 16:06

It can be as enforceable as school uniform is.

SmileEachDay · 24/10/2020 16:06

SmileEachDay why? will it make my opinion more relevant?

I’m just interested in how your experience is informing your suggestions and/or criticism. You don’t have to tell me, obvs!

WhyNotMe40 · 24/10/2020 16:07

I have been saying all of the above since February/March.
I was called paranoid then. I don't mind if people are being over the top but until you have seen the conditions we work in, then I'm sorry but you have no idea.

noblegiraffe · 24/10/2020 16:08

I'm struggling to see what you are happy with or what you would think would be acceptable to be honest!

Did you manage to get to this point of the thread without reading the OP?

OP posts:
lljkk · 24/10/2020 16:08

I wonder how the adults are coping with the cold -- I have a lot of cold hands problems, so feel for those in 10-12 degree rooms all day. I don't think DS is in fingerless gloves yet, but it will come. Neck buffs & wooly hats & coats for all.

DS secondary already has marquees, open windows, open fire doors, masks in corridors (pupils stay in same room most day so don't go in corridors much, anyway), teachers stay behind tape on floor at front of the room. I'm not sure how well the marquees survived the recent storms which took down a lot of ancient oak trees.

herecomesthsun · 24/10/2020 16:08

I have been imagining that we could do things differently. We could too.

bodgeitandscarper · 24/10/2020 16:08

[quote Scarby9]North Yorkshire has not banned its schools from using hand sanitiser.
This tiny school is prioritising soap and water because of one child's allergy: www.grantleyfountains.co.uk/MAP.aspx?pid=SchoolNews_en-GB&aid=nn_290082406_266505616[/quote]
Well my daughter works in a North Yorks school and they have been told it isn't allowed for H&S reasons, all primaries will have received the same information, so yes, it is effectively banned! Hand washng is great, but supervising a class of 30 and the time hand washing takes means it isnt happening.

headstrong27 · 24/10/2020 16:08

Windows need money spending on them so they actually bloody open.

Haven't disagreed with this

Air purifiers need funding.

or this

And class sizes need reducing to stop the atrocious over crowding that is bad enough in non Covid times.

I think smaller classes would be fantastic, I just don't think it will be straightforward to solve that using a portacabin, park or pub.

noblegiraffe · 24/10/2020 16:09

This has just got a bit ridiculous to be fair.

What has?

OP posts:
Sunflowers246 · 24/10/2020 16:09

Don't masks get soggy after an hour of wearing them?

OpheliasCrayon · 24/10/2020 16:10

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

WhyNotMe40 · 24/10/2020 16:10

@lljkk

I wonder how the adults are coping with the cold -- I have a lot of cold hands problems, so feel for those in 10-12 degree rooms all day. I don't think DS is in fingerless gloves yet, but it will come. Neck buffs & wooly hats & coats for all.

DS secondary already has marquees, open windows, open fire doors, masks in corridors (pupils stay in same room most day so don't go in corridors much, anyway), teachers stay behind tape on floor at front of the room. I'm not sure how well the marquees survived the recent storms which took down a lot of ancient oak trees.

Fire doors being left open is against DfE guidance How on earth did they fund the marquees? My school is struggling to fund toilet roll and hand sanitizer. Some TAs are not being replaced even though we desperately need them as we can't afford to.
noblegiraffe · 24/10/2020 16:11

open fire doors

This is against DfE guidance.

OP posts:
headstrong27 · 24/10/2020 16:11

I volunteer in a school, my DB is a deputy head & my best friend is a HOY/HOD. Obvs my dc are in a school which Im also involved with.

TheHoneyBadger · 24/10/2020 16:12

I would take smaller groups over masks any day. I'm asthmatic and have anxiety tendencies and the two merge to make me feel like I can't breath and start sweating and hyperventilating rather quickly in a mask.

Honestly at this point I'd happily accept just being supported in my decision to keep windows open and asking that students wear a school jumper or the plain black jumper that they're allowed to have (blazers are optional, jumpers can be plain etc in recognition of the fact that a) uniform shops were shut at first and b) some people are skint) rather than sit in a short sleeved shirt complaining that it's cold.

That and being given five minutes movement time and enough time to have a wee in the day would be enough for me.

I will even keep pretending it's safe if you let me have two wees and a proper lunchbreak in a day.

My standards have slipped massively can you tell?!

noblegiraffe · 24/10/2020 16:13

But on the whole you seem to have a problem with most things from what I can tell.

So you decided to have a snipe at me instead of closing the thread?

Hope you feel better for that. Enjoy your half term.

OP posts: