Transmission rates of the virus in primary schools??

[Sb2012]

What do you think the transmission rate is like amongst primary school children? When schools reopened I was convinced there would be lots of primary school children off within weeks with the virus, however it seems like it’s secondary schools that have the most cases.
I am in the north east where cases are very high. Both mine go to different primary schools and in my 10 year olds school there have been 2 children (siblings) who have tested positive so far and 3 members of staff. There doesn’t seem to be any evidence to suggest the staff passed on the virus to the 2 students it appears they contracted the virus out of school
My 8 year olds school has had at least 8 cases, but amongst staff only.
Then I have a primary school aged niece and in her school there have been no cases amongst students only 1 staff member.
Our local secondary schools have a lot more positive cases amongst students and there has been evidence of transmission in peer groups too.
What are the primary schools like where you live? Do you think primary school kids are not passing the virus on as fast as older kids?

2 dcs, one at 6th form, 1 at a large 2 form entry primary. 7 pupils and 1 teacher so far in 6th form, oh and 1 in year 11. Non in primary. Also another local primary is currently closed due to teachers testing positive or self isolating, non in the pupils.

I do think it went round ds primary just before lcokdown, few kids (including ds) off week before with coughs. Also 1 grandparent who did pick ups and childcare tested positive and sadly died. Dh had an horrific cough for 6 weeks, to the point he was vomiting. Not a dry cough, but like nothing I have heard before. Obviously no testing so don't know but suspect it was.

I hope the figures continue like this. I could potentially cope and so could dd with 6th formers learning online for a short time, maybe a half term but ds needs to be in school really.

We are in Scotland so went back earlier when it was easier to get tests. At my children’s small village school half of the kids were off with a nasty cold/cough. My son had a temperature with it so we were all tested. Didn’t all book in but test centre asked us to all be tested. All results negative. Lots of other kids in school were tested in the first few weeks and they were all negative. My sons have brothers in their classes who have been tested a few times as their mum is in nhs and negative each time. It’s not hard to get a test here and there is still not much evidence of spread in primary schools.
Living in a small gossipy village we will definitely know if anyone gets it.
Our health board also posts information on all new cases in schools every day. Not names obviously but which class in which school

Nicola Sturgeon has just said on Sophie Ridge (sky) the R rate is higher in Scotland than England because schools and universities went back earlier! Either schools/universities don’t directly or indirectly affect transmission or it does- both can’t be true! Schools/universities need to reduce capacity to allow for proper SD if that means part-time/blended learning/online learning so be it. We are in unprecedented times.

@whatsleep I’m with your theory that kids are getting it with symptoms like headach/fatigue/GI.

In fact Zoe App lists these as majorly symptoms in children, the PHE symptoms rarely show up.

Southampton Uni in conjunction with Local Authority/NHS is doing a pilot study with several local schools. They’re testing each child daily with rapid saliva tests to see if in fact your theory is the case.

Much needed data.

@Oaktree55 that’ll be interesting to read then. I guess like most things covid, we won’t know the full facts about the spread and common symptoms in certain age groups, until the positive test results show who has it.

@CKBJ

Nicola Sturgeon has just said on Sophie Ridge (sky) the R rate is higher in Scotland than England because schools and universities went back earlier! Either schools/universities don’t directly or indirectly affect transmission or it does- both can’t be true! Schools/universities need to reduce capacity to allow for proper SD if that means part-time/blended learning/online learning so be it. We are in unprecedented times.

The R number can be affected by localised outbreaks that don’t reflect what’s happening elsewhere though. Is that maybe what she means?

If they’re not distancing in school then I would hope it’s because they physically can’t. Outside of school they physically can.
The more close contact, the more risk of exposure and transmission, so surely it makes sense to minimise close contact where it is reasonable to?

There is absolutely no social distancing in schools. Not. At. All. Everything is as normal - the children sit beside each other, teachers circulate the class, children pass stationary to each other, share tables, chairs and hand books out to each other. They sit all day in poorly ventilated classrooms with around 30 others.

If the other measures put in place are not working to prevent the spread, perhaps the problem is what is happening in schools.

The other issue is the apparent media blackout on this. We are hearing very little about what is going on. Schools are apparently being told not to contact trace in staff or pupils unless there is an actual outbreak. Nothing is published about school closures - anything you hear is leaked from staff or parents.

Teachers and other school staff are unable to socially distance or protect themselves with any PPE and everyone is being silenced on this issue.

Confirmed outbreaks in education settings

Saying “schools and universities” return caused a spike is somewhat different to say “primary schools caused the spike”. The data (from testing of symptoms and from the ons work referenced) both show the same

• low rates in primary school kids which have not risen
• higher rates as we move to secondary school kids 11-16
• a leap at the 16-24 age group, significantly higher infection rates than any other Agee group in the ons survey.

There are certainly questions re what we do about spread in 16-24 year olds but I have yet to see any evidence from a U.K. source that are primary schools are causing a spike. Not least because the adults impacted by primary school children spread (teachers and parents) will typically be over 24 (given time take to have children or train to be a teacher), if primary school children were the supersoreaders claimed I would expected the biggest group to be adults aged 30 pluse who must be the age group most likely to have contact with these children and as I said the key age group for infections is younger than that.

The evidence just is not there to support the idea of primary school children driving infection levels. I understand that it is counterintuitive that a place without any real social distancing is not a hot bed of infection but, for covid, at primary school level, the data is so far clear that schools are not a significant problem.

One case in DDs old primary, 6 in her school/sixth form (all students) and no news of any in school transmission and loads in the local college, a whole department was sent home as there were numerous cases.

When is data collected because I know whitty etc were referring to data back in June, July at one point when the dc were not even at school!!

The data is collected continuously. The ONS for example tests people weekly and produces a weekly report.

The ONS is doing exactly that. Checking a large number of people regularly regardless of whether they have symptoms. They produce a weekly report that I have linked to. Those tests are not done by parents but by testers that come to the house so should be reasonably accurate. Levels have always been, and remain, low in primary school aged children.

The samples are not done by testers. A healthcare professional visits the property (outside and socially distanced) with instructions but those in the study take their own samples. Parents and carers help those under 12. Probably having a professional on-site increases the chance of you doing it properly, but it's not the same as having a trained professional to carry out the swab. Also, is there information about the number of participants that are primary-aged compared to other ages? I couldn't see it on their website.