It feels like people on MN are willing schools to close

[Marcellemouse]

Lots of threads being really negative about schools reopening. These have been largely started by teachers, the latest one being about a gagging order on the BBC. My 2 and every other DC I know are thriving on schools opening again. DS actually stands a chance of doing well and getting back on track with GCSES. DC are happy and animated again. Their teachers have been fantastic, I'm massively impressed. Friends of mine who are secondary teachers are positive and happy to be back teaching in school instead of home learning. I just get a different vibe in RL than on MN about schools. What's the reality?

Yes, that's what people seem to be too short sighted to see.

If schools remain crowded and covid-19 is spreading in schools (because we're not doing any of the mitigations other countries are doing - in Spain they wear masks from the age of 6, Italy has social distancing, extra teachers and extra space; Germany has excellent test and trace) then I don't know how the NHS won't be overwhelmed.

Overwhelmed NHS = no A&E for your kid that falls down the stairs. It's not just coronavirus which is scary in this situation, it's the lack of medical care for ANY accident or medical emergency.

I'm currently under 55 but by the time last dc is in sixth form I'll be 60 - I doubt I'll the only one! (And dads can be even older obviously)

@notevenat20

Teachers are not willing the schools to close. Teaching at school is easier than a full timetable of online lessons - wfh is boring

How much line online teaching would you have to do? I guess it depends if you are primary or secondary.

I have a full timetable - 27 lessons per week plus two lunchtime clubs. Yes it was all online during lockdown including the clubs.

Secondary.

No school can be covid secure but it is nice to have interaction at school. A number of non-teacher friends are finding WFH increasingly isolating

Dh ecv so yes I worry.

Had an e mail from school this morning to sign permission in the student journal. If they are allowed to make their own way home if school closes

I can see both sides.

The girls have been really happy to be back at school, thr boys though, who are vulnerable and were shielding etc... Feel anxious.

Since starting school we had burst bubbles and alreasy a string of viruses (sore throats colds, etc), so clearly they are still passing lots of bugs to each other and to us.

On balance I hope they stay open but I must admit I do worry for the boys and what would happen if they caught it. A risk I have to live with..

@StaffAssociationRepresentative whilst that is a full on WFH timetable, what lucky students you had during lockdown to get such a structured day of teaching.

I know I'll get told off for this and told to pick it up with the school - which I have - but our experience with DSs secondary home teaching was not as well structured. If it had been, I would have been a lot more relaxed about the prospect of a mix of home and school for this term.

PHE weekly surveillance report. Cases in 10-19 year olds seem to have shot up in recent weeks. It's a complete mystery as to why, though.

@noblegiraffe

PHE weekly surveillance report. Cases in 10-19 year olds seem to have shot up in recent weeks. It's a complete mystery as to why, though.

Could it be the recent change in weather?

Hmmmm.

What do 10-19 year olds have in common..

Nope. Can’t think...

We seem to be doing the hokey cokey at school, students in and out all the time. Had 6 positives so far and each takes out between 15-50 students depending on year group (y11 move around more so have more close contacts). I don't want school to close, but we'll see what happens.

Extraordinary, the lack of response to that graph, given the willingness to dismiss all the others.

noble I can see a downwards trend in the younger children and that does please me as a parent to 2 primary aged children.

Indeed, Time, good news for lower primary.

What about the 10-19 bracket?

noble I am not particularly surprised. Its always been clear that they are at risk of catching and spreading it.

I do think masks should be considered in classrooms, especially in high risk areas.

Has it?? I think you'll find that the vibe on MN in recent months is that they very much can't and anyone suggesting that they might is just lazy.

noble I come to my own conclusions and I am not influenced by MN.

One feeling I have picked up from MN is that primary isn't important and they should be shut to keep high schools open!

I don't know the answer. I do think the kids need to be in school but I also agree that the government have failed both staff and pupils.

I would love for the bubbles to be smaller and for the proper funding to be made available to make things safer.

But then I don't really expect that from this government. The damage they have done to our youngsters even before Corona is culpable.

These kids have a lot less chances that I ever did and it makes me angry.

One feeling I have picked up from MN is that primary isn't important and they should be shut to keep high schools open!

Not seen this at all. Any links?

I mean, what I've seen is the constant assertion that primary schools need to stay open because parents need childcare to go to work.

noble I can't be bothered going digging. And perhaps I am paraphrasing, but its mainly from people who have children in high school. I can understand their frustrations but it doesn't take away from the fact that younger children seem to be lower risk.

I can understand the thoughts about childcare. Its not a problem I would have. But I do also work so whilst I can see to their basic needs whilst I work, the thought of another 6 months home learning terrifies me.

Although there was one 'teacher' who did tell me that my 5 year old could be in a separate room whilst I worked and would be learning online. And that if he couldn't he had behavioural problems.

I suspect that was that persons anxiety preventing them from rational thinking and I am positive that the majority would not think that.

I mean, what I've seen is the constant assertion that primary schools need to stay open because parents need childcare to go to work

This is also the govt position. Tier 3 is senior schools going to 2 week in/2 week out rotas and primary schools still open.

It's the gaslighting by the Government.

It's evident that spread is occurring in schools yet they are hiding this by:

Not updating PHE guidance on symptoms in children (fatigue and headache are main ones). Not having testing available so that children aren't tested and fly under radar.

There was a school in Liverpool that undertook testing of all pupils and uncovered 70 asymptomatic kids infected.

PHE have this week formally acknowledged that Covid is airborne therefore as schools are places of work they should fall under the new legislation which will make infer criminal liability on workplaces which aren't taking into account the airborne nature.

I cannot see how schools can continue to operate much longer under current Guidance it will need to be updated.

For any staff interested there is a lady on Twitter @HildaPalmer who is very up to date on H&S information and worth a follow.

I can understand the thoughts about childcare. Its not a problem I would have. But I do also work so whilst I can see to their basic needs whilst I work, the thought of another 6 months home learning terrifies me.

But this assumes it's school without SD, crammed in, perfect for covid spread, or no school. It's a totally false dichotomy.

Social distancing, small class sizes, masks. This is what works. Most other countries are doing it.

I keep saying and I'll say again - my DD1s school had the whole school back socially distanced in small class sizes for 4 weeks in June/July. They had extra money for extra TAs and used existing spaces creatively to ensure socially distanced small bubbles. Not one kid got sick in 4 weeks (compared to now where at least half the class has been off at one point or another, 3 weeks in).

The fact is, putting money into schools to allow the same protections as in all other workplaces is MORE LIKELY to end up with them staying open. If schools were SD then you'd need LESS money on test and trace because the demand for tests and the children showing the 3 symptoms would be lower. Why not put that money into SD schools instead?

Maybe because they don't want normal kids to be taught in small class sizes like in private schools? They don't want to do away with the big disadvantage state school students face?

The latest data shows that schools are driving transmission - even if we shut everything else down, levels in the community are so high, this would continue to be true. They are the perfect conditions for covid to spread at the moment.

Putting money into schools, using community spaces, we might manage to keep them open.

As they are, sooner or later they'll be shut and how many parents and teachers will lose their lives too?

By the way - the SD school my DD1 had in June was much better than 'normal' state school. The disruptions were less, everyone learned more.

Why has no money been made available to schools when they're considering some ridiculous 'moonshot' (moonshit more like) which is going to make a fat profit for someone but not solve the problem?

If kids in school were SD there would be less need for testing, and fewer people would get sick with covid. We'd be breaking the transmission chains rather than trying to play catch up by identifying where they are weeks after the fact. Surely investing in schools - stopping spread - is the best option? Would save more lives and school experience and education better too.