We have to find a way..

[TheNumbersDontAddUp]

.. To allow those who need or want to shield to do so safely, and with support, and allow those who wish to accept the inherent risk to do so, and continue to work, go out etc because quite simply the economy cannot afford for us to do anything else?

£300 million a month it is mooted that Richie Sunaks new measures will cost.

How can we possibly afford this without irretrievably imploding the entire economy, which will ultimately destroy us all, shielding and non shielding.

I say this as a vulnerable person, at risk.

People seem absolutely determined to convince themselves that getting covid is certain death. It absolutely, definitely is not.

I really don't think anyone thinks that, so stop with the hyperbole.

As it has been explained many times, if we don't take measures to reduce transmission, public services, including the nhs, would get overwhelmed. And this wouldn't just be by the extra vulnerable.

600,000 with long covid in UK according to Tim Spector of Zoe app.

Obviously range of impacts, different lengths of time - but some very serious.

If 12 million people get it this winter (government's reasonable worst case) then we could have a very high number of impacts.

And then I guess we either pay for their healthcare, or we don't...

@Zxyzoey31

Not asking for a Google, asking for statistics and studies. It looks like you have none.

I'm not required to be an educator. If you want to believe it doesn't exist that's up to you, isn't it.

Also, a country’s economy doesn’t run like a household budget. We can build up debt and inflate it away, which should be easier given most other countries will be in a similar position .

Chat on a blog isn't a proper study is it? For things to be meaningful rather than scaremongering there needs to be definitions of what is serious, for how long and specifics about what percentage. As well as comparisons to other viruses.

600,000 with long covid in UK according to Tim Spector of Zoe app.
Suffering from symptoms months after infection (hate the phrase long Covid) definitely seems to be happening all over the world.

However could 600,000 be an overestimation from a biased source?

@SheepandCow

The cheaper way is the island advantage way. Australia and New Zealand realised this.

Instead of six months (probably more like a year) of this very expensive way, we could do two-three months proper lockdown now. WITH closed borders (proper quarantine for essential travel like freight and asylum). Keep borders shut when we ease lockdown.

We could be starting our economic recovery and return to normality by Christmas/the New Year if we did this. Protecting the economy and lives (and avoiding potential long-term Long Covid disability).

I dont know how many times I've read this exact same comment on many threads from this poster.

It’s not chat on a blog. The Covid study in question has been given a government grant and reports its findings to the government. Among other things it reported on long term Covid, following which you’ll have seen Matt Hancock referring to long term Covid in young, healthy sufferers. I believe the estimate was that it occurs in around 10% of Covid cases, if I remember correctly.

You do realise that when we emerged from this 2 month proper lock down there would be fuck all worth coming back out for?

Here's a BBC article about Long Covid. The patient featured is a 22 year old woman (previously healthy). She's not been able to work for six months.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leicestershire-54106073

@Zxyzoey31

Chat on a blog isn't a proper study is it? For things to be meaningful rather than scaremongering there needs to be definitions of what is serious, for how long and specifics about what percentage. As well as comparisons to other viruses.

chat on a blog!

He'll be thrilled with that!

Stray 0 there, the number is 60,000
www.independent.co.uk/news/health/coronavirus-long-covid-symptoms-months-fatigue-breathlessness-b406206.html

Instead of six months (probably more like a year) of this very expensive way, we could do two-three months proper lockdown now. WITH closed borders (proper quarantine for essential travel like freight and asylum). Keep borders shut when we ease lockdown
Qantas are in agreement with the Government over this strategy even though it basically means a minimal amount of flights until at least March 2021.

Does that sound like the sort of approach that UK airlines take?

Hospital staff off work due to Covid outbreak.
<a class="break-all" href="https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-54274789?intlink_from_url=www.bbc.co.uk/news/coronavirus&link_location=live-reporting-story" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-54274789?intlink_from_url=www.bbc.co.uk/news/coronavirus&link_location=live-reporting-story

Imagine if Covid was allowed to run unchecked through the population. Who provides everyday patient care (Covid or non Covid) when the staff are off sick?

[quote EarlGreywithLemon]Stray 0 there, the number is 60,000
www.independent.co.uk/news/health/coronavirus-long-covid-symptoms-months-fatigue-breathlessness-b406206.html[/quote]
Yes sorry, appears I blended the 300,000 total with the 60,000 three months plus?

Sorry not until March 2021, since March 2020.

Sorry, to clarify: 60,000 just in the UK.

@Zxyzoey31

Chat on a blog isn't a proper study is it? For things to be meaningful rather than scaremongering there needs to be definitions of what is serious, for how long and specifics about what percentage. As well as comparisons to other viruses.

Proper studies are being set up/taking place:

Research to evaluate the long-term health and psychosocial effects of COVID-19 is continuing. Major studies include the Post-Hospitalisation COVID-19 study (PHOSP-COVID) in the UK and the International Severe Acute Respiratory and emerging Infection Consortium (ISARIC) global COVID-19 long-term follow-up study.
www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-long-term-health-effects/covid-19-long-term-health-effects

(Links to both studies are on that page.)

Your point still stands though Swan. There will easily be more than 600,000 suffers worldwide.

Lasting symptoms survey - any good @Zxyzoey31

@EarlGreywithLemon

If I was government I'd be freaking out about potential future costs!

@Jrobhatch29
Yes I bang on about it.

Still, I've a lot of catching up to do before I get to the same number of posts we've had asking that we keep The Vulnerable at home and let Covid run unchecked. Nor am I close to reaching the post count of the 'its only old and ill people so who cares brigade. I'll try to catch up.

@GoldenOmber

Nobody can survive without money, an economy. You can't, I can't, unemployed people can't, employed people can't, shielded people can't, non vulnerable people can't.

You might not like that, but it is the bottom line.

So what are we going to do about it?

Suppress the virus as much as we can. It is the best thing for the economy. That’s why countries that have done this are doing better now economically.

The idea that we can somehow protect all the vulnerable and let the virus spread, and at the same time not take a hit to the economy or overwhelm the health service, just isn’t possible. No country has been able to achieve that.

You're totally incorrect about that. Sweden kept schools for under 16s and all businesses open, they allowed up to 50 people to meet at a time and they don't require mask wearing.

They currently have extremely low cases and their economy has shrunk by 9% which is much much less than the average of 20% in the rest of Europe.

@EarlGreywithLemon

Sorry, to clarify: 60,000 just in the UK.

That's just the numbers so far, and just those known about.

@RepeatSwan they should be, but they don’t seem to see further than the end of their noses, frankly.