We were doing ok until we opened all the schools....

[Bbq1]

After lockdown was lifted pre September and pubs, restaurants etc were opened we seemed to have a handle on Covid with cases, hospital admissions and deaths all declining fairly steadily. Since we released millions of school aged children and thousands of teachers etc back into the classroom- boom, cases and consequently deaths, are now growing very rapidly again. It didn't take a rocket scientist to work out that this would happen. I work in a school and I have a 15 year old starting his gcse's so I 100% don't want the schools to close but surely there must be a more workable solution? Couldn't schools be one week, one week off for different bubbles or alternate days? Nobody wants schools to shut but surely in the long term if we don't get something safer in place and just continue sending kids and adults in day after day, then eventually they will close again?

its no i do get it. I get that schools are not covid secure. I get that teachers are scared. I am as angry at the govt as everyone else.

But not once have you answered the perfectly valid questions above.

You are burying your head in the sand not considering the long term impact and how devastating this is for kids.

Being in school may be unsafe for you but being at home long term is not safe for many children.

Do you acknowledge this? Or are you too wrapped up in yourselves to even consider this?

@Timeforanotherusername

Close schools for how long?

When will the vaccine and enough of the vaccine be available to stop school staff from catching Coronavirus?

Will they even manage to have a successful virus in the next few years?

So we shut the schools. Many teachers have pointed out that working parents don't really contribute a lot to the economy.

OK then, so let's just make all the mothers redundant. That will mean they can stay home and look after the kids.

Thats really going to help the children.

Or the mothers that can work from home. I guess they are lucky. They may get to keep their job. But the kids are plonked in front of the TV or playing Fortnite for minimum six months, possibly a year or 2.

Those children that are stuck inside all day, many in extreme poverty.

Their mental health, their physical health all suffering. They become completely and utterly disengaged from learning and have so much sadness about their lives that when they do finally get the chance to return to school it's too late to make an difference.

But yes you want schools to close.

Um... Or fathers?!

Surrey i deliberately said mothers. They would be disproportionately impacted.

What an odd post- so, you think we are fine to keep pubs open but close schools?

Riiiight. Great idea. Kid's education can all go down the pan but people NEED to go and get pissed.

Utter nonsense.

Agreed they would but the assumption that it's mothers that should be main childcare provider is a key reason for that.

surrey yea agreed and for me personally its not the case.

But as said it was deliberate as it needs to be acknowledged although it absolutely shouldn't be the case.

@Timeforanotherusername

its no i do get it. I get that schools are not covid secure. I get that teachers are scared. I am as angry at the govt as everyone else.

But not once have you answered the perfectly valid questions above.

You are burying your head in the sand not considering the long term impact and how devastating this is for kids.

Being in school may be unsafe for you but being at home long term is not safe for many children.

Do you acknowledge this? Or are you too wrapped up in yourselves to even consider this?

Staff in education are well aware at the long term risks with the lack of education. Why do you think teachers are so angry?

They could see the long game and warned about it repeatedly. Some people were in total denial about what could happen/is happening and here we are. Posters like yourself, consistently denying schools were contributing to the spread. This helps no one.

Teachers do not want schools to close, that is a given. I’m not scared working in a school. I’m angry they will be forced to close again because of this government’s incompetence, for all the reasons you stated. You have a glaring misconception tainted by your own clear prejudices and anger.

If anyone is wrapped up in themselves, it’s posters like you who could only consider that schools MUST NOT close for their own reasons. Not stopping to think that with this situation, they will. Denying an issue doesn’t make it go away.

@Timeforanotherusername

surrey yea agreed and for me personally its not the case.

But as said it was deliberate as it needs to be acknowledged although it absolutely shouldn't be the case.

Fair enough. I always try to use the word 'parents' to try to normalise the idea of either parent being in charge of childcare. The assumption that it's mother's job drives me mad. But I definitely do see your point about women being disproportionately affected. It's so wrong.

@Itisasecret agreed. And as a teacher myself who had to teach live lessons while looking after my toddler over lockdown, it's so so much easier to be in. Teachers who are also parents are in the same position as many other working parents if lockdown happens. Nursery closed down and would take key workers' kids. Trying to teach my A Level class over video while my 1 year old was roaming around wanting my attention was far from ideal. I think people often forget that a) teachers do genuinely want what's best for the kids, and b) many of us are parents too and get how hard it is. But that doesn't escape the fact that schools are currently an enormous issue. Staff at my local schools are being decimated. Soon there simply won't be enough in to teach the kids. Then what?!

Where have I denied that schools were contributing to the spread? I think I have said before that it was too early at the time to blame schools. Although I always understood and commented that it would probably change.

And I absolutely refuse to blame only schools which many seem to do.

I have always acknowledged that there would be spread in schools. Although, I think its still too early to tell the impact young children have in spreading the virus. And we still don't really have much data about the clusters in schools which is really not acceptable.

I have got to say, and this is just my thoughts. It really doesn't always come across that people are concerned about the children. Maybe that's just because of the anger at everything else.

I acknowledge that what's going on just now is not sustainable. I don't know what is. But I remember remarking this to a HT a few weeks ago.

Previously I said I did not want my children to wear masks in school. Now I would be prepared for that. Although I don't know how sensible it is for primary aged children. But if it made staff safer then good.
I really don't know what the solution is - but I want the kids to be top priority.

its childcare is not an issue for me. I can look after my children if schools shut.

I don't have prejudices BTW.

Just because i don't agree with you I am prejudice

Show me where I have been prejudiced please as actually I take great offence at that.

We all want the kids to be top priority. But teachers need to be too. The two kind of go together......

Insisting schools must stay open and listing issues with schools closing won't keep them open.

What will keep them open is low cases in the community, effective track and trace, and mitigation measures that will prevent the spread should the virus get into schools.

We haven't got any of those things, and the government spent the summer insisting that anyone who wanted the above was simply 'blocking the re-opening of schools' and campaign groups were shouting loudly that it was simply unthinkable that children might need to go back to school in any way different to completely normal.

People who wanted the above were insulted and smeared and told they were overreacting and lazy.

And now it's becoming obvious why we need those things, but it is too late. The testing system is fucked, the government spent the summer encouraging people into activities that increased cases, and six months have been wasted that could have been spent improving mitigation measures in schools.

And schools are closing. Partly or fully. There's an awful lot of children at home, unable to go to school right now because of this stupid, stupid, head in the sand approach.

@noblegiraffe

Insisting schools must stay open and listing issues with schools closing won't keep them open.

What will keep them open is low cases in the community, effective track and trace, and mitigation measures that will prevent the spread should the virus get into schools.

We haven't got any of those things, and the government spent the summer insisting that anyone who wanted the above was simply 'blocking the re-opening of schools' and campaign groups were shouting loudly that it was simply unthinkable that children might need to go back to school in any way different to completely normal.

People who wanted the above were insulted and smeared and told they were overreacting and lazy.

And now it's becoming obvious why we need those things, but it is too late. The testing system is fucked, the government spent the summer encouraging people into activities that increased cases, and six months have been wasted that could have been spent improving mitigation measures in schools.

And schools are closing. Partly or fully. There's an awful lot of children at home, unable to go to school right now because of this stupid, stupid, head in the sand approach.

👏👏👏

15 people per 100,000 people have COVID in my area (outside London) - so I don't think shutting schools in my area will happen.

I honestly think that people on here are waiting for schools to close so that can say I knew that wouid happen/said all along this would happen' - children who get it just have a little cold!!! Get a grip people!!

@TheEmojiFormerlyKnownAsPrince

We all want the kids to be top priority. But teachers need to be too. The two kind of go together......

Yes and there improvements that can clearly be made there.

Mask wearing for example. Definitely secondary, possibly primary.

Our school, staff where visors, although I am not sure how effective but I guess it does protect if a young child sneezes.

I get annoyed at parents who do not follow the guidelines as they are increasing the danger for staff. We have pretty much stopped socialising and when we do something, we do it as our family group to reduce our chances of catching Covid.

For me the biggest concern I have is that I don't think it will be short term. If schools shut it will be until March at the earliest. Part time would be actually OK for me personally (although I know others, not so much). Learning at home might kill me! But I would make sure they did it. But for how long?

Whilst we go to pubs, whilst we go to cinema, even on holiday yet our kids aren't on school.

That's definitely happening in USA. Everything else seems to be going on as normal apart from school is shut.

All of this debate regarding schools heads straight back to an incompetent government who has no foresight. It wasn’t that long ago Boris was saying all back to normal by November. I don’t think you need much common sense to realise that wasn’t going to be case. Yet again we’ve lost months of time when proper plans could have been put in place.
The more people you mix with the more likely chance Covid will spread FACT. Children don’t spread Covid NOT A FACT. Again even my primary aged DS can conclude classes of normal size and schools of normal size will cause an increase in Covid cases,along with other places children meet eg football practise, gymnastics,cubs etc.

The government should have pulled out all stops to return children to school in classes at least half the size. As a minimum children should have attended 2days a week primary and week in week out for secondary. The new scheme to replace furlough could be used to supplement the income of a parent who is needed at home. This would keep contacts down and more likely keep schools viable.

Alternatively school needs to be a parents ONLY priority. Children attend school as now but all other activities football training,gymnastics, Cubs, etc are stopped. Children don’t mix with others apart from within school. No weekends away,visiting theme parks at the weekend etc (a common theme in my DS class).

It was the government’s job to have looked ahead,plan for different eventualities they’ve failed and continue to lurch from one situation to another.

noble I am angry at the government and your points are valid.

We have spent the last 6 months making sensible decisions and will continue to do so. It annoys and frustrates me when others don't.

There is a difference between higher instances of clusters in schools being reflective of higher levels of community transmission and schools being a driver of transmission. It's the old correlation is not causation argument.

It would be extremely interesting to see where the clusters are located.

I think if we can reduce community levels, school clusters will reduce. I am in a very low level area, we have had almost no disruption to schools at all. I would close pretty much everything else in higher incidence areas first with a view to trying to keep schools fully open.

The new test lab should be opening soon which will hopefully alleviate some of the testing pressure. Testing levels are improving day by day. I don't think widespread closures are inevitable, possible but not inevitable.

@Itisasecret

This, this and this. Anyone that works in education has spent months saying this. If we had the testing and the tracing, schools could have opened with something close to normal provision. People who work in education have been saying on here, it’s a matter or time before schools close. They are a source of outbreak because no one can get tested. No tests, no staff if they have a symptom. Boris lied, we do not have the system in place to open safely.

Last week education settings were behind care homes according to PHE, now they are top. Posters were busy ranting in here that schools MUST stay open, it’s not schools, it’s too early, blah, blah, blah.

The biggest told you so in the world. If only people had been so vocal about getting the government to sort out what they promised. Or had the foresight to listen to others because wishing something doesn’t make it true.

Schools will close by default now, it’s a matter of time. What an absolute shit show.

Couldn’t have said it better myself. All the posters who told me to ‘fuck off’ or ‘bore off’ when I suggested that schools reopening with no mitigations would lead to a second lockdown and school closures.....bet the realisation is hitting them now.

I believe the government will bring in similar measures to France before shutting schools again.

I'm actually not saying I agree with that but I can honestly see it happening.

I honestly would like to believe that we'd close pubs and non essential shops (and gyms and leisure activities!) before schools.
However, without staff, schools just can not safely remain open. That is the reality.

And to everyone, thus is a no brainer. Small cheap tablet everyday may make a difference

news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-vitamin-d-reduces-infection-and-impact-of-covid-19-studies-find-12081132

@Worriedmum999 who said the schools are closing though? Which schools are closing?