Why aren't the government being given more credit for prioritising education?

[annabel85]

The government have risked a lot by putting schools first, selflessly knowing that a second wave would reflect badly on them. This is how it's turning out, but they're still even now fully committed to keeping schools open.

They could have just had blended learning or even carried on demanding tutoring from home for the the winter term, but they've stuck their necks out by getting every child back to school.

Basically, just a reality check for people who are criticising the government at the moment. They've made big mistakes but the kids are their priority and they deserve credit for that.

OP your post is moronic and you deserve all the scorn and derision.

I don't think that's the right way to say you disagree with someone.

Read the excellent post by noblegiraffe if you want to understand why people think that no, the government has not prioritised schools.

I read it and it is long, too long for anyone to bother with a point by point discussion. However, most of the points relate to competence or u-turns and have nothing to do with prioritisation. The OP is talking about the priority the govt has set for schools over other things, such as socialising which is not really the topic of noblegiraffe's lengthy screed.

I agree with you too, OP. In real life, I only seem to meet parents who are delighted their kids are at school and have everything crossed it will stay that way. No sign of the worry and angst that I see on MN!

I am far from a government supporter but do think that their bullish determination that kids would be in proper full time education again from this term onwards is to their credit.

I don't think that's the right way to say you disagree with someone.

I wasn't trying to say "I disagree with you".

However, most of the points relate to competence or u-turns and have nothing to do with prioritisation.

There does seem to be a kind of selective competence in government - the things that are deemed important happen, like the furlough scheme, or the eating out scheme. But they can't manage to get laptops to children who need them or organise the big summer catch up. The U turns tend to come when their lack of interest in education and children becomes a big story, eg free school meals or using CAGs. They wouldn't have bothered with either of these U turns if they hadn't been forced to. So no, I don't think education has been one of their priorities and it goes further than "mere" incompetence when they have to be shamed into relieving child hunger by Marcus Rashford.

@notevenat20 the additional funding that was available in the summer term was only for specific things and schools had to have no money left in the pot at all before they could bid for some of it.

Many schools who applied for laptops for the vulnerable/disadvantaged got 20%, if they were lucky, of the laptops they applied for, and they took months to appear. I am not hopeful for the laptops they are offering for local lockdowns which supposedly will only take 2 days to be delivered.

@ineedaholidaynow Thanks.

It does seem odd to hear teachers say with great passion that there has been no extra money when what they seem to mean is not enough extra money.

Lol

@singingstones

I have no particular interest in defending this, or any government. But I do think that U-turns can be looked at two ways. One is yours which is to see them as a disgrace. The other is to see them as a sign that the govt is listening and can change its mind when given reasonable contrary arguments.

Of course if the U-turn causes organisational chaos then that isn't great.

@notevenat20 many schools are running deficit budgets (not meant to be but they have no choice), so there is no extra money for anything. Schools I work with had to set budgets as if COVID didn't exist, so one thing that was completely slashed was the budget for supply teachers, which obviously is a nightmare if teachers go off sick or need to isolate. Budgets for cleaning will be at the bare minimum and will be set as if no extra cleaning, hand sanitiser etc is needed. Again photocopying budgets slashed, so if the school has to close for a year group/whole school there is no budget for photocopying work packs for students who can't access the technology. Obviously no money to provide technology for students.

Some schools have areas which need substantial repairs, no money for that, so have to block those areas for student access as not fit for purpose/safe. If the area had been available useful for spreading pupils out and not having to cram them into smaller areas.

OP are you in Russia?

@annabel85

The government have risked a lot by putting schools first, selflessly knowing that a second wave would reflect badly on them. This is how it's turning out, but they're still even now fully committed to keeping schools open.

They could have just had blended learning or even carried on demanding tutoring from home for the the winter term, but they've stuck their necks out by getting every child back to school.

Basically, just a reality check for people who are criticising the government at the moment. They've made big mistakes but the kids are their priority and they deserve credit for that.

Because for many, they simply are not because track and trace isn't working and their child isn't getting an education.

They have NOT priortised education. Priortising education means an effective functioning track and trace system is in place.

A worldbeating good one. Not a worldbeatingly shit one.

@ineedaholidaynow

You do make state schools sound like miserable places!

Out of interest, how much would this cost realistically?

Again photocopying budgets slashed, so if the school has to close for a year group/whole school there is no budget for photocopying work packs for students who can't access the technology.

I guess you already have the photocopier so it's the cost of ink and paper. But how many need a photocopied version?

@notevenat20
It's not the U turns that were a disgrace but the government's original positions. This govt will only U turn if it becomes the least worst option for them. Unfortunately, saying "some children will go hungry" is not enough to get them to change their mind, they have to be forced into it with the threat of a PR disaster.

They have NOT priortised education. Priortising education means an effective functioning track and trace system is in place. A worldbeating good one. Not a worldbeatingly shit one.

Why do you, and so many people on MN, say it is shit?

As far as I can tell the latest info on how well it is working is at www.bbc.co.uk/news/54117342 . Why is this shit?

@notevenat20 finances are miserable, schools themselves I would like to think are not!

Money required to get schools up to a suitable standard would run into billions. Schools have been underfunded for years.

Quite a few pupils at our local Primaries during lockdown asked for paper copies of work provided as they could not access technology to either download or print it off at home. That all adds up when the photocopier lease charges you per copy, never mind the paper required etc.

You off up to Durham again, Dom?

Very funny, OP.

@ineedaholidaynow

Can you estimate the number? I am a numbers gal :)

If it's not for interactive work I had just assumed that 95+% of people would at least have a phone or TV then can look at a document online on.

@notevenat20

They have NOT priortised education. Priortising education means an effective functioning track and trace system is in place. A worldbeating good one. Not a worldbeatingly shit one.

Why do you, and so many people on MN, say it is shit?

As far as I can tell the latest info on how well it is working is at www.bbc.co.uk/news/54117342 . Why is this shit?

For track and trace to work you need quick and efficient turn around of testing and results in order to trace everone some wjo tests positive has come into contact with before they then potentially spread it to someone else.

This really needs to be done in 48 hrs max, ideally it needs to be 24.

If people are trying for days to get tests, its not working
If its taking days for results to get back from the lab its not working.

More broadly we don't know how bad a problem is, and whether more restrictions are needed if we are getting people who need tests tested and results back promptly.

Just this afternoon its been reported that 50 positive cases in the worst affect place in the country Bolton have just be added to last weeks figures meaning the rate per 100,000 is considerably higher than they thought and theres the implications of how many contacts of those 50 have been wandering around for a week unaware that they have been exposed and potentially spreading covid unwittingly if they have caught it and are asymptomatic.

Track and trace has to meet demand and testing capacity be sufficient for that demand for track and trace to work to slow transmission. Otherwise the R will be significantly higher than it needs to be to keep case levels stable.

The skyrocketing cases in parts of the country and new hotspots appearing and not being contained are a good indication theres a problem that isnt just about none compliance with the rules.

Seems grouse shooting is their priority.

The landed gentry is their priority.

They only change GCSE predictions when the head of Eton complained that because Eton had changed this year to international iGCSEs this year and had to take "international average" predicted results that they changed the GCSE prediction grades!

So do not be under any illusions that if it's not good for the elite that they give a monkey's!

Why aren't the government being given more credit for prioritising education?

Because they are HOMICIDAL FUCKWITS who do not care one iota about the wellbeing of children/ families/ teachers.

This is about stuffing the kids in schools & stuffing the workers in offices. And they aren't even doing it efficiently.

If they cared about wellbeing we would have an effective track and trace system, one led by Public Health experts and not Did fucking Harding.

If they cared about health and wellbeing of families we would have the measures implemented by other European countries, public buildings used for schools, more TAs to help reduce class sizes, more school buses as in Germany. We have none of that.

Minimal provision for on line learning, no apparent provision for blended learning.

We are in a PANDEMIC. We should NOT be stuffing children in crowded schools!!!

The government get credit for TOTAL FUCKWITTERY

PS OP what happy pills are you on? because they seem very effective!

@notevenat20

The government's re-opening of schools with cases on the rise, severe lack of testing, track and trace a joke, no masks, no temperature checks, no distancing and massive 'bubbles' that never pop because they only send close contacts home anyway is actually bordering on criminal.

I am not sure I agree. Schools had to reopen as they have done throughout the world. The number of cases/deaths was very low at the point they reopened but even if it is much higher they should stay open, as they are in France for example.

The question of masks in schools is really not obvious. If they had said all teachers and children of all ages have to wear masks all day, would you really have been happy with that?

Temperature checks are up to the school aren't they? It's not expensive to buy an infrared temperature reader. Would you have been in favour of checks on all children as they enter school? The alternative is to tell parents to check their children's temperature every day. Again, I think the head could do that if they chose to.

I think provision needed to be made for education but it did not have to involve opening all schools without anything extra being spent on safety, no extra provision for social distancing etc. Look at Italy, look at Denmark. it's possible to do a lot if you really have education and health as priorities in your government.

We don't.

@notevenat20

They have NOT priortised education. Priortising education means an effective functioning track and trace system is in place. A worldbeating good one. Not a worldbeatingly shit one.

Why do you, and so many people on MN, say it is shit?

As far as I can tell the latest info on how well it is working is at www.bbc.co.uk/news/54117342 . Why is this shit?

Have you not noticed that people are having a lot of difficulties getting tests?

Do you not have access to any form of news?

In fact, the system appears to be set up to send people as far away as possible to get tested (e.g. people in Twickenham only get offered tests in Twickenham if they pretend to be from Aberdeen).

Why is THAT? Is that world beatingly good?

Because I would say it is world beatingly shit.

Have you not noticed that people are having a lot of difficulties getting tests?

Is testing following a track and trace notification having the same delays? I honestly don't know.

As I mentioned above, there are now over 200,000 tests carried out every day. This is a large increase but clearly not enough.

I think provision needed to be made for education but it did not have to involve opening all schools without anything extra being spent on safety, no extra provision for social distancing etc. Look at Italy, look at Denmark. it's possible to do a lot if you really have education and health as priorities in your government.

Denmark is a very different case but Italy is not so different. What are they doing for schools there which we aren't doing?