Is it inevitable that schools will see large outbreaks like meat processing plants have?

[Reastie]

Just that really. Logically in the situ and with current measures I can’t see how there won’t be large outbreaks in schools, especially in large secondary schools.

Has anyone looked at nurseries? They aren’t so different to schools?

Secondary schools? Are you sure?

I am concerned when I see situations like the special school in Dundee.

BBClink

I would like the option of keeping ds home, without threats of fines or suggestions to deregister), as he is medically vulnerable with complex needs and has been shielding until now.

I work in food production. We have over 400 staff and have not had an outbreak. There are many, many similar factories across the UK and neither have they... so I don't think schools will either.

Good hygiene, good management and good communication are key here. I have no concerns with sending my DC back.

I work in food production.

What safety measures do you have in place and are these replicated in schools?

@excellentcustard
Did you look at the link on my post just before yours?
A special school full of children with additional needs and many with medical vulnerabilities, having to close.

@noblegiraffe

I work in food production.

What safety measures do you have in place and are these replicated in schools?

Measures that could be replicated in schools? Good personal hygiene, regular handwashing and no outdoor clothing in the area. We teach our new starters how to wash their hands properly and there are spot checks done. Hands are washed hourly, after touching the floor or your face.

Hands are washed hourly, after touching the floor or your face

This can’t be replicated in secondary schools at all.

*Excellent
*
Measures sound good.

Do you think 1500 pupils can all wash their hands for 20 seconds each every hour in school? There is approx 1 sink per 100 pupils.

Do you think they can have no outside clothes? Remember they will wear the same blazer daily to school.

@SymoneT your plan to disrupt every thread with hysterics is not working. I can't work out yet though if you are US4T pretending to be one of these mythical hysterical parents they talk of or just a random troublemaker.

@premiumshoes

Our children are back and early indications are that the spread through high schools is going to be unstoppable. They are not social distancing, not wearing masks so when they are at the shops in their groups at lunch they are not wearing masks, because 'fuck masks'. Our high school is still having them change class every period too.

My eldest has proclaimed he won't be going back after the first week 🙄

My kids are also back and given the current low rates of prevalence and the fact suppression measures are still ongoing in the community I think what while we will get cases in schools it won’t be “unstoppable”. Cases are really low in Scotland and obviously we need to try and keep it that way but if no one in a school has it then they can’t spread it.

Aren’t most of those measures common in food production facilities as general food hygiene measures irrespective of Covid @excellentcustard?

I’m a comprehensive teacher and each year I watch coughs; colds and sickness bugs spread around the school like wildfire.

There is no doubt in my mind, that if a pupil brings Covid into school, it’s going to spread.

We made our school ‘Covid secure’ back in June/July...but there is no way we can continue this, with all learners in. So we can only do our best and remind children about personal hygiene.

Cases will rise, but the good news is that across the world we see cases rising, but hospitalisations not going up as much, so I’m hoping that Covid isn’t as bad as it was back in March...that thought is keeping me positive about returning to school.

I don't understand why the kids don't have to social distance on school buses, but you have to on normal buses.

Has anyone looked at nurseries? They aren’t so different to schools? My daughters been back in two different nurseries since June & neither have had an outbreak. Nor have any of my friends multiple different nurseries across the area I live in. We are in a local lockdown as well, cases are higher here.

In a similar vein, has anyone looked at how Sweeden are doing. A comment I read on a different MN thread which resonated with me was that schools in Sweeden have remained open throughout and despite their infection/death rates being comparable to ours schools haven't closed due to staff becoming ill. Something to bear in mind. I appreciate that their schools are not like many of our old victorian type school buildings but still....

@buttcrackmcheese

I don't understand why the kids don't have to social distance on school buses, but you have to on normal buses.

Because school buses are deemed part of the school estate. Not saying I agree, but that’s the explanation

@Bupkis thanks for that link, I hadn’t seen that. More head in the sand denial here including a poster who thinks nurseries are a similar environment to a secondary school. I honestly despair.

I don't understand why the kids don't have to social distance on school buses, but you have to on normal buses

Because they’re not social distancing at school so what’s the point?

I don't understand why the kids don't have to social distance on school buses, but you have to on normal buses.

Probably because schools don't have the budget to spend on quadruple the amount of school buses that would be required to allow for social distancing and getting all the kids to school on time. Also, there are only so many private bus companies to go around.

@buttcrackmcheese

I don't understand why the kids don't have to social distance on school buses, but you have to on normal buses.

It's for the same reason that people have to social distance in other places of work, but not in schools - basically, anything that would otherwise jeopardise return to school has been jettisoned, regardless of how stupid the resulting "safety" rues become.

@SymoneT

It will spread like wildfire in schools they really must not open

I believe there are large parts of the world ahead of the UK in school openings, which countries have had spread like wildfire? Why has no one told Chris Whitty about this?

@buttcrackmcheese

I don't understand why the kids don't have to social distance on school buses, but you have to on normal buses.

And London Transport has confirmed that during rush hour on busy routes every other bus will be prioritised for school children. Surprise surprise these prioritised buses will not have to adhere to the maximum passenger numbers to ensure SD. So it's fine for school kids to be packed in but not adults?? There's a lot of transport workers unhappy about this as well.

@pennylane83

Has anyone looked at nurseries? They aren’t so different to schools? My daughters been back in two different nurseries since June & neither have had an outbreak. Nor have any of my friends multiple different nurseries across the area I live in. We are in a local lockdown as well, cases are higher here.

In a similar vein, has anyone looked at how Sweeden are doing. A comment I read on a different MN thread which resonated with me was that schools in Sweeden have remained open throughout and despite their infection/death rates being comparable to ours schools haven't closed due to staff becoming ill. Something to bear in mind. I appreciate that their schools are not like many of our old victorian type school buildings but still....

Yes their buildings are better than ours, they wire masks and have average 19 students per class.

You are right - they aren't comparable!

And even in Sweden the oldest students (15-16+) weren't in school.