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If you don't think schools should reopen...

271 replies

TeaInMyStoneCup · 18/08/2020 09:29

...what do you think should happen? Genuine question. I work full time (from home), as does DH (though not at home) and we have a soon to be 5 yo (in Sept). Do you think that we should just carry on as we had to in lockdown when nurseries closed, when we were at breaking point attempting to work and simultaneously look after him? It was shit for us and it was shit for him because I could never give him my full and undivided attention. I'm still catching up with work now and he went back to nursery in June.

I understand concerns but they don't seem proportionate to what we know is the mortality rate for this illness. Genuinely - what do you think should happen? Parents should just home school?

My two sisters and my mother are all teachers and can't wait to get back.

OP posts:
Inkpaperstars · 19/08/2020 13:04

I do think schools should reopen but just wanted to point out that mortality rate is not the only factor causing concern, the long term effects of the illness are another but also in very large part the concern is for exponential growth. Given this is a new virus the exponential growth would see so many ill in such a short time that the health service, education, security, utilities, economy etc would undergo an earthquake. Mortality rate is is many dead when you consider how many would get it, but it is far from the only factor.

Morfin · 19/08/2020 13:31

@Inkpaperstars

I do think schools should reopen but just wanted to point out that mortality rate is not the only factor causing concern, the long term effects of the illness are another but also in very large part the concern is for exponential growth. Given this is a new virus the exponential growth would see so many ill in such a short time that the health service, education, security, utilities, economy etc would undergo an earthquake. Mortality rate is is many dead when you consider how many would get it, but it is far from the only factor.
Completly agree. We all want children back in full time and back to normal but the reality is we can't always get what we want due to the above.
ChavvySexPond · 19/08/2020 15:13

@Sensiblemother

Genuine question to those who want kids in school...... Do you trust politicians?
I think we should be able to trust our government.

But in the absence of that I trust, facts, science and the Precautionary Principle.

inpontypandyallday · 19/08/2020 15:17

Genuine question to those who want kids in school...... Do you trust politicians?

No I don't but I also know that I can't continue to work and have DD at home. It would mean the loss of my career.

latticechaos · 19/08/2020 15:23

@inpontypandyallday

Genuine question to those who want kids in school...... Do you trust politicians?

No I don't but I also know that I can't continue to work and have DD at home. It would mean the loss of my career.

This just made me very sad, that this country is in such a fucked up state that good parents are in this position in the first place.

That is a really grim statement. I am not criticising you @inpontypandyallday just I believe we all deserve a trustable system.

Sassenach85 · 19/08/2020 16:52

@Rainuntilseptember I suppose I didn’t mean wearing a mask is laughable. Suggesting we can wear them when we want to feel safe or in close contact is misleading though. The type of behaviour problems I’m battling in these classes would not be manageable while wearing a mask. For a huge multitude of reasons. So they don’t make me feel safe as it is implied that they could do if you see what I mean lol

Rainuntilseptember · 19/08/2020 19:42

Ok thanks. Behaviour at the moment - what can we do? No detentions etc, can't move seats or stand next to them even really.
I figure if they don't want to learn after months of no change to get into school then hell mend them, there's not much I can do.

lifeafter50 · 19/08/2020 20:05

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Juststopswimming · 19/08/2020 20:14

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Morfin · 19/08/2020 21:32

What a surprise who manged to get deleted

catsarecute · 19/08/2020 23:42

OP, I really feel for you looking after a little one and working from home, and think it must be incredibly stressful. My son is 13 so whilst I did work from home and he did his home education, he didn't really need much input from me, he was really good at getting on with it and I know I had it easy in that way.

I do feel really worried about him going back to school though, especially as I am clinically vulnerable.

These are the things I think should happen, in addition to the existing guidelines:

-temperature checks every day at registration

-threat of fines removed, and parents allowed to keep their children at home full or part-time if they want to and as their circumstances allow (this will reduce risks to all children by lowering numbers, there should be welfare checks on those not attending at all). This all or nothing choice of send them in full time, or completely de-register and home educate is extremely unhelpful.

  • bubbles to either be tested or isolated for 2 weeks when there is one case identified in a bubble (not 2 in a bubble as per current guidelines)*

-clinically vulnerable students to be notified when there is one case in a school

Primary schools and secondary schools to be differentiated and treated differently according to the risks and needs of the children. In secondaries, the setting and bubbles are much bigger, there is evidence that teenagers spread the virus more than primary children, and also secondary children (generally) don't need the level of supervision that primary children need, so it doesn't have such an impact on working parents if schooling is not full time. So for secondaries:

  • secondary schools to permit/encourage masks for staff and pupils
  • secondary schools to look at blended learning models, I think part-time would be a good compromise for secondary age children (apart from those that are vulnerable who should still be offered full time places), meaning that secondary children can social distance more effectively whilst we assess the risks

I would also like to see (but know this is cost dependent) additional cleaning in all schools. And I have seen weekly saliva testing suggested as a possible solution in schools www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-53437555 . If they could do that, it would make me feel a whole lot better.

I really truly do not believe that the current model proposed by the government is safe, I feel very worried about it. And also I think that with the current models as they are, we will have regular outbreaks meaning that classes or whole schools will regularly be sent to self isolate anyway. I think if there are better measures in place for management, we will have a better chance of some consistency and continuity for the children.

Massive thanks to all the teachers and school staff, I know a lot of them are really worried too.

*"If schools have two or more confirmed cases within 14 days, or an overall rise in sickness absence where coronavirus (COVID-19) is suspected, they may have an outbreak, and must continue to work with their local health protection team who will be able to advise if additional action is required. In some cases, health protection teams may recommend that a larger number of other pupils self-isolate at home as a precautionary measure – perhaps the whole site or year group" www.gov.uk/government/publications/actions-for-schools-during-the-coronavirus-outbreak/guidance-for-full-opening-schools

Kitcat122 · 20/08/2020 08:56

It's a difficult one with fines. The problem with allowing parents to choose is some parents would abuse this and just send their children in intermittently as and when it suits. This would make planning and teaching very difficult with children missing days. Also all children are supposed to get the same education which is difficult with some at school and some at home -hence why curriculum was suspended through lockdown. I however definitely think vulnerable families should have an alternative to deregistering.

Morfin · 20/08/2020 09:16

kitkat agreed but equally can you imagine how difficult it is going to be to plan lessons and knowledge gaps when the corona hokey cokey starts. Kids having to self isolate everytime they get a cough/temp, then having to self isolate because someone in their family has a symptom and then waiting for results. Everyone who thinks next term is going to be normal is frankly delusional.

latticechaos · 20/08/2020 09:54

@Kitcat122

It's a difficult one with fines. The problem with allowing parents to choose is some parents would abuse this and just send their children in intermittently as and when it suits. This would make planning and teaching very difficult with children missing days. Also all children are supposed to get the same education which is difficult with some at school and some at home -hence why curriculum was suspended through lockdown. I however definitely think vulnerable families should have an alternative to deregistering.
I don't think it is difficult tbh.

Wales are not fining.

Parents who don't want to send their kids need not to be pushed towards deregistering.

Those who don't want to be in school will just have 'a cough' anyway.

latticechaos · 20/08/2020 09:56

Everyone who thinks next term is going to be normal is frankly delusional.

Agree with this. So much denial. Starting with our PM Boris 'it'll be over by Christmas' Johnson

canigooutyet · 20/08/2020 11:58

I think parents who send in their kids who are ill should be fined.

I've mentioned it on here and in rl. Doesn't seem to be a popular suggestion, often gets overlooked lol. A few people have agreed. A few but parents need to work (yea really).

As for normal. What part of the guidance implies normal? No sharing. Staying in one room. Practical stuff like Science gone. No PE (ds school).

I think those who really believe everything is normal either don't have children or they never talked about the school day, and if they did they clearly weren't paying attention,

First fire drills in September will be very interesting.

I'm also still stuck with a question from teen ds

I go to the shop, I'm there for a couple of minutes and I have to wear a mask because I'm over 11. Yet I will be sitting in a class with 30 other people who are over 11 and we don't need anything. Why? But if we went cinema we'd have to wear a mask and social distance. We could book a table for us all in Nandos and technically sip our drinks through a straw with a mask.

All I have is erm cos the government said so.

Emmememe · 20/08/2020 12:03

“I think parents who send in their kids who are ill should be fined.

I back this.

Emmememe · 20/08/2020 12:04

“ Everyone who thinks next term is going to be normal is frankly delusional.”

Yes.

Morfin · 20/08/2020 12:37

As for normal. What part of the guidance implies normal? No sharing. Staying in one room. Practical stuff like Science gone. No PE (ds school).

Our school are not staying in one room they have to move for GCSE subjects so moving around tiny corridors which were already one way as school was built for less people. Only difference will be no hot food and have to have lunch in one block with rest of the year (260) oh and can only use toilets in year block so despite moving around the school can only wash hands it age group blocks. 10 sinks for 260 people so this bit at least is worse than before.

HipTightOnions · 20/08/2020 12:44

@Morfin

As for normal. What part of the guidance implies normal? No sharing. Staying in one room. Practical stuff like Science gone. No PE (ds school).

Our school are not staying in one room they have to move for GCSE subjects so moving around tiny corridors which were already one way as school was built for less people. Only difference will be no hot food and have to have lunch in one block with rest of the year (260) oh and can only use toilets in year block so despite moving around the school can only wash hands it age group blocks. 10 sinks for 260 people so this bit at least is worse than before.

Same here except...

Years 7/8/9 are also on the move every hour.
No one-way systems.
3 year groups share one set of loos.
(And there’s PE.)

canigooutyet · 20/08/2020 14:56

It's an old large building. No one way system. No money so lunch cannot be staggered more than it usually operates at. No PE because they use off site facilities.

There is nothing the school can do other than provide a bin for masks at the start of the day. Doors open and everyone piles in as normal. To reduce 1500 students moving around en-masse, it's the staff. Classrooms have been set into departments as much as possible to minimise staff travel and also ensure pupils left in classes are monitored during the changeover.

THere's also a murmur that voluntary contribution letters will be going out before the end of September. Assuming they manage to stay open.

When it does get closed down, until there is enough staff to work it won't be reopened. They don't have online teaching, they have the basic IT needed to satisfy Ofsted and the ability to educate students at home was never on their agenda.

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