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Covid

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Should we treat covid like flu now and just get on with life?

562 replies

947EliseChalotte · 30/07/2020 19:48

Is it time to accept covid as another flu and just get on with life and back to normality. The whole point of lockdown was to flatten the curve.

OP posts:
MarshaBradyo · 31/07/2020 22:01

Ha yeh would love a vaccine too

Greater control - ok I can’t think of a sector that I would close that has been opened already to do it. Due to furlough ending and realities of that.

Maybe I’d say no house mixing as they have in North, no economic consequences. That’ll be tough, going backwards, would people even do it?

Masks we’ve just introduced let’s see if it helps.

I’m afraid I can only think in terms of limited resources, what is lost and what is gained. So I could say yeh greater control sure but you’ve got to look at what it means to achieve it.

So now, what would you limit to get greater control?

Quartz2208 · 31/07/2020 22:02

So how would you envisage it working

Spain locked down hard and look where it got them. China has had one day of zero cases and then is it

labyrinthloafer · 31/07/2020 22:09

Currently in the UK:

  • Quarantine is optional
  • Testing is weak
  • Tracing is very weak
  • Isolation is unenforced and unsustainable for family finances
  • Compliance with measures is not high enough
  • Guidance is confusing

We could look at those things.

MarshaBradyo · 31/07/2020 22:15

Ok so not driving back on things already opened etc but improving what we have

Nothing against improving testing etc I hope the rapid one works very soon. And 500k is reached (think it’s target). Would be great to see this in schools

Not sure how much it would be to cover isolation - you’d need a positive test to qualify I assume

Quarantine- how would you enforce it?

Quartz2208 · 31/07/2020 22:15

@labyrinthloafer

yes we totally should be and figuring out a decent plan for getting it under control

But none of the above would come close to eradication

labyrinthloafer · 31/07/2020 22:34

Eradication is not the same as elimination. Eradication is impossible without a vaccine.

How low do you think we could drive it?

Why aren't we trying?

labyrinthloafer · 31/07/2020 22:35

Quarantine in other countries is enforced through random phone calls and visits.

MarshaBradyo · 31/07/2020 22:41

I have nothing against more effective management. Not sure how much impact the list would bring, but worth doing.

In Melbourne quarantine hotel staff caused an outbreak. Now back in lockdown. It’s not easy, even when you throw lots at it.

labyrinthloafer · 31/07/2020 22:49

Not sure how much impact the list would bring, but worth doing

I don't want to have go, another poster used words 'negative and defeatist' and I think the sentence above is negative and defeatist.

This is why I didn't want to post at length about what I would do, and still haven't. Because people just say 'that won't work'.

Doing fuck all won't work.

Zero covid is the only option that makes sense to me, because it has a goal.

MarshaBradyo · 31/07/2020 22:51

Hang on. I disagree. I’m not sure, are you?

You are talking about elimination. In my mind that would take huge shifts to decrease R. But I don’t know for sure as I said.

MarshaBradyo · 31/07/2020 22:52

And I said worth doing not do fuck all.

You are reading it more negatively than you need to.

SengaStrawberry · 31/07/2020 22:53

Scotland is aiming for elimination

Maybe it won’t work or maybe it won’t work longer term but surely it’s better to try?

SheepandCow · 31/07/2020 22:58

Speaking as an English person I hope Scotland has the powers to keep us out. I don't see how they can maintain a zero approach otherwise? Unless strict quarantine and testing for all new arrivals?

labyrinthloafer · 31/07/2020 23:01

Then let's make some huge shifts, is my point.

Because what we have now in England might just go on and on and on, with the economy limping and bleeding, with healthcare half mothballed, with schools open/shut and all the fun stuff missing.

You look at the number of cases you have now, say how can I get that down by x% in X weeks, then keep going. You just try.

labyrinthloafer · 31/07/2020 23:02

@SheepandCow

Speaking as an English person I hope Scotland has the powers to keep us out. I don't see how they can maintain a zero approach otherwise? Unless strict quarantine and testing for all new arrivals?
That is a zero covid approach - the aim is no ne circulating in your home population, small outbreaks all linked to travellers, rapid squashing.
ListeningQuietly · 31/07/2020 23:04

Lots and lots of posters saying what they do not want

few saying what they do

cowards

hopsalong · 31/07/2020 23:09

A difficult question. I have had Covid (confirmed by antibody test) and although I was micro-symptom-spotting at the time (media-fuelled anxiety) it just... wasn't that bad... Not nearly as bad, in my case, as several flus and pneumonia/bronchitis infections in the past. My 60 year old obese uncle (surgeon) also had it... and was... fine, only off work for the minimum amount of time. My brother-in-law had it completely asymptomatically (also had a test through work).

Sometimes it's really hard to go against one's direct sensory perception so, although I understand in principle that it can be a very dangerous illness, I inevitably believe based on my own experience that it's... not.... I wear my mask, etc, but it's with low conviction. My mother just died of cancer and would certainly be still alive for a bit longer if it hadn't been for the pandemic, so this may also fuel my belief that the whole thing has been a healthcare disaster -- wasting all the resources on a generally trivial illness, and failing to treat the obviously serious ones.

My view is that, lacking any good treatments, we might as well focus all healthcare provision on the illnesses we can treat. And, lacking any immediate hope of a vaccine, most people in society (the people for whom it's almost certainly a trivial illness) should just behave as normal, other than wearing masks sometimes, washing their hands more, and being super-scrupulous around the elderly or sick.

SheepandCow · 31/07/2020 23:10

I agree with everything you've been saying on this thread @labyrinthloafer

Also, we've already tried the Just Get on With It approach. In February, and again in June. So here we are with estimated around 65,000 excess deaths, many people facing potentially lifelong complications - and the economy's a mess. It will never get better unless we deal with it. It's like having an operation. Painful initially but necessary to avoid worse pain longer-term.

Unless we have an effective treatment (that prevents long-term damage as much as preventing death), or a vaccine soon.

MarshaBradyo · 31/07/2020 23:11

Ok Sheep what would you close or limit? If you want to see a huge shift towards elimination.

Polkadotties · 31/07/2020 23:11

@hopsalong 👏🏻 Completely agree

SheepandCow · 31/07/2020 23:18

I posted this on another thread:

We need to reduce the risks as much as possible so that we can get back to normal as soon as possible.

We could do that by:

  • protect (through shielding) the most vulnerable to serious illness and death. Our current shielding list is based on out of date information. The CDC has a good updated list of the most vulnerable. It includes people with cardiac disease and type 2 diabetes. Shielding not mandatory (individuals free to take personal risks) but the protection is available if wanted.

-close the borders for two months. Quarantine for returning nationals and emergencies/compassionate entry. Quarantine by coach to selected quarantine hotels (like Australia, NZ, Vietnam, etc).

  • Masks in public including schools. Encourage customisation, like Japan does, to make it 'fun' for children.
  • localised lockdowns if and when needed.
  • Proper track and trace programme, including making more use of the Zoe app.
Bodgedboxdye · 31/07/2020 23:20

No can do, amigo.

My town’s in another lock down. I’d rather them treat it properly so we can come out with no fatalities. ✌🏼

Beautiful3 · 31/07/2020 23:21

Yes.

labyrinthloafer · 31/07/2020 23:23

@MarshaBradyo

Ok Sheep what would you close or limit? If you want to see a huge shift towards elimination.
You could Google the general concept and see all the ideas already out there?
MarshaBradyo · 31/07/2020 23:26

No thanks Labyrinth. Sheep answered very well.

You are being irritating though so I cba with you.

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