School re-opening under threat

[jomartin281271]

Headline in the London Evening Standard today that this new surge could threaten re-opening of schools. I'm not surprised. The government know that it's not safe to open schools under their current guidance. Cramming children, teachers and admin staff into those tiny spaces could cause a catastrophe. I feel sorry for teachers. Most of them are really committed to the job and their lives are being put at risk. Scary times.
www.standard.co.uk/news/health/coronavirus-second-wave-schools-september-a4511516.html

[quote Shitfuckoh]@TrustTheGeneGenie what a horrible response.[/quote]
What to ask a question? Why is that horrible?

*There must be reasonable evidence that the death was caused by an occupational exposure to coronavirus (COVID-19).

I wonder what counts as reasonable evidence..*

I've told my parents to if the worst happens to me it'll need reporting to RIDDOR as a vulnerable member of staff who was not allowed to continue shielding I am going nowhere else to pick it up so it would have to have come from school.

Yes, they are some of the people we are meant to be protecting. They'll be the same grandparents having those children after school & perhaps even weekends whilst the parent(s) work. Despite those children having no protective measures in a non covid safe environment. Not to mention teachers having no protection for themselves or their families - vulnerable or otherwise.

I understand everyone getting up in arms but what happens if schools don’t go back. Millions of parents lose their jobs or can’t work
So teachers should sacrifice themselves in order for parents (complete strangers) to be able to work?

@TrustTheGeneGenie because some of the many thousands who have already died with this virus in our country will have left children without a parent. To respond as you did was dreadful. The be kind thing got old fast eh

That's hardly surprising is it?

I don't know. People keep telling me that children don't transmit this thing, so for them it should be surprising.

This isn’t an either/or situation.

It is tucking shit but there are actually loads of solutions that put fewer people at risk. Some people in this country (and on this thread) just lack the imagination to see and understand them.

FT schools with no fall back is the worst of all worlds for everyone. It would give a few weeks, at best, of normality and snatch it away again. Which I’m sure would be very damaging to everyone’s mental health.

There are loads of options that mitigate risk and support students on a long term manner. Lots have already been outlined on this thread.

I suspect some people know this quite well and are just shit stirring.

Currently the mortality rate of those infected is just under 1% in countries with advanced medical systems, enough ventilators and not too high numbers needing treatment.

Risk of getting it will be considerably higher and viral load high given our working conditions as they stand under current guidance.

I also have 2 health factors that put me at higher risk and am mid 40’s.

I am not a mathematician and can’t tell you which teachers will die but statistically they will.

I know that doesn’t bother some people on here at all but it does me and it will their children, partners, parents, friends and perhaps shockingly to you their students too.

Neither us or our students deserve to be needlessly put at unnecessary risk. We deserve a safer and more intelligent evidence based plan

Trust,

Taking only my age and sex into account, there was around a 1 in 50,000 chance of me dying during the peak of the epidemic (March to end May).

Given that any teachers in school in that period were in a tiny socially-distanced group, I suspect that my chances of death when spending 6 hours a day in the non socially distanced company of 33 children, all of whom breathe towards me might be somewhat higher, especially as I have an underlying condition.

This is what makes me laugh (not really)

You get a thread like this and it’s a fair point the OP made. Not knocking the thread.

Then in the next breath you get people moaning because they’ve chosen to go on holiday and now they have to quarantine and saying how unfair it is.

Before the schools are closed, they need to make sure everyone that enters Britain is quarantined for 2 weeks!

Shit. That has really got to me. I’m not sure I can risk leaving my son orphaned for the sake of a job
This is the crux of the matter. Ultimately teaching is just a job. You can get another job. Your son can’t get another mum. This is the exact reason that I’ve quit teaching. I wonder how many others will quit when the enormity of the risk they’re being asked to take actually hits home.

and the pubs, clubs, bars and restaurants are closed!

I think your being slightly dramatic @PineappleSquosh. ‘Sacrifice themselves’ Jesus it isn’t war. Plenty of people are on the front line (busdrivers, prison workers, police) seeing thousands of people with just masks for protection. I work for the nhs and have worked throughout the pandemic we have many colleagues and friends. Risk is part of life. Actually another cohort of workers going back to work (as everyone else is) with safety measures in place in order to allow the rest of society to continue working and provide for their families is a reasonable ask in my opinion. My brother and sister in law are both secondary teachers and have no issue going back.

If teachers wear masks, my daughter may as well not go to school. She has a mild hearing impairment. Most of the time it doesn't affect her in school, in fact I expect many teachers don't even know she has it. But she cannot understand someone wearing a mask. The muffling just makes it too difficult for her.

@TheHoneyBadger I agree with everything in your last post

Neither us or our students deserve to be needlessly put at unnecessary risk. We deserve a safer and more intelligent evidence based plan Hear hear

And there is no reason NONE this cannot be done.

It needs some money and it needs good planning, now.

The thing that is lacking - the only thing - is the political will to learn from the science and the example of other countries.

Plenty of people are on the front line (busdrivers, prison workers, police) seeing thousands of people with just masks for protection
But you don’t even want teachers to have masks.

@bathsh3ba

The teacher wear clear visors, the kids wear masks.

@Napqueen1234

I think your being slightly dramatic *@PineappleSquosh*. ‘Sacrifice themselves’ Jesus it isn’t war. Plenty of people are on the front line (busdrivers, prison workers, police) seeing thousands of people with just masks for protection. I work for the nhs and have worked throughout the pandemic we have many colleagues and friends. Risk is part of life. Actually another cohort of workers going back to work (as everyone else is) with safety measures in place in order to allow the rest of society to continue working and provide for their families is a reasonable ask in my opinion. My brother and sister in law are both secondary teachers and have no issue going back.

I have to agree with this. I am a primary teacher, I am concerned but dont think I am "sacrificing myself". My partner works in a factory with 7000 people. They had two outbreaks in 2 weeks, despite the use of masks and social distancing in place. Teachers aren't the only workers facing risk.

Actually another cohort of workers going back to work (as everyone else is) with safety measures in place in order to allow the rest of society to continue working and provide for their families is a reasonable ask in my opinion.

Napqueen, could you tell me what you think the safety measures in place in schools are?

I know that there are lots of 'measures' in place 'where possible'. Do they, in practice, improve the actual safety of teachers (and the community of adults around a school, including parents and grandparents) significantly?

with safety measures in place in order to allow the rest of society to continue working and provide for their families is a reasonable ask
That’s the whole point of this thread. Safety measures are NOT being put in place. Basically they want schools to go back full time at full capacity with no masks.

@PineappleSquosh I never said that it wouldn’t bother me at all if teachers wore masks! I also think secondary school age children should wear masks even if just in common areas and between classes.

My brother and sister in law are both secondary teachers and have no issue going back

WELL DONE THEM.

Actually another cohort of workers going back to work (as everyone else is) with safety measures in place

Many teachers and other school staff have already been at work, so there's no need for the going back to work spiel.

As for the safety measures, it's evident that they're mostly to give the illusion that things will be safer.

I also think secondary school age children should wear masks even if just in common areas and between classes.

However, current Government guidance says that students and teachers should remove masks when entering the school buildings and that neither group should wear masks in school.