AIBU? To think that a second wave isn't inevitable just yet?

[Littlemeadow123]

I know that the government/medical experts have been that a 2nd wave will arrive during late autumn/winter. Maybe it will.

But...now they are saying that a second wave will probably happen in the UK in a few weeks, because of holiday makers bringing it back from mainland Europe. Am I being unreasonable to think that if that is such a likely consequence then the government should grow a pair and ground the bloody airlines and stop people going? Like loads of other countries had the bollocks to do at the very beginning.

I know doing this could just be putting off the inevitable, but at least that way, we will only have another wave at the back end of this year (if it comes) instead of having an extra one in August as well.

As yet no vaccine has been created for the previous covid viruses.

It's now speculated or confirmed forget which, that there are 6 different strains of Covid-2019.

Even if a vaccine was to be created, the virus would still be around. Just look at the flu jab, for some they still get flu just milder, and even that one has to be 're-done' because since that was first made, flu has mutated too much and the vaccine has become weak (don't work in this area, always found this stuff fascinating.)

Ripples not waves.

Of course another wave is coming. Just look what's happening globally many are entering or in their second wave, or even third wave.

Had the government implemented things like track and trace months ago, considering it's always been there, maybe this would help.

Why shouldn't people have to isolate when they've travelled outside their usual area? Isolate when ill? Isolating when we have temperatures?

And talking of temperature, how many parents before CV loaded their children with calpol to lower their temp and send their kids to school. Sod grounding airlines, and giving travellers fines. This sending your child in unwell, cv or not, will cause more local issues.

You are practically back to life as 'normal', Brits jetting around Europe

And a lot of people are not. As I said above, we are wearing masks, staying away from confined indoor spaces, washing our hands, working at home, doing our socialising outside. It is not normal at all, even if a few people have gone overseas on holiday.

What is the point of being so worried about dying of this one thing that you’re not actually living

I'm not scared of dying from it. But I am not going looking for it in pvercrowded pubs or gyms either. When it started, I thought it was like flu (as in serious, proper flu which makes you stay in bed). But I am not keen on the stories I am hearing about people suffering after 4 months, unable to climb stairs. I have no wish to catch something that has a considerable impact on my quality of life, so I will do my best to avoid it.

It's not so bad for me as I am anti-social anyway and I am quite happy working at home, exercising and socialising outside and wearing a mask in shops. But I do think more people need to think like me if they want to avoid a second or third peak and if they want our schools to stay open.

That doesn't mean it never will. We are not going to know the exact date.

So what, we live the rest of our lives in fear?

What is the point of being so worried about dying of this one thing that you’re not actually living?

Because most people aren't so selfish that they don't give a toss about others. It's not all about you. I don't care if you get it by being careless and arrogant re the guidance because you don't care about dying, but if you get it, you'll probably pass it on to others, maybe people who have been shielding or following the guidance. It's not fair on those around you, at work, your family & friends, in the shops, etc if you decide to take it upon yourself to not bother with precautions.

@Feelingconfused2020

Yesterday In Spain 2 deaths were reported. The UK had 119. Let's not start blaming Europe.

The only thing with this is

A) if it's all young people at some point Italy transmit to older people and deaths will rise and/or

B) it's because deaths haven't yet risen because it's takes 2-3 weeks from infection to death and in some cases there's months.

Personally I'd prefer to assume there is local outbreaks everywhere rather than a second wave across europe. I'm hoping the actions the government request/suggest in our hotspots and returning from holiday are complied to.

If people don't they aren't only risking their own health but the health and also employment and finances or others they come into contact with.

@AlternativePerspective

I can see the temptation but the fact every nation is taking this very seriously demonstrates just letting the virus circulate unchecked is not a possibility. But there has to be middle ground between closing the world and doing nothing.

Keeping the world in lockdown forever isn’t an option. Doing that is going to have a far greater impact than COVID.

And nowhere have I said that people should just be free to do as they please, that’s why there have to be localised restrictions.

But it’s a balancing act between keeping the virus in check and life continuing.

Saying we are going to have to live with the virus isn’t a suggestion, it’s a fact

There has to come a point when we have a “new normal” way of living, and that involves individuals taking responsibility for themselves within certain boundaries.

I have no intention of catching the virus, I am already in heart failure and needing a transplant, catching COVID would be rather bad news for me. But equally I can take my own precautions without starting to suggest we bring the whole world down.

It’s very easy to sit on the sidelines and suggest the airline industry be shut down indefinitely, or that borders be closed indefinitely, or that travel be stopped. People saying it don’t actually have to live with the implications of it.

Instead people could do something, they could wear masks, they could socially distance. But instead of doing those things they blame the government and suggest steps be put in place which won’t affect them personally.

This isn’t just about the governments of the world, it’s about individuals and their need to take personal responsibility.

We can't just carry on like this.

You can't get the economy open really more than it is, or ask people back to work, unless we get it more under control.

I am personally taking responsibility - but the government has done a shot job on:

Public health
Healthcare generally
Testing
Track and trace
Education

I'm not responsible and no amount of individual responsibility can make up for the failure of government.

It's no coincidence the countries with high functioning government and social models have outperformed the likes of UK, USA and Brazil.

@ShesMadeATwatOfMePam

That doesn't mean it never will. We are not going to know the exact date.

So what, we live the rest of our lives in fear?

I am not living in fear. I am living in a country where the pandemic could be tackled more effectively.

Its a bit early to roll over and give up, imo.

I find it frustrating that people dont listen and keep repeating incorrect info.
There are coronavirus vax apparently for animals so it can be done.
There are lots of different flus including A and B. So when the jab doesnt work it can be that it didnt include the one you got.

Whether people still die after vax is made depends on
The anti vaxxers
How many people cant have the vax
Other countries vax or immunity
Whether it sterilise or if you are still contagious
How well it works for the elderly.
How long vax immunity lasts.
Could request antone entering country has a vax.

YANBU, the government needs to stop being wishy washy.
However; people may have booked these holidays more than a year ago, or definitely before covid hit. If there was a way for people to cancel without losing money, I'm sure a lot would. But the insurance companies don't want to pay it.

Anyone with kids isnt being allowed to take personal responsibility. You are left with the risk of say people going to nightclubs, on planes, refusing to wear masks, pub crawls.

@Keepdistance

Anyone with kids isnt being allowed to take personal responsibility. You are left with the risk of say people going to nightclubs, on planes, refusing to wear masks, pub crawls.

⬆️ this X 1000

Use your common sense - unless you've got kids then get fined if you don't want to put them in a 250 person germ pond, sorry, I mean bubble

Also kw children will be back bubbled up with all rhe other kids. It is unclear if there were kw child outbreaks as there was no testing kids till about jun. So when it did start the positives and outbreaks increased weekly. And in fact do we even know how many kids did test positive as we only have the outbreak so 2+ not the numbers? Actually one of the dashboards did say i think.

@Littlemeadow123

I still don’t think see why your obsessing about foreign travel rather than all travel even through the UK. To travel top to bottom by car is easy 10/12 hours by car with how many stops ? Therefore spreading area to area. People saying stay at home this year the weather is amazing - you obviously don’t realise the regional differences in weather and that sunshine and good weather is actually good for people so obviously they will seek it out !

The UK press have a lot to answer for with the hysterical reporting day to day. I’ve actually had to stop reading a lot as one says one thing another something totally different.

Reality is once the genie is out the bottle we have to live with it, how we as people feel we can. Covid is here and will not be away for a long time to come. If you don’t want to travel, don’t but if others do or need to for whatever reason then that’s up to them. It’s not illegal it’s their choice.

My partner has had to travel and stay in hotels lately as part of his job. Does this increase my risk, yes but ultimately if he doesn’t do that then he will lose his job. He may even have to travel internationally but that’s life and it can’t stop completely.

[quote Star81]@Littlemeadow123

I still don’t think see why your obsessing about foreign travel rather than all travel even through the UK. To travel top to bottom by car is easy 10/12 hours by car with how many stops ? Therefore spreading area to area. People saying stay at home this year the weather is amazing - you obviously don’t realise the regional differences in weather and that sunshine and good weather is actually good for people so obviously they will seek it out !

The UK press have a lot to answer for with the hysterical reporting day to day. I’ve actually had to stop reading a lot as one says one thing another something totally different.

Reality is once the genie is out the bottle we have to live with it, how we as people feel we can. Covid is here and will not be away for a long time to come. If you don’t want to travel, don’t but if others do or need to for whatever reason then that’s up to them. It’s not illegal it’s their choice.

My partner has had to travel and stay in hotels lately as part of his job. Does this increase my risk, yes but ultimately if he doesn’t do that then he will lose his job. He may even have to travel internationally but that’s life and it can’t stop completely.[/quote]
They now think covid didn't come to the UK with one or even a few infected people but via about 1300 separate 'seeding' events, i.e. infected people returning to the UK (lots from Italy and Spain).

Sure covid can be spread around within the UK, but a single infected UK resident can only be in one place at a time. Yes it would be bad for someone infected from Telford to pass it on to people in Norfolk when on holiday, but that person would likely be passing it on to further people in Telford if they didn't go on holiday anyway. The net increase in cases is still going to be fewer that way than if lots of uninfected people leave the UK and come back infected, creating whole new seeding events.

This I thought was interesting reading about CV in animals and vaccines.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7284272/

@Star81

@eeeyoresmiles

That is my point exactly.

This.

@eeeyoresmiles

They now think covid didn't come to the UK with one or even a few infected people but via about 1300 separate 'seeding' events, i.e. infected people returning to the UK (lots from Italy and Spain).

Sure covid can be spread around within the UK, but a single infected UK resident can only be in one place at a time. Yes it would be bad for someone infected from Telford to pass it on to people in Norfolk when on holiday, but that person would likely be passing it on to further people in Telford if they didn't go on holiday anyway. The net increase in cases is still going to be fewer that way than if lots of uninfected people leave the UK and come back infected, creating whole new seeding events.

The number of daily cases has been rising for a couple of weeks. It was 1000 a day, then went down to as low as 400 odd at the point restrictions were lifted. Now we are on an average of about 700 a day. They finally mentioned it today on the news. I think this is the result of the BLM riots in London and various other places, and also shops starting to open and town centres becoming busy again.

@Orchidsindoors Also pubs/restaurants, indoor environments being so much worse plus the fact drunk people don't distance.

The government lifted too many restrictions too quickly.

And talking of temperature, how many parents before CV loaded their children with calpol to lower their temp and send their kids to school. Sod grounding airlines, and giving travellers fines. This sending your child in unwell, cv or not, will cause more local issues.

Exactly right.
Also in all my working life this is the first time I've ever known employers to actively discourage you from going in if you're ill.
Pre covid it was all about sick records and interviews/warnings. What a difference a few months makes.

@Littlemeadow123 So Govt unlocks too quickly, before accessing previous relaxation measures & UK has a higher Cv infection rate than almost all of Europe...... but its Travelers fault for any 2nd wave?

Recently had a child go the school straight after a swab test. These parents exist.

Selfish parents who want shot of their kids.