How the hell are parents meant to work?

[worzelsnurzel123]

With this latest blow from schools and yet further delays, I predict employers will cease to be “ fair” and they will run out of the patience BJ vaguely muttered about hoping they’d have. So what are the options?

1. Resign from jobs? This could have massive impact on income, likely to affect women and the future of women’s’ rights and progress in the workplace, creation of mental health issues and socio economic problems
2. Will some parents be pushed in to feeling the have no choice but to leave kids home alone? Esp those who are borderline age group eg 8-12. Not ideal at all. Clearly this will impact on MH, safety, parental work performance.
3. Leave kids with grandparents who are likely to be over 70 in many cases, shielding or vulnerable. Risks of passing the virus on would lead to guilt , worry on both sides.
4. Wait for everything to fuck up work wise, scrabble for child care here there and everywhere, lose employers good will due to time off needed and eventually get dismissed for poor attendance, breach of conduct and or poor performance

This is a disgrace. An absolute disgrace

@HeyBlaby and a major cause of the gender pay gap is...

@Notonthestairs already extensively covered earlier in the thread

‘NEU have proposed various things which might offer solutions such as:
establish regular testing of children and staff - tests are now available for everyone,
availability of appropriate PPE - you and the rest of the country
enhanced levels of cleaning don't really see why cleaning staff can't work a weekend or a late evening to do a deep clean
Special plans for education of children who are in vulnerable health categories, or who are living with people in vulnerable health categories, not to be in attendance at school or college? this is a separate issue to the opening up of schools to all other children
evidence concerning the groups of people who are most vulnerable to death or life-changing consequences as a result of the virus, for example the evidence of the impact on those who live in crowded accommodation, those with different comorbidities, those from different ethnic groups and of different ages and sexes so expects conclusions from indepth studies that scientists spend years working on - lets just put the nation on hold indefinatly then shall we
extensive testing, contact tracing and quarantine in society as a whole? in place - not the goverments (or our childrens) fault that society is being difficult on the issue and refusing to cooperate when contacted
Money to be given so that schools can hire out additional space, including marquees, portacabins and rental of local spaces. *Holding the government to ransom to up the education budget - using our children as pawns is not acceptable, there is a time and a place for point scoring.
Money for hiring of additional support staff again holding the government to ransom and using our children to point score
Money for additional supply teachers as above’

I'm not sure private schools will open to many more pupils, if any. My daughters are in Y6 and Y7 at a private school. My Y6 daughter has gone back, along with Reception and Y1. They were only in 2 classes of 13 anyway but they've been split into 4 groups now and so are taking up 4 classrooms rather than 2. So Y5 can't come back as they have no classroom. Reception have a big enough space so they are ok. Y1 again are taking up Y1 and Y2 classrooms. So I can't see how any more than one more year group could come back while the bubble rules remain.

As for Y7, the Senior School is a very old building with small classrooms and windy corridors. The girls are taught in small groups of 10 or so but move around the school to different teachers and are streamed for each subject so not always in the same class. I can't see how that would work in September either if the rules are still the same.

I'm getting increasingly angry now with the fact that seemingly everything else in the country can open up except schools. I live not far from Bristol - it's ok apparently for thousands of people to descend on Bristol and knock a statue into the harbour but it's not ok for a class of 30 students to get together. It's crazy.

My Y6 was desperate to get back and is now much happier. They are doing their best to give them versions of all their end of year rites of passage.

My Y7 is quite happy at home but I'm dreadfully worried about the friendships she was just starting to build. We live in a village so she doesn't see her schoolfriends around.

And this is with me able to work from home pretty much indefinitely (as stressful as that is). It must be so much worse for others.

So what is the story with September anyone know??

I'm not giving up my job - end of.

Do I need to try to find 3 full time spaces with a childminder now (£100 a day 5 days a week)

because guess what Boris

not everyone has a nanny on call

and these things take time and money to arrange.

May not be very easy to find 3 spaces plus finance to afford £2000k of childcare a month I hadn't budgeted for will need to found/loaned

@fia101

So what is the story with September anyone know??

I'm not giving up my job - end of.

Do I need to try to find 3 full time spaces with a childminder now (£100 a day 5 days a week)

because guess what Boris

not everyone has a nanny on call

and these things take time and money to arrange.

May not be very easy to find 3 spaces plus finance to afford £2000k of childcare a month I hadn't budgeted for will need to found/loaned

This is kind of what I'm working on. I'm sort of assuming Ds will be in 2 days a week and I'll have to find childcare for the other 3. It's going to cost us more than ft nursery costs us now because we won't get any funded hours.

That the leaves us with the task of catching up on work at the weekend. So none of us get any "days off" ever.

It's really not good enough.

I also heard some comment from a politician about how now Covid regs are being relaxed and we can mix with a limited number of other households we can share childcare

Well if we're all working or some are shielding or you have no support then how does that work.

Again re. Childcare and kids a crass and ill thought out 'solution'.

Nokidding
You misunderstood me. They have been very poor leaders and seem to have not taken any responsibility and have let the 'science' guide them, but I also feel they have just watched public behaviour and made decisions based on that; when people started taking their kids out of schools, they closed schools, when people panicked about not being able to work, they can up with the furlough scheme, when people started to venture out more and there was the issue with DC's inventive eye test, they relaxed restrictions. I just feel that they haven't really made any decisions themselves, just very reactive to what they are seeing in the general public.

The good news is, if people express their anger at this they might do something about that too, but it's like they are so out of touch with the general public and their experience of this, they don't forsee any issues with their plans until we start shouting about it.

I am absolutely furious about this.

When I have ten minutes off being furious then I start to despair about how this government is going to permanently fuck the country with disaster capitalism through Brexit.

Please email the Childrens Commissioner. I have had a substantive and meaningful response. She wants to hear from as many parents as possible.

@spacepocket. That reads as if you reject absolutely the idea of additional funding for schools to pay for additional staff, portacabins, marquees, village halls, wash stations etc and cleaners should not be paid more for increased services (or perhaps you feel that they don't need to do any additional cleaning? I'm not sure.)

@loulouljh

Please email the Childrens Commissioner. I have had a substantive and meaningful response. She wants to hear from as many parents as possible.

Hi Lou which address can we use

[email protected]

You get an automatic reply saying it will take 3 weeks or something like that to get a response...but I emailed on Monday and received a reply today...

That reads as if you reject absolutely the idea of additional funding for schools to pay for additional staff, portacabins, marquees, village halls, wash stations etc and cleaners should not be paid more for increased services (or perhaps you feel that they don't need to do any additional cleaning? I'm not sure.)

These things should absolutely be done, however, they are not imperative to the return of our children. Our children can still return on a phased basis in line with the gradual of easing of restrictions making more and more children able to return. Exactly the same as what the rest of Europe is doing. Schools don't want to do this because it is an absolute faff for them to have to keep changing the parameters/re-arrainging the furniture/adapting what they are teaching every couple of weeks because admittedly, it is more difficult here than Europe due to the larger class sizes in general and inadequately old bulidings. The unions are obstructing the phased reopening and using this situation as leverage to garner more money from the government (which the education system rightfully deserves) but by doing so are throwing our children and their educational rights under the bus to make this political point. The unions can keep on campaigning for what our schools/children need at the same time as providing an education.

Then the Government will need to relax restrictions (1m rule etc). Under current guidelines they've left it to LA's and SLT to apply.
To my mind you can't provide confusing and changing messaging, insist on restrictions AND not fund elements which would alleviate them.
The unions are a handy cover for poor leadership.

(or perhaps you feel that they don't need to do any additional cleaning? I'm not sure.)
And in line with every other workforce and worker in the UK EVERYONE has a responsibility to pay greater attention to infection control and hygiene measures. It’s not just the cleaners job. We’ve all had to adapt and incorporate new working practices and part of that is infection control. Teachers are no different and many, many of them recognise that. But they’re being told not to. By guess who?

Deep cleans between rotas or bubbles of children will need to be done by professional cleaners to standards set by the government. We should be willing to pay for that extra cleaning in my view.

I'd imagine most teachers are quite aware of the need to practise good hygiene but I don't expect them to get a mop out - in the same way I wouldnt deep clean an office but I would wipe down a phone/keyboard/light switch.

@Wondergirl100

I'm a journalist (someone was asking if anyone on here is a journalist) and I work at a high profile newspaper. I think it's vital to talk about the impact this is having on working families..but..

The problem is that it's difficult to tell this sort of story -

it's one of those stories that falls between the cracks a bit as not quite news because it's just people's everyday lives...

Would we be saying - thousands of working parents suffer - are people losing their jobs? Are women resigning or taking unpaid leave?

need to know the actual impact. Also, is there a measurable impact on kids?

My own children have suffered hugely - but again, it doesn't make 'news' unless there are standout statistics.

I have been very very angry at how kids have been ignored during lockdown and this is yet another example of family issues not being considered important.

#invisiblewomen

The Public Health Agency has a wide list of resources, policies and guidance for the management of infection control.
The term ‘deep cleaning’ suggests that there is some complex, mysterious process to be followed. There isn’t. Even in healthcare settings, reusable items should be cleaned with normal detergents and chlorine based cleaners.
If we have to wait for government standards to be set to keep our schools aa clean and infection free as we possibly can then I despair.

@Mrhodgeymaheg

Nokidding You misunderstood me. They have been very poor leaders and seem to have not taken any responsibility and have let the 'science' guide them, but I also feel they have just watched public behaviour and made decisions based on that; when people started taking their kids out of schools, they closed schools, when people panicked about not being able to work, they can up with the furlough scheme, when people started to venture out more and there was the issue with DC's inventive eye test, they relaxed restrictions. I just feel that they haven't really made any decisions themselves, just very reactive to what they are seeing in the general public.

The good news is, if people express their anger at this they might do something about that too, but it's like they are so out of touch with the general public and their experience of this, they don't forsee any issues with their plans until we start shouting about it.

If they had let science guide them from the beginning the UK wouldnt be in this mess..

[quote MrsAmaretto]**@mumsnet - where are you?????!!!!! This is the biggest threat to working women who have children. It's destroying our mental wellbeing, our career prospects, our ability to feed our children. Are you lobbying MPs MSPs and the Welsh Assembly? What are you doing about the fact that we have to work and somehow look after our children at the same time?

I've fucking had it today. Life is shit and it's going to get shitter and no one is helping. [/quote]
I'm not saying this is @mumsnet 's battle to fight, BUT I remember when it was all fields around here and MPs used to come onto MN to court female voters and explore policy. MN had - has? - enormous influence. I do think if there is a hill to die on then this is one we could really really do with seeing MN take a firm campaigning stance on.

I appreciate not every MN member has the same opinion on this, but i should thinkn we are all agreed that we need a CLEAR and well thought through PLAN. WHat conditions will need to be met for wider school opening> Is the preference for blended/rota learning? Is there going to be any investment in pop-up classrooms/deep clearning routines etc? Is the preference for more online teaching - in which case where are the missing laptops, will there be investment in Ok Academy etc? What about using more final year trainee teachers/parent volunteers etc? There is a big dialogue here that needs to happen, but parents NEED A PLAN

Surely the Tories are all about thinking people are better off in work? Doesn't fucking seem like it.

Dont be soft. The tories have always been about survival of the fittest. A quick google brings up plenty of articles from 2013 onwards which outline their many policies which highlight this mentality.
They have always worked in favour of the rich (which is traditionally their purpose - protecting the aristocracy). The rich (top 5% which hold the majority of the UKs wealth) are less likely to struggle due to being allowed to "cut corners" (Cummings et al style), or have use of live in nannies, private schools with very effective education delivery or a LOT of flexibility with working hours. They are also much more likely to be in a financial position were furlough still gives them a ridiculously amount of money, and even when it ends they would be able to stay financially comfortable for quite a while. The tories have never cared what happens to the average Joe (apart from near election times..). Why do you think they employ smeer campaigns and win by making the opposition look worse, rather then making themselves look good.

Frankly they (the government not schools) are royally screwing working parents and schools over. If the government actually funded schools and had any clue about what was needed by the general public we wouldnt have this problem nor years of underfunding in schools and NHS. Education provision has been struggling for quite a long time, by no fault of individual schools themselves. And this is really the straw that broke the camels back. It's sad but if the government funded and made sure schools were a priority then we wouldnt have need of "militant" unions to fight for or pick up the slack. Instead the gov is doing what it does best, using the papers to crucify schools and unions to take the blame away from themselves, when in fact schools are responding to LA who are responding to government guidelines.. but the gov dont want the general public to be aware of this as then people may start questioning them, so instead they pass the buck, knowing most people wont care to educate themselves past the obvious propaganda. (Threads like this really show how well the Gov know to manipulate the public, due to the amount of mistruths and misinformation that is spread, no matter how many times people give links to cold hard facts, it comes down to well the paper/social media/propaganda say otherwise)

What is imperative to children returning to school is either more buildings and staff or a change in guidelines. Both of these things are the government’s responsibility

www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-52992226

It's like people have their head in the sand mentality. Lots of noise about locking down and lives were more important not economy or anything else. Well what did you thin would happen that you would come out of this with no sacrifice or changes?

Some will have lost their jobs, if yours is you might have to pay more for childcare than you would have then thats what you will have to do. There is going into this and coming out unscathed. As we have been told this is a new normal. If you didnt want that then you shouldn't haven given up your normal in the first place.

@LittleFoxKit

i think what the comment about tories wanting people in work was more getting at, was the fact that theyve made it exceptionally hard to claim benefits, and when you do they're not enough to live off, encouraging people to work.

Except now they're stopping us from working by closing schools,

though i suspect there will be many people like me, who, wouldnt be entitled to fuck all anyway, because dp works and earns too much to be eligible for UC, but not enough to pay the bills.