Why are people not outraged by the testing scandal?

[Justagame]

Given that testing is part of one of the five standards that need to be met to justify easing restrictions, we have to be confident that it is as the government report it to be, surely?

The Prime Minster said in his announcement, "hundreds of thousands of people are being tested every day".

Statisticians do not believe the government have ever met the target, even once.

On May 10th for example, 37 000 people were tested. The government reported that their target of 100 000 tests were met on 10th May.

They're also counting postal tests, and won't confirm if they then count them twice when they receive them back.

They're also including antibody tests in their daily figure, despite not being a diagnostic test.

The daily figure is incorrect on many dubious levels.

Is it not very simply, fraud? Are people just unaware of this or is it a level of denial because we all want things to be safer and getting back to normal?

*The source for the stats quoted is 'More or less' on radio four:

www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m000j2r7

[Chloemol]

I don’t care we are at least doing more testing now.

[Humphriescushion]

mobile.twitter.com/10downingstreet/status/1246710511053475840?lang=en

Thought this was the case. As i said if they just said they were increasing as fast as possible and would get there i would have had more confidence.

[Justagame]

Cendrillion, I'm quoting what the Prime Minster said.

[justanotherneighinparadise]

Isn’t there a huge facility that was being built in Milton Keynes but hadn’t been finished that could have handled much of the test analysis? My understanding is even if we ramped up testing to a level you were satisfied with we don’t have the labs and technicians to be able to turn the results round quickly. Hence why loads were sent off to America.

So I feel it’s more complicated than being irate about one thing. Covid-19 happened very quickly and we didn’t have 1) a reliable test 2) a massive quantity of a reliable test 3) the facilities to give the results of a massive number of the reliable tests.

So what the fuck is the point in getting irate when most people are currently bloody exhausted. We are all hoping that as time goes on there will be the ability to buy an inexpensive test regularly and have its results quickly. Then we stand a chance of this shit show calming down.

[ravenmum]

OP is asking why people are not more irate about the lies - not about the number of tests.

[justanotherneighinparadise]

Because it’s politics. They all lie! Every single one of the slippery bastards.

[BillywilliamV]

Simply cant be arsed!

[ravenmum]

justanotherneighinparadise - agree; that is probably a major reason why people are not more irate.

[Justagame]

We have to have confidence in the reporting of these figures. It undermines public trust and obstructs the study of this pandemic and could lead to poor decision making.

[Justagame]

I think it comes down to the fact that it's ok to miss a target, even to admit it's not possible yet to get that testing capacity. But, it can not be ok to lie about it. We're not accepting that are we, surely?

[chomalungma]

The issue with setting a target is that the target itself becomes the focus instead of the clinical need.

Goodhart's Law.

So now they are trying to hit the target, instead of trying to ensure that the tests are done for the people who actually need them.

Oh - and yes, some people are tested more than once.
Tests are counted when they get sent out.
Antibody tests will count as well.

I wonder if they are focussed on getting the test numbers to over 100,000 or if they are focussed on getting the tests to people who need them and making the optimum use of the testing capacity.

[WiseUpJanetWeiss]

I think it comes down to the fact that it's ok to miss a target, even to admit it's not possible yet to get that testing capacity. But, it can not be ok to lie about it. We're not accepting that are we, surely?

It seems that people like to be lied to. Can’t fathom it myself.

[CendrillonSings]

Department of Health and Social Care
@DHSCgovuk
As of 9am 16 May, there have been 2,489,563 tests, with 136,486 tests on 15 May.

Scandalous, I’m sure.

[chomalungma]

Well - they have tested 78,537 people and had 3451 positive - so 1 in 20 positive...

I hope they are testing people who need to be tested, rather than just testing people for the sake of hitting a target.

They seem to have ramped up the Pillar 4 testing. Curiously, none of the people tested under Pillar 4 seem to be positive. Out of 31,347 tests

www.gov.uk/guidance/coronavirus-covid-19-information-for-the-public

[EducatingArti]

I am massively concerned about this for two reasons.
Firstly as you say, it seems like government are putting soon on this ( or worse) to avoid criticism when really they need to be learning from their mistakes.
Secondly, and more importantly to me, having a robust test, track and trace system is absolutely key to coming out of lockdown safely. People are getting so hyped up a out whether schools should or be taking back more students or not but in my opinion, getting this right, and getting this right before we move to relax things further is absolutely crucial m

[EducatingArti]

Putting spin on this

[TabbyMumz]

People dont understand that tests only work if done between days 1 to 5 of symptoms, and work best between days 1 to 3. So if people arent feeling well enough to go for the test, they wont go. Also you will be amazed how many people dont drive or have a car and you need a car to get to the test, you cant walk or get public transport to it. Also initially it was just people in the nhs, in hospital, or key workers. So this is why there hasnt been a big take up in numbers. Since they rolled it out online and more people could go, numbers have increased. So I dont see testing as being a massive failure.

[EducatingArti]

It is still nowhere near enough testing to run a robust test and trace program which is needed coming out of lockdown.
The fact that people who don't drive are finding it hard to access a test is part of the reason I don't think it is effective enough yet.

[cakeisalwaystheanswer]

The number of people being tested has only increased since private labs got involved. Previously PHE were insisting that all samples were sent to their central labs and they just couldn't get the system working. When this is over there are going to be some big changes in the way the NHS is organised.
In Germany the system is much more region based, this makes them smaller more flexible and also being much easier to compare to other regions makes them focus on being efficient and effective. They also don't have a horror of using private expertise.

[pontypridd]

CendrillonSings works for the government.

[LastTrainEast]

Justagame you just said there were 126 064 tests on a particular day. I'll take your word for that, but while that is strictly speaking not 'hundreds of thousands' it is more than a hundred thousand and the actual numbers are available since you are quoting them. if you are quoting them then they are not being kept secret.

"They're also including antibody tests in their daily figure, despite not being a diagnostic test" Again they told you this? You didn't send agents into the offices to smuggle out the data?

So...what was the problem again? Oh yes you don't like the government.

[LastTrainEast]

I can't see the real use of these tests anyway since you can be infected the next day. I expect it will help statisticians and that is something, but some people talk like they make people safe somehow.

[Nameofchanges]

There are no at home tests currently available, so if you don’t have a car you can’t get tested.

[Bathroom12345]

I have checked the government website a few times to see what availability there is. Always tests in England but not postal ones. Nearby to us as well. Maybe there isn’t the demand?

[Dontknowhowtohelp1]

I am angry OP - or rather I feel helpless in a horrible way.

And as others have said, it is test, track and trace that will help us get out of lockdown, but I don’t think the government has the ability or will to do this properly. I have no faith in them at all.